Hey how good of an Idea is it to take a turbocharger and convert it to a turbine power jet and have it blow into another "idle " tubocharger. How much velocity or do they say thrust could say a t4 converted to turbine kick out compared to the exhaust of a v8 feeding a t4 exhaust?

Also would it be a good idea to build a turbine turbocharger to afterburn the regular engine exhaust at high hg levels whilst regrinding a camshaft to produce no overlap between the I-E E-C cycle. In other words dual power stroke.

 

it sounds very complicated, but on theory alone I think it has merit. There are alot of people that have some "hairbrained, leafblower, electric supercharger, put oxygen straight into the motor..." ideas. But this one I like; I too have been seeing people lately turning turbos into small jet engines. I figure if you could build one to make thrust (at the cost of using plenty of fuel) and have it blasting into the exhaust housing of another second regular turbocharger (like the way they power take off on helicopter turbine jet enignes) you could use it to make even a huge turbo produce boost.

Now the down side. Fuel consumption, the whole support structure for fueling and cooling the jet, weight, and size constraints. This might be interesting for a college student to build in a pickup truck for thier engineering final, but likely not in a thirdgen.

http://www.nickhaddock.co.uk/jetkart.htm

 

I doubt it would be very easy to do or practical. The turbine turbo has to be powered, most project use leaf blowers i hear. After that the turbo powers itself from it's own exhaust.

You can't spool your turbine up with engine exhaust with out some complicated shut off to let the turbine's own exhaust take over for the higher RPM, exhaust spins the turbo faster which makes more exhaust and thus spins the turbo even faster making even more exhaust at higher speeds up to 150,000 RPM. that would be hard to get to with out blowing up. If it did blow up your turbo is equal to a grenade as far as shrapnel velocity.

then you have the problem of the intense heat of the exhaust. I don't know just how hot it gets with oil and water ciculation but if it didn't melt your second turbo it would damage any thing near it. But say you manage to get the second turbo going with out melting it would make a huge amount of boost.

I doubt you could get the set up to work and i don't know why you would because engine exhaust turbos can make more boost then a car can handle by themselves.

 

Yes I agree it would require good engineering to run the turbine feeding turbo. You bring up a very ineresting point about throttle control for the turbine. It would be best to have its throttle in unysin with the engine throttle to control the turbo output. Which would be best controlled by an ecu , hell its goes to deep to mention almost. Sync tps to a mod value to control a waste gate etc. The main vision on this was turbo power with free flow exhaust.

But my main thought was this. To rethink camshafts and engine pumping. With a supercharger or a turbocharger , even to a point nitrous oxide, it is typical to run a camshaft with less overlap and the whole overall grind specs differ from an N/A engine.

Secondly we know we run a supercharger or turbocharger to get more air into the cylinder so we can add more fuel(fuel makes the power) , but we leave a bit to be desired in the form of real effeciency by having to rely on the pistons second up stroke to exhaust the cylinder.

If we ran alot of hg sucking the exhaust from the cylinder on the 4th stroke we could then rethink cam design , rethink emmisions .
In thought this would allow us to run much shorter duration and much less lift easing valve train speed . We would have a quicker running engine , and you could probably "crunch" the exhaust into a very large catylic box because any backpressure can be overcome by the turbine.

I from the time I was a kid always thought the exhaust stroke left something to be desired and more effecient to most engine operation aspects.


Obviously we are taking lots of HG. Lots.

When talking heat and the turbine to turbo, its a good question/point I dont know the temperature a small turbine produces but I do know it would be used independent of the engines exhaust.


There also may be validity of running the turbine behind a turbo with the turbo gasses only entering the tubines exhaust passage as it would be hard to make an effecient turbine running high amounts of carbon dioxide.


The exact application for such a set up may not be slated directly at race engines , but could be. More likely would be effecient industrial engines and commercial marine.

 

It would take alot of engineering thats for sure becuse a uncontrolled turbine would grenade the second turbo i'd bet. But with the right controls and fuel for the turbine you would have a turbo charged engine that gets boost at any RPM. If you use a very small turbo for the turbine it should be alot simpler.

i only really know alittle about the turbine part i'm still new to cams and what not.

 

With camshafts the ramp speed a lifter and the rest of the valvetrain deals with gets accelerated when the camshaft grinder wants the cam to open to a specific value for a specific duration but at specific"fast" ramp speed values. Flat tappets have smaller ramp speeds than roller profiles , that I know. However I am pretty sure the high ramp on roller profiles require a lighter retainer like the LS1 employs by using a smaller diameter retainer thanks to the cone spring , also the widespread use of titanium retainers.

But with lots of hg vacuuming the exhaust and lots of boost in the intake you wouldnt need severe cam design. You wouldnt have severe acceleration in the valvetrain , you would lessen float , and in a good engine case with good balance(120 degree intervals) you could wizz a big engine up to some crazy rpms.

Negitive effect I could see is too much hg putting extra strain on the bottom of the rods and rod bolts.
Who knows what alot of hg would do to the rings , may cause unseat.

 

i'd love to redline a car at 13,000. LIke a motorcycle