abadv8

Crap... my proportioning valve was a complete no-go. What are you other drum to disc converts running with?

Strick1

Was there any modifications needed to be done to put the 4th gen HVAC system in? And, why did you go with the 4th gen clutch and brake pedals? Did they just bolt into place? So many questions

abadv8

Yep... the firewall needed extensive modifications. I also had to rebuild the wiper tray to mate with the fresh air intake of the 4th gen HVAC box. The whole process took probably 12 working hours (a lot of that time spent deliberating).

I went with the 4th gen pedals because I had them and the 3rd gen was an auto car. I thought that other had difficulty with fitting these pedals or trying to use the 3rg gen pedals with the 4th gen slave. But, with the exception of the uppermost bolt hole, they fit perfectly.

I'm still hung up on this proportioning valve thing. The one that I bought did not fit the factory lines, at all. The thread callout was correct, but the ports were not machined deeply enough into the new valve. So, I couldn't get the the lines to thread in.

Does anyone have a P/N for an OE style, 4 wheel disc, prop. valve? I'm a little lost on this one.

abadv8

Would this proportioning valve work?

GM Disc/Disc Prop. Valve

abadv8

I haven't done a photographic update in a few days. So, here is the status after today's efforts...

Started with the old LS1 intake. I stripped it down and cleaned it up.



This was all so I could try to bring it back to black with trim paint. I've done this on other engine parts with success, so I'm hoping this one works out. It should flatten out a bit when it dries.



And this is the engine sitting in its final home (for real this time).



The 4th gen booster and clutch reservoir.



This shows the clearance that I get with the 4th gen HVAC box. I'm hoping it's enough to clear the headers...



Hey, it has a shifter now! (disregard the mess)



I'm having delusions of mounting the ECM under the hood in the stock, 4th gen location. I know it seems to be less than desirable, but I'm not sure what else to do with this space.



That's it for now. Tomorrow, I plan to put in some more time. I'm done speculating about what I should be able to get done, but tomorrow should be rather productive. I'll update with progress in the evening.

Strick1

You are moving along very nicely. I take it that the intake doesn't get very hot.

abadv8

They get warm, but not hot. The polymer intakes are a poor conductor of heat, so you aren't absorbing the heat from the heads like you would with a metallic intake. In addition, you aren't running the coolant through the intake and out of an intake mounted water neck. So, the only thing you really have to worry about is heat soak. But even then, it's still not "hot".

The trim black dried. I'm pretty happy with the results. It took on that "factory fresh" look again. I tried to capture how it really looks with and without flash.






Time to go put this thing back together...

abadv8

Plugged away at it for a bit, but the weather is too nice now. I have to take the scooter out.

Most everything is just snapping back into place (with the exception of originally having the fuel rail on backwards).



This was my idea for locating the ECM. I'd probably trim the bracket so that if fit a bit neater, but this is the general idea. What do you think?

Strick1

Is the wiring harness going to fit the new location of the ecm? Your engine bay looks really nice.

abadv8

Thanks!

Yeah, the harness should fit just fine. That is the stock(ish) mounting location for the 4th gen. So, the ECM connectors are right there already.

I think most people extend the harness a few feet (18 inches?) so that they can mount the ECM in the passenger compartment for a cleaner look. I have a problem there... I really don't have anyplace convenient behind the dash to put it. I was thinking about this when I was swapping the HVAC.

Personally, as long as the ECM is cleaned up, I don't mind it in the engine bay.

What's everyone else's take?

Strick1

In the Corvette world, the ECM can be cleaned up and polished to really look okay. My Caprice has the ECM on the driver's side up front. It uses the air intake for cooling. Have you thought about your harnesses? After making your engine bay so look so nice, are you planning anything to make the harnesses look fresher? I lost a trophy at a Corvette car show for worn looking harnesses and I tend to look at them more now.

abadv8

I'm thinking about just taking the chalky oxides off the ECM and slapping it in there. Maybe something like lacquer thinner and a stainless steel brush to clean it up. I'm not sure exactly how I'm going to clean it up. But, After looking at yesterday afternoon, I am definitely going to mount it where I've shown it.

With respect to the harness, I've been wiping it down as I go. So, I haven't wiped down the part that's hanging over the windshield yet. Basically, I'm just wiping it with solvent. The stuff on top of the engine turned out alright.

When I look at the harness, I really want to pull the split loom off of it and use braided sleeve to recover it. But, that's a whole project in and of itself (I actually got sidetracked thinking about coil relocation yesterday, and had to refocus on the task at hand).

