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LTX and LSXPutting LT1s, LS1s, and their variants into Third Gens is becoming more popular. This board is for those who are doing and have done the swaps so they can discuss all of their technical aspects including repairs, swap info, and performance upgrades.
So, I spent 3 hours cutting through one bolt on these LCA's. Without a lift, and just using jackstands it is tough work using an angle grinder because it is so tight under there. The bolts are rusted to the sleeves so they just spin, but I can't get them out which is why I have to cut them.
Does anyone know some secrets to help me cut through these faster? Hoping for any thoughts before I start cutting through the other 3....
Have you considered using an oscillating tool? You'll need carbide tipped metal cutting blades, but it should be easier than with the angle grinder. Not really that cheap, but still might be more effective.
Have you considered using an oscillating tool? You'll need carbide tipped metal cutting blades, but it should be easier than with the angle grinder. Not really that cheap, but still might be more effective.
So I was able to get the drivers side off with only having to cut the bolt that attaches to the rear end. The LCA relocation bracket looks good. The old shocks will be replaced, but I wanted to leave them there for now as a reference since I haven't ever installed these before....
Get a bigger grinder to cut the hardened bolts faster. Harbor freight sells a 9" angle grinder and matching cutoff wheels. Chews through plate like butter and will make short work of bolt heads. Wear welding gloves though, protection from the massive spark shower plus a bit of protection if it gets away from you. Ive got a nasty scar where one tried to take my arm off
So, I spent 3 hours cutting through one bolt on these LCA's. Without a lift, and just using jackstands it is tough work using an angle grinder because it is so tight under there. The bolts are rusted to the sleeves so they just spin, but I can't get them out which is why I have to cut them.
Can you use a nut splitter to break the nut off and then drive the bolt out with hammer and punch?
Can you use a nut splitter to break the nut off and then drive the bolt out with hammer and punch?
I was able to get the nuts off the bolt using PB blaster and a 4 ft metal tube to help pry. I tried the punch first, but it was a no go.
I was able to cut through the last bolt last night. I stayed with the angle grinder and was patient. With thick leather gloves (which came in handy at one point).
I'll post some pictures of the control arms installed later tonight. Very easy installation and they look very nice. Happy with the set from founders so far.
Got a little done last night. Replaced the rear shocks while I was working on the rear end. These old things were in bad shape. Definitely the original ones from the factory.
I also ordered the eibach sport lines and they should be here Saturday. Should be it for the suspension for now once those are installed.
Also, getting ready to order everything for the CAI and was going to make my own using intakehoses.com. How are you using the IAT sensor with the cold air setup? Not sure where I am supposed to insert the sensor...
However, when installed, it is leaving the throttle body open by half an inch or so (you can see it in the picture). I have looked it over and over and can't seem to find why it's appearing as not quite long enough. I have put pictures of where the cable meets the throttle body, firewall, and the gas pedal as a reference.
Is it as simple as needing to bend the gas pedal? I've never done that, and not sure I could bend it enough anyway (or if I should).
My stock shift cable was too short. After some digging I found a thread on here about a new cable from shift works. They specifically made it as a direct replacement for the stock cable...and its adjustable. It fit perfectly and is made of high quality material. Part number is k300 if anyone is interested. You have to call them though because they don't post it on their website.
Also decided to paint my intake. I went with red since the engine bay is black. The rest of the car will eventually be a dark gun metal gray, so I wanted a little pop of color under the hood. And it matched the red k member and a arms perfectly.
Should be getting my intake parts in this weekend and should have some progress to post after all the other 'honey dos' are done.
Reinstalled the intake and TB. Still need to finish re-painting the fuel rail and install that.
Also got the parts for the CAI in the mail from Intakehoses.com. Took some time to measure and cut to the length I needed. Overall I think it looks good, just need to cut the hole for the IAT sensor and get a grommet.
Also took some time to rip the pad off the underside of the hood and cleaned, primed, painted it to make it look a little better.
Got the Spohn Tranny xmember with torque arm relocation in the mail yesterday. Hopefully the install goes better than some of the other installs I have read horror stories about on here...
Reinstalled the intake and TB. Still need to finish re-painting the fuel rail and install that.
