B4Ctom1

Oh I just like the profile, Im not going to spray it. there arent any other "retrofit hydraulic rollers" in the comp catalog in that size. Im not interested in custom ordering a cam.

The exhaust is SLP large tube shorties and the SLP cat back with hollow twin cats.

OMINOUS_87

I run the CC 224/230 roller. Serves me well so far.

Do you really think that you need all the spread in duration though? I dont imagine you will be revving much beyond 5500rpm.

B4Ctom1

well the one I picked is 224/236, the only 224/230 retrofit cams I see ar ethe 112 LC Xtreme marine and the 110 LC Xtreme energy.


you're running a 350 right? this is a 412. I got the intake and heads for a bit more rpm, even with the cam I selected my hp/tq at RPM will suffer in trade for low RPM torque and drivability.

There was a comparison done with a superram versus a LT-1 intake, I would love to find the cam used in this test. Here is the chassis dyno sheet:

OMINOUS_87

I run a 385. Peak power at 5750rpm. My base, runners, and plenum are hogged out pretty good too.

I have never seen any SR motor peak power beyond 5800rpm, any cubic inch or any head combo, the manifold just pukes up beyond that rpm level.

I am not saying that the cam wont work out real nice for you its just that I have never seen a SR combo that hauled with a big duration spread between intkae and exhaust.

I actually plan to ditch my cam for a single pattern solid roller.

Here is all the info you need about that dyno chart you got there.

http://www.popularhotrodding.com/tech/0803phr_beast/

B4Ctom1

thanks that helped a bunch: I had no idea that stealth rams sucked so badly. I don't feel so bad now.


car from article superram #'s:

cam: Comp Cam 12-404-4 222/226, 494/.494, 114 LSA

1/4 mile: 1/4.....12.947 MPH.....108.14

DISPLACEMENT 379 Cubic Inches

dyno #s: 335 rear-wheel HP and 392 rear-wheel TQ

Tuning: "dyno runs reflect a fair amount of wide band dyno tuning"

wieght: 3750 #


My car #'s:

cam: Crane 119681 240/248, .595.595 114

1/4 mile: 13.637 @ 99.82 @ 6000 feet (corrected = 12.825@105.44)

dyno #s: 287 rear-wheel HP and 379 rear-wheel TQ

Tuning:

dyno day- I was running the stock $8d (AUJP) bin

track day- I had done some low RPM tuning and this was my first day of PE tuning only got 3 runs.

weight: 3750

OMINOUS_87

Tom

I really want to see this thing work out for you.

I took a look at CC site and it sucks that the 224/230 is cut on a 110 lsa.

I dyno tuned my combo, it really is the icing on the cake, I picked up 35rwhp and 90rwtq by dialing in the fuel and spark on the dyno.

Right now she is trapping 113.5mph at 1300 feet. I know there is more to be had and there is power being left on the table as I am running the stock 48mm TB.

You can order a custom grind through Summit as long as you first get the specs from CC, kinda a backdoor thing but the pricing is the same. Pretty fast turnaround time also.

B4Ctom1

Getting on the highway to go to denver for the cruise and this happens, tranny fluid every where, think the pump died. I was really on it hard passing an RV. Atleast it didn't happen 130 miles away in Denver.


https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...hreadid=240998

Kingtal0n

<b>I had no idea that stealth rams sucked so badly.</b>

Tom you DO mean SUPER RAM right? not Stealth Ram? he said SR not HSR. I use a Stealth Ram and its the greatest thing since sliced bread (and AFR heads)

B4Ctom1

OOPS! Yes I did mean SUPER RAM, not as I had mistyped, the stealth ram still rules

B4Ctom1

B4Ctom1

Today I put the rear end in the 91 and pulled the tranny out of the 92, and pulled apart the pump. Its fine, the front bushing just walked out because overhauling it too many times over the years caused the little step at the front to wear away. so this time I will be staking it in place in addition to the normal hot loctite thing I usually do. The bushing came forward just enough to kiss the seal and put some pressure on it and make it leak plenty.

Kingtal0n

Everytime you overhaul it you dont replace the bushings? and dont you mean the busing in the stator support? there are 2 right? using the stock stator suport tom?

B4Ctom1

no it's the converter bushing, the one that goes in the front pup cover right by the metal clad converter lipseal.