Phase one is to get the swap done, running, and driving. Phase two will come next winter. I'd like to pull it back into the garage and slap a larger displacement engine in it... maybe an LS6? Who knows for sure. The first order of business is to get this thing running and driving.

vjgillespie

Car is looking good. The 4th gen hvac box give you much trouble? Looks exactly the way I did mine, lots of work but worth it. The heat and a/c work great. Keep the updates coming.

abadv8

The biggest problem with the HVAC was that I wanted to retain the fresh air intake. So, I wound up doing a lot of fabrication to get the cowl/wiper tray to fit the HVAC box. I remember taking pictures, so I'll try to find those.

Got most of the engine bay harness in this afternoon. I'm getting a little burnt out on pulling wires, so I'm taking a break.

Quick question concerning headers; am I going to have to lift the motor out to put the headers in?

25th327RS

iTrader: (2)

When I did the swap, I put the headers in with the engine lifted a few inches off the mounts. But, when I pulled it out, I was able to remove the headers with engine and trans bolted in the car relatively easy. Drivers side slid out through the bottom, the passenger side barely slipped out the top with starter and coils/oil cap removed. Your passenger side may be different from my experience, since I have a stock ac delete box, and you having updated to the 4th gen parts.

If they come out that way, one can only imagine they can go back the same way.

abadv8

Got back to it and did a little more fitting. The engine bay is filling up pretty fast. I'd like to get the harness set into place, then I can figure how best to clean it up. I'm also not real sure how satisfied I am with the A/C lines. The filter/drier I can't do much with. However, I may cut and extend the liquid line so that it isn't a straight shot from the condenser to the evaporator.


The first shot is the overview. This is how it's looking right now (there are some hose routings that I'm not super excited about)...



Next up is the bulkhead fitting. The 2000 fitting is a little smaller than the hole in the firewall. I am planning to seal it from the inside...



Last on tonight's show and tell list is the electrical center and cruise control module (buried underneath the fuse and relay box). This might have to be adjusted a bit, as I was planning to run the air filter in that location...



I was/am going for a look that appears "stock/OEM", so I'm ok with the wiring. There are a few leads that I'll be trimming off, and I'll try to orient harnesses so that they look halfway aesthetically pleasing. I will also thoroughly clean the split loom up after I'm done fitting it in place.


On the list for next week is ordering up the correct proportioning valve, ordering the exhaust parts (my headers should ship sometime this week), and continuing work on the interior.

Chuck!

Everything looks great so far. Are you going to use the stock single fan? Trying to figure that out in my RS swap.

abadv8

Thanks!

No, I'm going to fit the dual fan from the 2000. I have the wires and controls for a dual fan, so why not? I'll have to trim the upper support/cover to allow the fans to fit. But, they mount right on the radiator. So, it should be easy(ish).

abadv8

I'm trying to put my exhaust system together, and have a pretty noobish question (after all these years of working on cars)...

What's a good high flow catalytic? I've always just yanked them or gutted them. But, with an electric cutout ahead of it, it might be kind of nice to have one for the highway (and the po-po).

However, I have almost no experience with cats, so any advice would be great.

Strick1

I know there are 2 kinds of substrate (the innards) one is ceramic and the other is S/S I think. The 2 companies I plan on choosing between are Random Technology and Pypes. In SC we don't need Cats as we don't even have inspections. But I do like the cleaner idea if it doesn't get in my way.

abadv8

I found a line on an alternative to the Hawks SS longtube headers. However, I'm kind of in the dark at the moment about their status. So, presently, I've got three options:

1) Drop $700+ on a set of SS longtubes (1.625" primaries)
+ Gets me a set of long tubes
+ Can build a y-pipe and merge that I could sell at a later date
- Will probably only be used for one season
- Expensive

2) Drop $400 on a set of Hooker cast iron LS Swap manifolds
+ Get a set of clean looking, ceramic coated manifolds
+ May be able to seel the setup at a later date (at a substantial loss)
- Build a stainless y-pipe and merge that will only fit the Hooker setup
- Still relatively expensive

3) Spend $50 to recondition the OEM LS1 manifolds and run those
+ Already have them on hand (work could start tonight)
+ Minimal investment
- Hideous...
- Build a y-pipe and merge that fits OE LS/F-body manifolds (probably mild steel)

I'd like to start work on a front mount turbo next winter. But, in reality this system could remain on the car for more than just this season. I'm at a bit of a cross road, and I'm not quite sure how to proceed. Just looking for thoughts...