Also got the parts for the CAI in the mail from Intakehoses.com. Took some time to measure and cut to the length I needed. Overall I think it looks good, just need to cut the hole for the IAT sensor and get a grommet.
Also took some time to rip the pad off the underside of the hood and cleaned, primed, painted it to make it look a little better.
Got the Spohn Tranny xmember with torque arm relocation in the mail yesterday. Hopefully the install goes better than some of the other installs I have read horror stories about on here...
Nice progress! Please take some pictures when you get the Spohn torque arm and transmission crossmember installed. I'm still trying to figure out the best option for my car.
Finally had some time to get the torque arm and cross member installed and ran into a snag. the torque arm keeps hitting the e-brake bracket in the trans tunnel. Is there a way to remove that bracket?
Finally had some time to get the torque arm and cross member installed and ran into a snag. the torque arm keeps hitting the e-brake bracket in the trans tunnel. Is there a way to remove that bracket?
Some torque arms seem to create that issue. One solution is to make a dent the floor where that bracket is to make extra clearance, that is what I did when I encountered this problem. Depending on where it's hitting exactly you might be able to trim a little off the bracket too.
You can remove the bracket if you aren't using the e-brake anymore. It's been awhile since I've messed that bracket so I don't remember for sure but I think you have to pull the carpet up inside the back of the car to get to the bolt that holds the bracket.
Had a lot of time and made some good progress over the weekend.
Torque arm and cross member are now installed. Took some wiggling for the torque arm, and it was a VERY tight fit over the rear end housing but it looks really good once its all said and done. It was very cramped under the car on jackstands, and lift would have made it waaaaaaay easier.
For the trans cross member I had to cut a hole through the passenger floor board since I had both bolts break off on that frame rail. So thats always fun...
Looks like I should be ok on clearance with the exahaust. I will add some pics for the exhaust once that is done.
However, when installed, it is leaving the throttle body open by half an inch or so (you can see it in the picture). I have looked it over and over and can't seem to find why it's appearing as not quite long enough. I have put pictures of where the cable meets the throttle body, firewall, and the gas pedal as a reference.
Is it as simple as needing to bend the gas pedal? I've never done that, and not sure I could bend it enough anyway (or if I should).
Any thoughts?
Finally had a chance to fix the throttle cable issue. Took the gas pedal off, and the torch. After about 5 minutes of heating the pedal, I bent it back about a half inch. Luckily, first try was the winner and was able to reinstall the throttle cable. Fits perfectly now with no play.
Here is what was nagging:
1. Shift cable needed to be screwed down inside on top of the trans tunnel.
2. Bolts that hold the AC box from the inside were reinstalled.
3. Tucked the PCM back to the factory location and is now hidden
4. Stripped, primed, and painted the fuel rail (pics to come). The sanding took FOREVER, but the finished prodcut looks good.
Now that all this is done, it is now time to take it to the shop to get a massive front end alignment. Then, its time for the first drive in this car in almost 3 years.
I decided to take the car for a quick joyride around the block after an 'at home' alignment. Here is when I ran into a small problem and need confirmation (hopefully)...
The car quickly overheats. So I did the typical checks...
1. Fans are coming on
2. Coolant is full. Checked it while running and it is at the top!
3. Air dam is on the bottom (learned that one the hard way years ago).
I'm pretty sure it's the thermostat and will dig into that after I get back from family vacation. Probably should have thought to replace that just for the ease of doing it out of the car and without coolant
I decided to take the car for a quick joyride around the block after an 'at home' alignment. Here is when I ran into a small problem and need confirmation (hopefully)...
The car quickly overheats. So I did the typical checks...
1. Fans are coming on
2. Coolant is full. Checked it while running and it is at the top!
3. Air dam is on the bottom (learned that one the hard way years ago).
I'm pretty sure it's the thermostat and will dig into that after I get back from family vacation. Probably should have thought to replace that just for the ease of doing it out of the car and without coolant
Any other thoughts let me know!
LS engines are known for getting air pockets, that could be the issue if your thermostat is ok. There are several methods for putting coolant in these engines and getting the air pockets out if you read on LS1tech. I always drill a 1/8 hole in the thermostat to allow some coolant to flow into the block even when the thermostat is closed...especially when filling. I also jack the front of the car up when filling with coolant to get the block full, never had any issues doing it this way.
