therckid

Alright guys, i've decided to go with a Vortech Supercharger. The thing is however it is made for serpentine belt setup. Isthere any posible way to make it bolt up and work in the stock A/C Location.Since i'm deleting A/C completely i would like to do that. Would this work without having to convert to Serpentine?

Also, when i do this i think i'll get the supercharger, some headers, and what else should i get? What else would take full advantage of the Supercharger. I might do some intake porting also but i dunno.

Also i got a '86 5.0 TPI, with a full cat back system already(edelbrok), what kinda power numbers would i be looking in when i do this with some headers and porting?



Shane

SATURN5

Just swap to a serpentine setup.. then make sure to bolt some 18's on the back for traction. BW

therckid

d00d, leave that alone, that was what, 8 months ago. Old times. I'm for real d00d.


Do i really have to switch to serpintine though? Is there any way around that?




Shane

SATURN5

I couldn't resist.. hehe

Without designing and building custom brackets, plumbing, and fabrication of a custom v-belt/serpentine belt pulley (an old paxton pulley might work), swapping to the later belt setup would be easier, faster and cheaper in the long run. BW

therckid

ok can i get away with just buying serpentine brakcets, or do i gotta get all new belt driven things? I heard/saw you gotta get new alternator, A/C, waterpump, everything. Is this true?



Shane

SOLID LIFTER

.

SOLID LIFTER

OMFG! lol. I remember that!

therckid

d00ds please, i appologiesed a long time ago for that. Come on. You guys, hopefully can get over it and we can become friends. I was young and immature. Well 7 months ago is a long time for me,i matured so muhc about cars its not even funny.



Shane

therckid

but for real, how do i convert to serpinine system? Do i just need the brackets, or do i need everything again.

SATURN5

You'll need all the accessories too. Or at a minimum you need the AC comp, alt pulley, water pump pulley, reverse rotation water pump, power steering pulley, serpentine crank pulley, and brackets.

BW

SOLID LIFTER

kidrcth: On the day that you stop saying the word "d00d" I promise to leave you alone.

therckid

d00d a conversion(brand new) cost' $546.95. I think thats way more expensive than a custom bracket.




Shane

SATURN5

You can find what you need for a ton less.. well under $200 complete.

Check the classifieds here, Ebay, your local trader... start asking around. BW

SATURN5

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...&category=6755

88-92 Camaro Serpentine Bracket LH IROC Z28 RS

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...&category=6755

88-92 Camaro Serpentine Bracket RH IROC Z28 RS


heres the brackets...

therckid

nah d00ds a custom bracket will be made........ If it aint broke dont fix it.....



Shane

therckid

well guys here is a pic of the kit(all of it cost $2999.00). What do you think will have to be done to that brack? I might be able to just lengthen it or shorten it to make it fit where the A/C compressor was, Wont I?






Thanks,

Shane

SATURN5

Well considering it bolts to serpentine type brackets, and uses serpentine type accessories.. it ain't worth a damn.

Your going to spend $3K on a charger.. and gripe on buying the correct belt arraingment.... geez.

BW

therckid

actually that supercharger is gay compared to tjhe ATi procharger i'm looking at now. Will bring my stock 305 up to 210(my cat back adds some power) + 85%(15-20psi) = 388. But i'll expect somewhere in the 350 range. This kit is much better(intercooled) and its only $3555.95.


I know your wondering how they can give you that much psi, i dunno either but they warentee it for 1 year and the engine for 3 years so i have confidence.

I could goto the cheaoper one with a less powerful intercooler for $3055.95. Will give my little 305 p to 336 HP. I like the 388 better however. So i like that number much better.

https://www.rpmoutlet.com/atifbodytp.htm

here is what they say about them superchargers(prolly already read it though,


I think i like the idea of this cause i get to keep thw awesome low end torque of my TPI stuff. Which is completely awesome.....



Shane

therckid

i guess you make a good point sopendign $3.5k on something then complaining about $400 is pittyful. hmmmm......lol




Shane

nightrider87

you need to do a lot more research. its not possible to run 15-20lbs on your stock compression. nor would i being doing it much with a stock bottom end.

find a setup used for the belts, they already told you that. trying to convert a bracket you are paying big bucks for is not a bright idea.

therckid

yeha i can get a used kit with a/c and everything for $200. so that'll do.




Shane

therckid

theysaid i could run 15-20PSI, why cant i according to you? While this kit is in use i'll be building or saving up fopr a nice 350 to replace it. So that'll do.



Shane

nightrider87

ok. don't do any research, bolt that 15 lb pulley on and go.

