I love my third gen. Did a lot of research into what it'd take for my TPI to make 400+hp. Any way I looked at it the LS swap made way more sense than rebuilding/modifying the TPI. So, that decision was made.
New dilemma....I have done a lot of research on these forums and it looks like I will have $10-12,000 in a good LS swap with a new LS1 from Scoggin Dickey or similar. I add 3k for suspension upgrades, 3k for brake upgrades, 2k interior (because it is old and 4th gen seats are more comfortable), 3k for misc stuff (exhaust, parts I haven't thought of, etc... and I am at $22k.
That got me thinking...why not just buy a 2002 z28 with 70k miles for about $10k.
Are my costs in line? Am I being stupid for putting $22k into my third gen when I can buy a 4th gen ready to go with the same performance for half that?
Just looking for some opinions on why the LS swap is or isn't worth it at these costs.....

 

I think it is more about loving and having a third gen that can out-perform a fourthgen. Keeping the Third gen breed alive.

 

There are so many ways to cut down and save money on LS swaps. Buy used parts and look for a motor/tranny in junkyards and on other forums. Can get some big steals on parts if you search hard enough

 

If it's about building your dream car, then do what you want. I've never done it, but from what I have read on this board, it is possible to do an LS swap for a lot less, but your point about costs is still valid.

If I were in your shoes, and the 4th gen cars appealed to me, I would just buy one and be done with it. I prefer the third gens, and frankly, I would only buy a 4th gen as a parts donor.

 

buy a 4th, a lot less hassles. better car as well.

 

This sums it up pretty well. Are you willing to put up with the wait and work?
You end up with a car WORTH having. Still a little rough on the edges, but something rare and special. Over the years, I have had too many 355s and then a 383 in my car. They never made the car better. The LS1 does.

 

I guess that is a good question. Is the LS swap worth the wait and the work? I have never had or driven a 3rd gen with an LS swap. I do think the thrid gens look better, but in the end, after $22k, would I have as good of a car as a 4th gen?

 

22k spent the right way would absolutely destroy a stock 4th gen in all areas

 

Just depends on what you like more, I like both but prefer thirdgens. I like the appearance of the thirdgen cars better than the 4th gens and thirdgens are lighter. You can get a low mileage LS1 out of a wrecked 4thgen for a lot less than a new one, that will save you a ton of money. Plus you will have all the accessories and small stuff if you get a complete pull out. The small stuff can really add up if you are trying to piece together your engine and accessories. If you like the appearance of the 4thgen cars as well or better than thirdgens its a lot less hassle to just buy one of them though.

 

I'm in your EXACT situation. I drove down to the dealership and looked at an 2002 WS6 T56 Trans am. It had like 50,000 miles and was loaded with about every option. After looking at it for over an hour I decided I didn't want a 4th gen. He wanted way more than I could afford, but it was the perfect car to go and look at.

Some of my friends think im an idiot for not buying it, however I like my thirdgen, and would rather build it, then buy something else.

But it still seems tempting to just buy an LS1 4th gen and call it a day. Thats so much easier. Therefore I'm still torn between the two.

 

20k will get u in a early c5 now and even a early ctsv
Imo if u love the 3rd gen its an easy choice to swap in the ls.
In my own experience. I was torn between a c6 or a 3rd gen swap.
I alredy own and have owned a bunch of 4th gens.
C6, i knew i was gonna do at least h/c/i bolt ons. maybe n20
I decided on 3rd gen, cuz i luv em and im ginna leave my hardtop camaro ss alone.
The hp king will b the 3rd gen. Big ls motor, big rowdy cam, big supercharger, th400.
Gonna build it to grab air and then some.
Plus it will be cheaper for me, since wint have a note on a c6.
I can drop more coin on the 3rd gen. Most of the hi hp car community write off 3rd gens. Like there nothing, true that theres alot of weak and lame junky 3rd gens out there.
But when there built right, they stand out.
Its either really quick and fast bmf or just another turd gen.
Gotts to decide which u want to be

 

Perfectly said flip! I have 394 rear wheel HP on my ls1 swap, that's atleast 450 at the crank. Granted, its not a brand new engine, but everything is right and and looks new, for way less than half of the 22k you've budgeted. Even with brake and suspension upgrades, included as budget for a ls swap, 15 would even be reasonable.

 

If you research your project in used parts, sometimes you can buy an entire car with all that you want for next to nothin, This would make for an inexpensive ls1 swap. brakes susp interior engine combo, only takes one hit hard in the back or side, No need to buy new when used is just as good and much cheaper, I would do the ls1 swap, just my opinion.

 

It is tempting to buy the 4th gen and save all the work, but, I gotta admit, I like my third gen better. It's rough around the edges, doesn't have t tops, steering wheel contrils, cupholders, etc.... Icant figure out why I like it better but I do. The only reason I'm torn is because a 4th gen is 1/2 the money.
This discussion is starting to help me make up my mind though.

 

What mods did you do to get 394 rwhp?

 

That's true, the thirdgen is a barebones car with out many/any ammenties like newer cars. But it doesn't take much to change that.

I found a thirdgen that is near identical to what I want my car to be. Looks and performance wise.
Z28FAST1 's car



His build thread
http://ls1tech.com/forums/conversion...rey-paint.html
I kid you not, I think writing this reply after looking through that build thead made my final decision to keep my 91z28.

EDIT: I forgot to add, you can build a 5.3 LSX for much cheaper. This is most likely the route I will take.

