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I decided since I am building a few of these kids (hopefully, these pie cuts are killing me) I would start a build thread for just this setup instead of hijacking my other build thread.
The goal for this is no cutting/denting etc. However a short stood up rad is more than likely required.
***Note I run the opposite side upper rad hose on my car. Factory is Driver side.
Parts used.
Hooker 8510HKR (turbo manifold for LS series)
Holley Mid Mount Accessories 20-185 (AC) this setup will also fit any other LS accessory setup that does NOT use Passenger side AC compressors. The holley setup is inboard enough to run AC
VSR Billet S475 T4 (1.10ar) Physically the same as a T4 Borg S475 (so massive)
VSR 50mm Wastegate (waiting on)
Piping is 3" 16awg Stainless. Bend Bros Pie cuts and Ace Race Tight radius 90's
T4 flange is custom made by myself. CNC 3" into T4 with a mounting tab (stainless)
Here are a few mockup pics.
So far this is the routing, still waiting on some piping to show and need to fill my gas tank prior to starting this. Im hoping to work on this over the Holidays.
The setup shown is the Holley Mid mount accessories. Not the cheapest route but 100% worth the money if you want to retain AC and have a turbo car. Figure by the time you source any accessory setup with AC you are going to be at least 1200 into it https://www.holley.com/products/ls_p...t/parts/20-185
So are you planning on building the up pipe/down pipe combo for this big single setup to sell to other members? I'm just curious since you said kit.
If i can make this at a reasonable cost, that is the plan. I have been waiting for Argon for a MONTH now! hoping to get my tank filled tonight to start welding or at least tacking this all up.
If i can make this at a reasonable cost, that is the plan. I have been waiting for Argon for a MONTH now! hoping to get my tank filled tonight to start welding or at least tacking this all up.
Jay
Cool! I'd be interested in seeing what you can come up with. The Hooker manifolds seem pretty nice and have to be better than a CX style kit. Wish there were more options for twins out there but sadly unless you're pretty handy at welding its all up to what you can fab up.
No idea what your expertise level is with a TIG torch but after all the pie-cuts I did a few tidbits of advice would be to first fully weld the tubing to the flanges before beginning your welding on the actual pie-cuts. Make at least 4 good, full strength spot welds to the flange and then begin your welds. At the first flange I only had two spot welds and I ran into the tubing slightly pulling from one side of the flange. It wasn't enough of a gap that you couldn't fill it easily but still aggravating. Use a Furick #12 cup and the welds come out beautiful, instagram beautiful, from the increased gas coverage. I used a #8 for my exhaust and wish I had this 12 earlier. What worked best for me was pulsing manually with my foot or using a really low frequency on my machine, like 2 or 3 pps with a low background. I think what you bought is laser cut so the fit up should be perfect so as long as that tube only has to support it's own weight I don't think you would really even need to use filler. You could buy a pipe sander and make it look seamless as if it's never been welded. Some of the autogenous welds the food and beverage industry guys post are like that. Make sure all of your spot welds on the tubing are also full strength and in at least 4 places per joint. At first I only used two or three spot welds per joint and When I began welding the seams I started to pop a few of the spot welds. Everything seems to have turned out well enough for me.
EDIT.. I already asked about this a while back on a different post. How well do these Hooker manifolds fit in a third gen? Sure seems like the way to go for a single turbo LS setup.
Last edited by ZZ3Astro; Jan 13, 2019 at 09:40 PM.
No idea what your expertise level is with a TIG torch but after all the pie-cuts I did a few tidbits of advice would be to first fully weld the tubing to the flanges before beginning your welding on the actual pie-cuts. Make at least 4 good, full strength spot welds to the flange and then begin your welds. At the first flange I only had two spot welds and I ran into the tubing slightly pulling from one side of the flange. It wasn't enough of a gap that you couldn't fill it easily but still aggravating. Use a Furick #12 cup and the welds come out beautiful, instagram beautiful, from the increased gas coverage. I used a #8 for my exhaust and wish I had this 12 earlier. What worked best for me was pulsing manually with my foot or using a really low frequency on my machine, like 2 or 3 pps with a low background. I think what you bought is laser cut so the fit up should be perfect so as long as that tube only has to support it's own weight I don't think you would really even need to use filler. You could buy a pipe sander and make it look seamless as if it's never been welded. Some of the autogenous welds the food and beverage industry guys post are like that. Make sure all of your spot welds on the tubing are also full strength and in at least 4 places per joint. At first I only used two or three spot welds per joint and When I began welding the seams I started to pop a few of the spot welds. Everything seems to have turned out well enough for me.