There is a little "ledge" in late model pump covers. Mine was a late model one with the ledge but replacing that converter bushing over the years during fixes, repairs, and overhauls not to mention converter changes has resulted in it's abesence. It isnt much of a ledge to begin with and driving bushings up against it over the years has made it thin. this bushing took what was left of it away.

The solution is to "rough" it up some with the sharp edge of a chisel and drive the loctited bushin into the cover. It will try to hang up on all of those "blemeshes". This is not without danger. I have to "resize" it over the converter hub without damaging the bushing. I use a rubber mallet and a touch learned from building 1000's of 700R4's. I just hope I havent lost my touch. I doubt it everything else went so quick and smoothly so far.

edit: I don't replace the stator bushings every rebuild I check them for excessive clearance. These we changed on the last rebuild but not the last overhaul (the band and clutches get toasty). Now the scary part, this has a late model stator support pressed in to an older pump. I Have never had problems with it. Not even my old 415 with nitrous could hurt it. The input drum and shaft is the stock piece as well.

83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

What is the “normal hot loctite thing?”

B4Ctom1

you leave the bushing at room temperature and you put the pump cover in the 200+ degree parts washer. When it comes out its too hot for most people to touch. You shake the water off of it. The remaining water steams off in seconds. You put loctite on the bushing and press it into the front cover and let it cool. I know it sounds silly due to the fact that you would think this is the opposite of how it should work. Well last time I did this I don't think I did it that way. You can heat it up in the oven on "warm" and do the same thing. I don't think I did that last time either.

83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

and what are you supposedly accomplishing with this? For the most part locktite doesn't like heat...

B4Ctom1

You know what I am saying it accomplishes. If you wait until it cools and use and arbor press you can feel that it takes a significantly higher amount of pressure to push it back out than it took to put it in there. That is all the proof I needed to be convinced.

B4Ctom1

I got it fixed last night!

B4Ctom1

I did a little tuning on it as shown above and I have driven and street raced the **** out of it since my last post. the car is quite fun. I highly doubt it ever reached the 380 rw hp number I wanted. For the exact reasons stated early in this thread, the cam and the compression are mismatched as well as the cam and the intake.

I did make it go as fast as mildy modified 03 cobras run at this altitude. Beating 03 cobras is no small affair at any altitude.

The other day I heard a knocking noise and I feared the worst. A quick inspection of the car turned up that the harmonic balancer looked crooked. A more thorough inspection revealed that the balancer bolt had stripped out and the balancer had walked to the end of the crank. It did damage the keyway some on the
crank. otherwise the crank is fine so I am taking it out and fix it.

The 412 due to my poor cam selection never reached it's full potential, there is a good chance that it will go into the JYD owned by my friend Brian. With his stronger drivetrain (T56/moser 9") his carb style efi intake and 150 shot of nitrous I think his 2800# car could eek into the 10's at this altitude. That is, if he will get off his ***. f he pisses me off too much I might just sit on it.

I have been screwing around with the B4C too much and not getting anything done on the 91 drag car. So I have decided to give the B4C over to my wife as a driver. But there is no way in the world she needs a 412, so I have taken the L98 out of the 91 as part of the normal course of turning that car into a drag car. It will be freshened up, keep the accel super ram, get a set of L98 aluminums (bumping compression to 10.25:1), and get either a zz4 or LT4 hotcam. Hell there is a good chance it might make the car faster than it was with the mismatched 412 combo. I figure once the B4C is her's I will basically not do anything with it not even drive or race it.

I have already started to work on the 91 as can be seen here:

https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...hreadid=207163

rolling-robert

from cranecams.com:


Part Number: 119681 Grind Number: HR-240/372-2S1-14.86 IG
Engine Identification:
Start Yr. End Yr. Make Cyl Description
1957 1987 CHEVROLET 8 ROUGH IDLE, PERFORMANCE USAGE, W/LARGE NITROUS SYSTEM, GOOD UPPER RPM TORQUE AND HP, 370+ CU.IN., BRACKET RACING, AUTO TRANS W/3500+ CONVERTER, 4200-5000 CRUISE RPM, 10.5 TO 12.0 COMPRESSION RATIO ADV., .860" BASE CIRCLE FOR LONG STROKE CLEARANCE. BASIC RPM 3500-7000
Engine Size Configuration


9.9-1 is too low of compression

B4Ctom1

yeah we already established that, as well as it is wrong for the intake.