 

Stock ls1 shortblock from a 99 T/A with LS2 heads, torquerV2 cam with appropriate springs, retainers, and pushrods. Longtube headers and nice exhaust with a ls6 intake(stock intake for 01-up ls1s). That's all it took.....

I did all the work myself, minus the dyno tune, and completed my swap for around 6,500-7,000. I did buy a whole donor car for my swap, and I was lucky enough to sell the 4th gen roller, and my old drivetrain (carbed 383- t56) for a total of 5,550 bucks.

 

3rd gen will out handle a 4th gen.......so if your doing suspension mods, it's better money spent on the third gen.

i've owned my car for 14 years and my swap was money well spent.....the first time i destroyed an unknowing corvette was priceless.

 

third gens will out handle and are on average 5 to 600 lbs lighter than 4th gens

and you can do it for half that price I am doing a LS3 into a chevelle this weekend and total cash is at around 6 k and thats heads cam holley hp efi headers ect

 

lq4 block you can get for around 3 to 500 (just the block) LS3 heads will run you 1000 brand new assembled from sdpc intake 400 accy another 750 ecu (I like holleys) 1400 to 1500 (holley is self tuning with a wideband but does not control a trans unless you get the dominator)

 

you might want to do your math again. 22k? unless your putting a mast motor in there your way waaaaay off. summit has a lq9 for 2900 get a 4l60e for 1500 and beef up your rear end or put in a 4th gen for the same price $500 if that. fuel system will be another grand if you cant find deals. i used brand new stuff and it didnt even come close to 22k i have tubular everything the only thing thats stock on my car is the seat belts keep the car and get classic insurance on it and do the swap

 

i hope you are right.....i think i could cut some costs and bring it down to less than $22k. i looked up that motor at summit. $2900 for long block. I figure $1000 in the induction system, $1000 in wiring, $900 in headers, $500 in misc stuff, and I have a $6500-7000 motor, plus a $1500 tranny= 8000-8500 in the drivetrain. Granted it's all new... think I am about right here?

 

I would add 500 for front accessories, and another 600-900 for clutch and flywheel IF you intend on using a 6 speed. Rest of your budget seems reasonable.

 

Exactly. Well put.

For the $ involved here, you could find a really nice 4th gen on Craigslist for less than 22K and drive it now.

Speaking from experience, project budgets are always more than planned. Wish the gov would learn that...

 

better how? because it already has the ls powerplant?

3rd gens handle better......

really it comes down to what you want to drive and the satisfaction of building and knowing what you have. i keep my wife in a newer vehicle because i like knowing that her and my kids are safe. to me, newer cars lack character, and they are slowly all starting to look alike. i drive an 82 2wd K5 everyday because its cool, you don't see them very often, and i can overhaul it on the side of the road if i need to. it has power everything, ac, and cruise control.....oh yeah, and its paid for and doesn't owe me anything.

to each their own, but around my house, its built, not bought.

 

ok..not sure whats going to happen here but....i'm going to an auction tomorrow to try to buy a 2002 z28 SS...wrecked. the plan is to buy it for the motor, tranny, and acessories and put it in my third gen because there is some satisfaction to building my own car. i hope its a good decision, we'll see...i'll keep y'all posted.

 

I agree, I have done that for years. I've always lived by that motto. Learned a ton of things along the way I wouldn't trade for anything. But, now with life, job, and other things, I don't have time to stand in the shop. Focus has changed, I would rather drive and enjoy something than work on a project forever. If he has the money and time, it is his choice. Just saying he might enjoy a 4th gen for the money involved. Don't want to take over the thread...

I'm not trying to put anyone down, didn't mean it that way. You guys doing the swap have my respect. The cars you build are screamers.

Either way he chooses, hope it works out for him.

 

From what I have seen on this board, that will be your lowest cost option, assuming that you get the car at a good price and the parts are good.

Where is this auction? I'd like to know for future reference, as I am also in VA.

 

well.... I went, I bid, I didn't get it...oh well..wasn't meant to be.

I am going to keep my third gen. I decided as nice as the 4th gens are I really like the looks of the third gen...third gen looks and feel with 4th gen drivetrain has got to be the best of both worlds.

Ternandes...the auction was at Copart in Sandston, VA. It was an online auction. You have to be a liscensed salvage buyer though. I'm not but a friend is. He was bidding for me and I was buying it from him if we won. Good to see another 'third genner' here in VA!!!

 

Carefull with those copart auctions, the pictures dont always tell the whole story. If anything I'd suggest only bid on the certified running and driving ones. The cars dont really go for too cheap on there either. After final price fee's and shipping you could have probably bought a high mileage 4th gen. Best bet is to watch craigslist day and night for someone that wrecked theres.

 

Buy a totalled 4th gen and swap everything. That will really cut down on your costs...

 

I have both a 3rd gen that I am swapping in a turbo'd 5.3 t-56 and everything else that I have ever wanted in a car. (that has been under the knife for a year now. And I also have a 99 Z with all the bells and whistles on it. With that being said I like the fourth gen a lot! But I like the 3rd way more, looks better, lighter, and way more character.

With that being said I would keep your Z, and and buy a built 4th gen if your looking to spend 20k plus. just my .02

 

Be patient since you decided to keep the 3rd gen. I got my '02 Z28 donor for $2500 and drove it home, but only after 8 months of watching craigslist, ebay, classifides, etc. Still going to be associated costs involved for a mild buildup (intake, heads, cam, etc.), but it is definitely worth it to me.

Good luck on your build!

 

I prefer to be able to see the hood of the car while driving, so a 4th gen is out of the question. haha