I wouldn't be going near something as potentially dangerous as a supercharger unless I knew every damn thing there is to know about them. I've been researching my turbo project for about a year now and I think i finally know exactly what i need to know.

flrtin1

nightrider87 don't let him get to you. In a matter of minutes you figured out that he is just wasting space, he is not capable of blowing his nose let alone blowing his engine, look at the rest of his posts and you will understand !

therckid

alright guys,i understand the stress a superhcarger puts on an engine, i relaly do. But i dont care aboutt his POS 305. While the supercharger is on the 305 a replacement 350 will be built ready to go in. That way io can start with a new engine. I think i might be able to get a good yeah left outta the 305 before its end comes.





Shane

nightrider87

Its not the stress it puts on an engine that is the big issue here . Its that it is not possible to run that much boost on that much compression without race gas or water injection. end of topic.

Build youself a nice healthy 350 and be done with it. People who come into this forum without a shread of knowledge are just window shoppers so i guess i don't have to try help you not blow your engine, cause it won't ever see boost.

On another note, FLRTIN1 do you have any pics with the hood on your car? I'd be interested in seeing how the blower looks.
and also, what are you getting out of that 305 with the 6-71? Thanks,
Jay

EDIT: found your website

therckid

well, if you say so, but the sight syas its made for "1988 - 1992 TPI F-body 5.0li and 5.7li System" SO my guess is that they had already thought of this stuff my friend. It is made for the 305 and the 350, therefore must be able to handle the compression.




Shane

therckid

here is the chart they got which system would be better?

Year Description HP Gain Boost Level Computer/Ignition Modifications Price

88-92 HO 2-Core Intercooled with P600b or P-1SC* 60-80% 9-12 psi Not Required $ 3,055.95

88-92 Stage II Intercooled with D-1 or D1-SC** 85+% 15-20 psi Not Required $ 3,555.95

Polish finish for ProCharger Satin Finish Standard $ 195.95

Upgrade to 3 core Intercooler (from 2 core) 750 hp Max. $ 255.95

Upgrade to P-1SC from P600-B $ 243.95

Upgrade to D-1SC from D-1 $ 100.95


Which system would be beter suited for me to be able to walk over a 4th gen? The 15-20PSI or the 9-12PSI. All i wanna do is walk over a 4th gne, thats it. I will not do any major engine mods beucase well, i'm not experienced with taking apart chevy engines(i took apart a lawn mover but thats it).


heres a paragraph from them-


Shane

flrtin1

Shane you just contine to show your ignorance go ahead and buy what you can't afford and do what you want to screw your car up and why bother people when you know all the answers, you are the know all :hail:

Jay
I have some on my web site from the mid 80's with the small blower on it but I don't have any with the cowl w/671 (it was a pos unlimited hood). Here are some current ones of the factory composite hood still need some finishing and I have to figure out a paint design for it

therckid

alright guys, i'll leave yaalone, was just starting this thread for the simple answer of the serpintine setup. Then it transformed and you guys are getting amd at me? dont seem fair. But anyways.....



Shane

nightrider87

kidrcth, i will still try to help you. I don't want to see you pissed off with ATI because you listened to their website and interpretted it incorrectly.

Those systems imply they are for a TPI 305 or 350. Yes, fine. What that really means is they will fit on those engines. They have the right brackets, and they have the right intercooler loaction and plumbing to run with our cars. However, the 15-20 psi kit is deffinately designed for an engine that has had some work done to it. Now, the 9-12 psi kit is much more ideal in your situation but I wouldn't waste my money on a small supercharger just yet.

Build yourself a nice forged internals 350 with 8.5 or less compression if you want something as crazy as 15-20 psi. Mind you, that will do more than stomp all over 4th gens. It will stomp all over everything lol.

If all you really want is to beat 4th gens, and you plan to build a new 350 anyhow, then you should stay naturally aspirated. For your mild power goals, a supercharger is just mindlessly overkill in terms of expense. I do realize that if that's your goal now, it'll change after one season of being that fast but thats why they invented nitrous and bolt ons. Build either a 350 or a 383 and since you seem to have money to burn, throw a set of AFR 195s on top of it. Get yourself a holley stealth ram or even a converted LT1 intake to go on top. mate that with a cam around 230 to 235 duration and .550 lift or more and you'll be deep in the 12s if not easily in the 11s. That'll be much cheaper than buying a supercharger and building a stout bottom end for it. Later, if 11s aren't good enough which they won't be after a while , you can throw a nice nitrous setup on top of it and hit low 11s or maybe even 10s depending on how much you spray. This is depending on how much you drop on your rotating assembly to begin with though too. Forged is always better but you can spray 200 on hypers if you really wanted. Keep in mind you'll need to upgrade everything from the engine back too heh.

cheers,
Jay

FLRTIN1, the blower looks surprisingly good with the way you've done the hood. With the reputation our cars have for being white trashy, i thought a roots blower might really add to that effect with it sticking through the hood. How much of it could you cover up with a 6 inch cowl? Doesn't look like too much lol

therckid

could i use a Recon Performance Engine, 350 short block?

here are the specs summit posted on it,
From the sounds of the engine construction it sounds like a good base to me. Stell crank, I-beam rods. Sounds like its sturdy. My step-dad, he was a mechanic back in 87-89(until her joined the navy), said that these were some stout engines and that this is what i should be looking at for a replacement. If i do supercharge, which i will, i am keeping the TPI for the fact is has awesome low end torque numbers.