25th327RS

iTrader: (2)

Streetdemon documented the husler mid lengths in his build thread. Husler also makes longtubes, but with a funky collector design. There is a new set for 650 in the classified I think. Far as I know, nobody has actually fit a set to a car, might be great....? Who knows. I have also heard of some folks using BBC headers, and cuttings he flanges off, and welding ls style flanges on, and sendin them out to be coated. I know none of these are perfect options either, just rambling and tossing out ideas.

abadv8

Exhaust shouldn't cause this much duress...

Looks like someone else is already planning to buy the Huslers. To be honest, they're not my cup of tea, and it sounds like the buyer is working pretty hard to make the deal work out. So, I don't want to interfere with that.

At this point, I'm kind of leaning toward modding the stock manifolds and running with them. If the long tubes are ever available from the source that claims to have them, I'll buy a set. I'm just having a really hard time swallowing the price tag on the Hawk's pieces.

Does anyone know if the stock LS1 manifolds are high nickel content? Can you MIG weld on them/to them?

25th327RS

iTrader: (2)

I gave my 99 ls1 manis to a friend for a swap into a older Malibu. He cut the EGR stuff off and welded in plates to smooth the look of the manifolds out. He said they welded fine with a standard MIG setup.

abadv8

Looks like my headers will ship on Monday (fingers crossed). So, in the interim, I'm going to shift gears and get to work on the brake conversion and interior.

I dropped my control arms off this morning to see if the local shop could press the old bushings out for me. I also had a conversation this morning about having my rotors turned down into hubs for the LS1 brake conversion. So, I'll be cutting the disks off my old rotors tonight and taking everything in tomorrow for machining.

Then I'm away Friday and Saturday, and fly out Sunday. I fly back on Tuesday, so work can resume.

We're getting there...

Oh, and if anyone is running the OEM 17 x 8.5 & 18 x 9.5 Corvette wheels, Discount Tire Direct has a pretty good sale on Cooper Zeon RS3-S tires. They're $544 shipped (after rebates) for a matching set through Monday. I'll be ordering those up today.

abadv8

I ordered what I hope is the correct proportioning valve. Also ordered are the 4 new Cooper tires.

Does anyone know, off the top of their head, what the offset difference is for an LS1 brake conversion running 17 x 8.5 Vette wheels with a 1" drop (coil cut)? Does that take a 1.5 or 2.0 inch spacer?

I suppose I could:

1) Put the control arms and struts in
2) Leave the springs out
3) Mount the wheels
4) Use a jack to set the "ride height"
5) Check the location
6) Order the spacers

Just figured someone else has already done this...

Thanks!

abadv8

I ordered up some 5 x 4.75" x 1.75" wheel spacers for the front. Seems that most are running 2.00" with Y2K Corvette wheel on stock spindles and hubs. The LS brake swap should move the mounting face about 0.300" outboard, so that should put me right about where everyone else is running.

My proportioning valve should be delivered this afternoon. Unfortunately, I have prior obligations tonight, so I don't see much getting done on the car until Tuesday night. I might try to steal a few minutes this afternoon to check the fit of the new valve though. ..

NemeSS-TyranT

iTrader: (1)

there didnt look like there was anything wrong with the.ls1 z28

abadv8

There was plenty wrong with the 2000. The more I disassembled, the more problems I found. But, I think the worst thing about the 2000 was that it looked like a Chrysler Sebring, and drove like my old 2001 300M. It's in a better place now, my '89.

Just got confirmation that my 1-3/4 primary, 3 inch collector headers will be here on Wednesday. That's just in time for me to get home and get to work.

ransam

iTrader: (2)

Wich hedders did you end up going with?

abadv8

I bought a set from Racing Innovation & Supply out of Kansas City, MO. They should be here tomorrow. I'll get some pictures of them, as the website is kind of lacking. But, a set of stainless, 1.75" primary, 3" collector headers for $295.00 shipped is worth the gamble (I can buy a lot of stainless filler rod and argon for the ~$400 difference between those and the SW headers).

I'm not expecting superb quality, but could be really surprised. If there is rework required, or fitment issues, I will document it.

Strick1

It's Wed. Let us know what you think of the headers. Did they list LT1 headers too?

ransam

iTrader: (2)

Ive been to there website and havnt found them listed can you put up a link or something. I emailed them months ago but they didn't know when they would get more in and I deleted the email.

abadv8

Persistent... ???