Also, a quick way to bleed LS coolant systems is to fire the engine up and unhook the steam line near the TB. If theres air in the system is will sputter coolant out. Reconnect the line once the stream becomes steady. Good to go
Sounds like the engine is dry. Pop the upper rad hose off the rad and pour water in until it comes out and try again
If theres still nothing, youve got a big clog in the engine. In that case, take the T-stat out and let it get up to temp (takes a long time) and then start running a few bottle of system flush through it
So unhooking the top radiator hose and filling with water didn't work and re running was a no go...
As I started to take apart the thermostat and run it open it dawned on me that this is a single unit between the t stat and the housing. How should I run with it open without destroying the t stat?
Out of curiosity, is this on an incline of any sort? If so, is the car facing up or down?
I ask, because when I did my swap and I started working the air bubbles out, it was pointed down my driveway. Not a big grade at all, but it was enough of an angle to make bleeding the air out of the system impossible. I tried 4 times. Finally figured it out, turned the car around and bled it within 10 minutes. Food for thought.
I currently have the front end lifted. The wheels are about an inch off the ground or so, so it should be a big enough incline to move the air up to the front I would think.
Still battling the overheating issue...tried a couple more things but it's still overheating.
1. Replaced water pump (for safe measure) since I wasn't sure if/when it ever was
2. Tried unbolting the steam vent tubes on both heads until coolant comes out (read this was a good method on ls1 tech). Coolant immediately came out without even starting the engine.
Anyone have a suggestion on how to run without a thermostat since the housing and thermostat are a single unit? All the hoses are very hot after running for 10 minutes or so (even heater hoses). Also, with the radiator cap off, once it hits about 220 degrees, white smoke starts to come out of the radiator. Not a lot, but looks about as thick as a lit cigarette. Is that normal? It doesn't seem like the coolant is circulating as nothing has ever come out of the steam vent port going into the top of the radiator.
Definitely feeling crazy and pissed at this point. Any other thoughts are appreciated!
So I did a flush today through the coolant system. After the flush I started to fill with coolant through the upper radiator hose. And found this stuff when I disconnected the hose at the water pump. It was a yellowish color and EXTREMELY sticky. I assume this is what was clogged up in the block/heads somewhere. Also found a couple slivers of these blue shavings. No clue what they could be from but thought it was interesting.
Any idea what that yellow stuff is and how concerned should I be?
Replaced the radiator since it was the original radiator from 91. I have flushed the cooling system 3 times, and am at a loss.
One thing I did notice is the fans kick on as soon as the key starts. This isn't causing anything funky in terms of the computer telling the gauge to read inaccurately or anything is it? I also went the 3 wire sensor route from a 98 ls. Pocket did the harness so I doubt it has anything to do with the harness itself.
Leaning towards something computer related since I have replaced the entire cooling system. Any other thoughts are much appreciated.
Yellow stuff looks like evaporated coolant, probably had a leak at the hose. Blue stuff probably either RTV or locktite. Wouldn't be too worried about either.
Fans should be controlled by your same sensor that feeds the relay, not the pcm. You shouldn't have the fans kick on until it gets up to temp. You will have to check the sensory and the relay assuming it is wired correctly.
If nothing is coming out of the output of the steam tube but coolant comes up from the heads when you pull it, I would guess the steam tube is clogged or kinked. Did you try blowing air through it when you had it off?
I did not try blowing steam through it but I am getting some coolant out of the steam port now. Not a lot, but a steady trickle. Will take that off and see if there is a kink somewhere.
Another question. I should be seeing some of the coolant circulating in the radiator shouldn't I? The only circulation I can see is the small amount out of the steam vent tube. I drilled a hole through the thermostat housing to allow coolant to flow through. Which is about the same amount of flow as my steam vent 'trickle'
I will have to check the wiring. Not my forte, so there may be more questions to come.
Yellow stuff looks like evaporated coolant, probably had a leak at the hose. Blue stuff probably either RTV or locktite. Wouldn't be too worried about either.
Fans should be controlled by your same sensor that feeds the relay, not the pcm. You shouldn't have the fans kick on until it gets up to temp. You will have to check the sensory and the relay assuming it is wired correctly.
If nothing is coming out of the output of the steam tube but coolant comes up from the heads when you pull it, I would guess the steam tube is clogged or kinked. Did you try blowing air through it when you had it off?