I may simply advance the cam about 4 degrees while the engine is out to raise low RPM cylinder pressure and carb the engine if ol' brian pisses away his chance to put it in the JYD, or maybe turbo it! but in what? not in either of these cars and not right now

B4Ctom1

Well, its settled-looks like the 412 longblock will be replaced with:

L98 shortblock freshened

ZZ4 cam

L98 alum vette heads (10.3:1)

stock TPI lower



staying with the car for the new motor will be:

1.6 rockers

Accel Superram upper

1 3/4 SLP headers

B4Ctom1

Early in the post we discussed the cam and compression of this motor.

While putting together my L98/ZZ4 clone 350 I opened my box for the timing set and started reading. Suddenly I was struck by a sad feeling. I went into the house and looked at my 412 assembly photos where I had simply installed the cam straight up.

well it turns out this is not the case after all, in my haste to complete seemingly simple parts of the installation I tried to rely on my memory and remembered it incorrectly.

here is what I did:


here is the instructions that I saw:

B4Ctom1

So hey guys, how is it going. You want to talk about some thread necromancy?

Lets bring you up to date:

Shortly after this thread, the harmonic balancer bolt hole on the snout of the crank lost it's threads. They were probably a little weakened from having a broken bolt removed (why I got the crank so cheap).

The balancer walked off the end of the crank damaging the keyway and keyway slot a bit. I am going to fix it. I already had another balancer. I am cleaning it up the wallowed out keyway a bit and pinning it like people do for LT1 or LS1 engines running a blower.

Not sure why it walked off in the first place even with the bolt hole issue. The motor ran smooth, do you guys think the balance was off? Or is this just a result of the fact that 400 balancers have the extra weight on one side to exacerbate the situation? The way the trans pump bushing at the other end of the crank went out, it makes me wonder if there are weird torsional thinks going on with this crank. Maybe the old dickbutt machinist I used ripped me off on the balancing?

I pulled the 412 for the time being, grabbed the L98 350 from my 91. Because the 350 had a mild rod knock, I threw a freshly recut crank with full bearing kit into it. I topped it off an HSR, ZZ4 aluminum heads, and ZZ4 cam. It ran great for months and then the rod knock returned. The plastiguage said all was fine but one of the rods is obviously out of spec.

In 2007 I got divorced. I thought I was going to lose one of the camaros to the now ex wife. She only wanted the truck.

A year later I met an awesome woman and last year I got married to her in 2011.

She thinks it is crazy that I have not gotten at least one of these cars running. My priorities have shifted, I am working a lot out of town right now, but in the next few years I will be making more money and working less for it. I don't want to be without my projects when this finally happens.

We have been working on the house to put it on the market. It has been a good house but too many bad memories. Plus it is a bit too old, too small, in the wrong neighborhood/bad neighbors, and not nearly enough land for a man of my overworked means.

I snatched an Accel EFI singleplane with rails off ebay for a steal. It is already portmatched to the 1206/1207 sized ports on these massive heads. I bought a cool sheetmetal elbow for using TPI/LT1 TB's on singleplanes (again for a steal).

I bought a XFI268 cam. I will be running the crane retrofit roller lifters I already have on it. I thought about the XFI280, but considering the low compression discussed in this thread, and the fact that this thing has massive heads. I really think this is the right choice.

Even the Comp cam selection software says I will not be giving that much up by going with this 2nd choice cam over the first choice XFI280.

My only concern at this point would be base circle can interference issues with the rods. I see people here running the XFI280 with 406's and 383's without a mention of it.

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

Welcome back, and congrats on finding the RIGHT woman this time around!

B4Ctom1

Thanks.

Also I forgot, I bought an Accel Gen 6 DFI computer with a plug and play harness adapter. I snagged it off ebay cheap as well.

I will install a WB02 and gauge to help me tune with.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Holy old thread! Thanks for the update tho, curious what happend to this build Got to re read it again, its been so long

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

Are you still a train engineer, Tom?

-- Joe

B4Ctom1

Yes Joe I am!