Tell me what ya think....


Shane

therckid

if i put some L-98 heads on that thing i could be doing pretty good right? I can port them pretty good, and thre supercharger will do the rest, they are also pretty cheap now....



Shane

flrtin1

Jay,
lol I think I would still have to have a pretty big hole in a 6".

I built this motor for a friend of mine a couple of years ago to put in his TA I thought maybe we could get it under his scoop but he decided to put it in his truck before I was done and sold the TA.

People make comments when I don't have the hood on but IMO the car looks better that way

therckid

or go with the same engien with heads already on it for double the price,




Since i wont be going carb i can sell the intake, for some money, but it is still quite expensive, however from what i hear they are the shizznits.



Shane

therckid

what should i do guys??????

nightrider87

If you want an engine without a supercharger, both of these sound fine. However, if you're still set on supercharging, try make sure everything is forged, ie crank, a good set of I or even H beam rods, and forged pistons that will give you low compression with the heads you want.

You can generally put your own short block together for much less than buying one if you want it all forged. I think with the cheaper stuff (cast and hyper), a pre-made short block isn't too bad in terms of cost efficiency.

nightrider87

On another note, L98 heads are garbage. even the aluminum corvette ones. You could pick almost any other head and do better in your engine build up.

darrells3rdgen

If its power you want then you really dont need a supercharger. unless its because of the sound it makes when it spools up. but before you can get that cool sound out of a supercharger the engine will need to be built for it, a supercharger wont give you that much power if the engine is all stock.

may I suggest a engine since you said you dont have much building exp. try SDPC2000.com insert this part number SDZZ465B in the blank below where it says search by part numbers. you should find a sdpc custom built crate engine that is ballenced and blueprinted and ready to run here is the spec's .

Specifications
SDPC Part Number: SDZZ465B
Manufacturer: Scoggin Dickey Parts Center
Horsepower : 465 @ 6100 RPM
Torque : 430 @ 4600 RPM
Compression Ratio : 10.1:1
Camshaft Duration @ .050 : 234 / 242
Camshaft Lift, I/E : 0.575 / 0.595
Cylinder Block : 4-Bolt Cast Iron, 1pc Seal
Crankshaft : 3.480, Forged Steel
Cylinder Heads cc : 62cc, Fast burn Aluminum
Intake Manifold : Performer RPM Air Gap


the price is not half bad at $5,700.

and if you want more power you could either go with a turbo setup and NOS , or just nos, you could have up to 600 hp and just woop azz all day long and still have a reliable car afterwards. and the best part is even the cops wont notice you as much than if you were riding around with that big supercharger pokin out of the hood . waving at every cop miles away.

darrells3rdgen

and also if you have deep pockets then you can get a custom built crate engine built and completly installed by this .www.lingenfelter.com

scroll down the page and check out the video of the lingenfelter LS2 c6 427 twin turbo engine, it puts out 951 hp. now that would be sick in a 3rd or 4th gen fbody car.

nightrider87

how many people driving 3000 dollar cars like ours can say 5700 for just an engine is not that bad?

460hp for 5700 dollars...you've got to be kidding me.

CrazyHawaiian

Wow back from the dead. To answer one of the original questions, what else would take full advantage of the supercharger, I'd say an intake and cam swap. The previous owner of my 91Z28 had a S-Trim V1 Vortech kit installed on the stock L98 and one of the biggest problems I see is the mismatch in powerbands. The TPI/Stock Heads/Cam setup powerband stops around 4,800 to 5,000 rpm and the blowers powerband (aka full boost) starts around 2,800 to 3,000 rpm. That only leaves you with about a 1,800 to 2,000 rpm range where the combo is making power. I can literally feel the power drop off. If you swapped the cam to a boost friendly cam with a 2,000 to 6,000 powerband and changed the intake to something like the HSR you would pull hard all the way to 6,000 rpm, 3,000 of them at full boost. The rest of that Vortech kit takes care of the fuel management (in a lame way, but it works) and the MSD box gives you some safety with the timing retard per psi of boost. After adressing the cam/intake I'd say concentrate on the drivetrain (stall/shiftkit) and suspension (traction). Exhuat is a must.