So it's been a while since last tried anything, but I checked the steam vent and it was not kinked, air flowed through just fine.
I am going to try a new temp sender. I just put the new one in but maybe I cracked/messed it up somehow. The harness was from Pocket so I doubt there is an issue there.
Process of elimination...I'll get it eventually I hope...if the sensor doesn't work I will probably take it somewhere to troubleshoot it, but I'd rather not.
What does the gauge read when you first crank the engine? Does it slowly go up as the motor runs? Do you have something you can manually check the coolant temp with without burning yourself?
What does the gauge read when you first crank the engine? Does it slowly go up as the motor runs? Do you have something you can manually check the coolant temp with without burning yourself?
Gauge reads 100 (or lowest reading possible). It slowly rises as it idles and takes about 10 minutes before hitting 240ish before I turn it off. It doesn't fluctuate, just continues to climb.
I don't have a thermometer to use but would checking it through the top of the radiator be sufficient if I were to buy one? I don't want to burn myself so I'm open to other options as well.
Google some youtube vids, if it is always running relay is either getting signal all the time, positives are in the wrong place, relay is stuck on closed, or the pin for open is in where the closed is supposed to be and it is never getting a signal to close. Hope that makes sense..
Tried pinning them and they seem to be working appropriately. Heard the click when applying power and didn't show any resistance either.
I guess next step is to replace the cts and see if it is a faulty one. Also going to put the tstat in boiling water to see if it pops open. Just to make sure it isn't faulty.
Edit: t stat opened in boiling water. Onto the cts.
Last edited by Ikes 91Z; 08-18-2016 at 09:06 PM.
Reason: Adding note
Tried pinning them and they seem to be working appropriately. Heard the click when applying power and didn't show any resistance either.
I guess next step is to replace the cts and see if it is a faulty one. Also going to put the tstat in boiling water to see if it pops open. Just to make sure it isn't faulty.
Edit: t stat opened in boiling water. Onto the cts.
I had the same exact problem when I turned on my engine for the first time. Like it said in an earlier post, pour water into the upper radiator hose. However, when I did it, I jacked up my car high up with the floor jack. After that, I buttoned it up and no more problems. If I were you, you might want to try doing this again.
I know the air pockets are notorious for these engines, but that still wouldn't answer why the fans engage immediately after startup.
I planned on following this process again, after I figure out why the fans are kicking on at startup.
I also have the problem with the fans kicking on upon start up and have not looked into that yet. I first wanted to make sure that it would not overheat.
Where did you connect the steam port line to?
Does the upper radiator hose feel empty or full with the engine above 200 and running?
Did you properly burb the car by running it with the radiator cap off?
If you run it with the cap off, does the level in the radiator ever drop when the engine warms up?
For the fans, with the car cold and ignition on, check for 12v accross pins 86 and 85 (the two skinnier blades).
Do you see 12v?
Yes - You have a short to ground on the signal wire, or the CTS is giving the wrong reading to the ECM. You should be able to plug an OBD2 scanner in and read the CTS reading. If that reads correctly, its not the CTS.
Did you make absolutely sure the coolant fan relay control is plugged into Blue 42 (if low speed fan) or RED 33 (High Speed Fan).
Check for continuity between pin 85/86 on the relay and ground with both ignition on and ignition off. With the car cool, you should not have ground either way.
Get a laser thermometer as well. I've got a pretty inexpensive one that's accurate and only paid like $25 for it from Amazon. Might help you figure out if it's just the sensor, or if it really is getting that hot.
After checking everything kenney001 and pocket suggested I narrowed the overheating issue down to being a bad cts. Thankfully I was able to warranty it out and didn't cost anymore $ so that was a plus.
Started the car up today and let it run for a good 20 minutes and never got above 160 degrees. Verified that on the temp, as well as a thermometer in the radiator. I will take a couple laps around the block to see what it does after driving a little bit.
The fans are still kicking on as soon as the engine starts though. All the wiring/relays checked out to be ok, and I got voltage where needed. I will keep troubleshooting that, but at least it is not overheating.
Thanks for all the help so far on this build. I am sure more questions will be coming but I truly appreciate it!
02-07-2016, 01:53 PM