As promised...

The headers showed up in a box with one of the seams split open and newspaper hanging out.





Inside was more... shredded paper.





Inside the box of shredded newspaper, the headers were wrapped in bubble wrap.





My initial impression was, well, impressed.





A closer inspection showed the welds to be "decent". Looks like they did a lot of buffing to clean up most of the heat tint from welding.





The exterior welds on the flanges look alright, with a minimal amount of weld porosity. A spatter ball indicates impurities. Still not too bad.





Continued...

25th327RS

iTrader: (2)

Can we see a pic of the flange, tube area from the "inside"....pretty much the last pic looking from the backside?

abadv8

Continued from previous post.


The O2 bung showed the same porosity. This is common with improperly prepared weld joints.





The inside of the merge tells a whole different story... You can see a lot of smooth filler metal deposits, definitely MIG work. Not the cleanest of edges inside either.





The welds on the inside of the flange ports were at least cleaned up.





A few of the welds on the outside of the collectors showed quite a bit of heat tint. Again, normal with stainless welding. It looks like they might have used pulsed MIG though.





Notice the grime from the raw material. I'd guess they welded it up prior to cleaning it.





Continued... fitment...

abadv8

Relax. I'm not done yet.

abadv8

The fitment on the driver's side was fantastic. It dropped right in with the coil packs and plugs still installed. (Disregard the brake line mess, and note that I didn't put the steering shaft in yet).





Lots of room...





Wish I could say the same for the passneger side. The tube from the #2 cylinder makes solid contact with the inside of the frame rail.





Good news though, the collectors sit in the right spots.





And it doesn't look like the ground clearance will be too horrible either.





In closing, I think that I can pull the passenger side header into place by pulling toward the transmission, using the transmission. It should be relatively easy to rig something up. I would be happy with 3/8" - 1/2" clearance on the frame rail. Otherwise, they look good. For less than $300 shipped, I don't think you can beat it. Sure, they aren't aerospace quality, but neither is the rest of the car. I could probably clean up the inside of the collectors a little, but, they are 1-3/4" primaries on a stock LS1. So, how much would I gain there?

All things considered, I feel that these are an absolute bargain for the price.

abadv8

Here's where to find them. Tell Tony that that annoying Sean guy from Wisconsin sent you.

Racing Innovation & Supply 82 - 92 LS Swap Headers

25th327RS

iTrader: (2)

The ground clearance looks good, the passenger side frame rail interference seems to be very similar to what is sometimes found with the hawks/ssw pieces. Looks like they may be hard to beat for the money.

abadv8

I know, right? $300, shipped, for a set of stainless headers? How can you beat that? Some mild steel sets are going for that price.

So, for the inference issue, are people just pulling them back into position? I don't mean that the collector hits, I mean the primary (in case I was unclear ealier).

STREETDEMON

thanks for documenting these, the company is in lansing, about 45 minutes away from me. i've been meaning to stop by and see how much work is done in house.

i checked on these earlier tonight, and i also noticed in your link they show 1 5/8" for the primary size...a couple of months ago when i looked they had them as 1 3/4"....did you measure your tubes?

25th327RS

iTrader: (2)

The hawks one are the collector, didnt see you said the tube hit the frame. Not sure what to do there. Lansing is only 1.5 hours from me, just apparently the wrong lansing

abadv8

I suppose I could pull them off, take the passenger header into work, and put it on the press? I know that stainless pulls a lot when you weld it, so I'm really not too worried about it.

I was able to install them. So, although there is interference, it isn't severe. I think that just throwing a ratchet strap around the merge and the transmission would probably give me enough leverage to suck them in a bit and remedy the situation.

Strick1

Great write up. Too bad they don't make headers for my LT1 swap. BTW, Can't you notch the frame a little? I'd be hesitant to pull on those headers. Why not call Tony and let him know that they hit your frame? He might have a fix for you.

abadv8

Yep. I'm in contact already. I sent him the link to thread, and he asked for further details. I'm pretty impressed with his after sales service. As usual, I will update the thread with the solution.

abadv8

Hmmm... Interesting. I just double checked my order, and it definitely says 1-3/4". I can throw my calipers on them tonight. Refresh my memory, are primaries listed with the ID or OD measurement?

25th327RS

iTrader: (2)

OD

abadv8

In that case, I'm almost certain they are 1.75". I'll verify that tonight.

ransam

iTrader: (2)

Thanks for the link