Appreciate the tips. Im actually planning on building a Jig this week hopefully. I will tig the entire thing while clamped in a jig. Using a #16 cup. Waiting on my friends stock to show up. no pulse on my machine so i will have to get some practice in with the foot pedal. mine seems to be tricky (everlast 185)
I plan on welding 1" or so long runs, then cutting out the old tac's with my bandsaw for pull peno. Backpurging of course. (still trying to dial in the correct amount of gas on the backside. I was testing and it worked MINT but man it goes through the argon quick!
I had to back purge my Y pipe while I was welding it. I put tape on the other, unwelded, joints and put a latex glove on the other flange to try to keep the gas in while I was welding, just have to make sure the whole tube isn't getting hot enough to melt the tape adhesive or the glove on the other end.
I haven't done much back purging myself, yet
I am pretty sure the argon is heavy and will stay in the tube if you set it 'upright' so the gas can't escape through the bottom, like a cup holding water (or CO2)
should be able to use this to advantage to conserve Argon
I am pretty sure the argon is heavy and will stay in the tube if you set it 'upright' so the gas can't escape through the bottom, like a cup holding water (or CO2)
should be able to use this to advantage to conserve Argon
I am sure he is going to be flipping that around like crazy to get a preferred welding position. Even when I did my V bands, I was moving the headers around a lot and that was much simpler part
There no other alternatives to using pie cuts? Cant find the radius you need?
i hate pies lol very rarely do i think about using them but i’m seeing alot more people use them today
Not really believe me I looked, I really didnt want to use this many pie cuts since im just a hobbyist welder lol. To give an example of how tight the area is. The 90 coming out of the turbo flange and the header flange are both "tight radius" Ace Race bends. Only downfall about the pie cuts is I really want to whip up a bunch of mild steel kits for a cheaper alternative. I cannot find pie cuts anywhere in mild.
They make steel donuts of very tight radius. Ever see them? Might come in handy?
yes, have yet to look more into them. The reason i really like the pie cuts is this entire is store bough piece. Didnt even trim them. For reputability this would be awesome. I will look into the donuts for mild though! may be the only option
If you have an abrasive chop saw you could get a bandsaw and sell the chop saw and then make any pie cut you want. For instance, I have a Harbor Freight bandsaw with a nice name brand blade and anything under 3" it cuts very accurate.
If you have an abrasive chop saw you could get a bandsaw and sell the chop saw and then make any pie cut you want. For instance, I have a Harbor Freight bandsaw with a nice name brand blade and anything under 3" it cuts very accurate.
Debated buying one. My handheld bandsaw only cuts 2.5"! Sold my standup bandsaw.
If you have an abrasive chop saw you could get a bandsaw and sell the chop saw and then make any pie cut you want. For instance, I have a Harbor Freight bandsaw with a nice name brand blade and anything under 3" it cuts very accurate.
I have like a 50 year old 60" bandsaw. Thing is great. Harbor freight is like the same design.
My plasma cutter though is just amazing.. Dunno how I went without one for years.
Fixture is coming together nicely. Made the base with whatever scraps I had kicking around but also machined a couple pieces at work. I made a 3" solid V band with a 1/8 npt hole for backpuging. I also a few years ago made a t4/t6 flange with a 1/8" npt port for backpurging. Ended up welding both of these to the fixture resulting in a very rugged/overkill fixture! but it should allow me to weld all the way around the pipes with no issues.
Still need to add a few 3" pipe guides so i know where the pipes need to sit, and the wastegate tube. But that will be after I have this thing all welded and in tested.
Tested the Mr gasket 30 degree swivel. I think a 90 will be needed if you wanted to route it like factory. Or swivel towards the center. Debating buying on just to test.
This kit should be wrapped up this weekend. Then onto the mount.
Looking great man! I have the same manifold setup on my 87 and I am ready to start building the mid pipe for my car. What are you using as a turbo mount. Please share. And keep up the good work!
I had been wondering, did you borrow/use the sloppy mechanic's ms files and recommendations for Turbo'ing an LS with MegaSquirt?
i built my tune from scratch, however I did compare some stuff. I run the MS3pro, most of the sloppys tuff is MS2 or MS3-gold. Slight differences.
I love my MS3pro, car starts and runs WAY better than it did on a factory PCM. Probably more to due to my factory PCM tune. But i like how i can tune on my cellphone/tablet.
Looks far better quality than a cx racing kit, good job!
Of Course, their crap is made in China. I should know because my CX Racing headers will crack if you look at it wrong, I'm always repairing cracks at the welds. DO NOT BUY, make your own like Jay!
Originally Posted by Jay_rich
Thats the plan! As i build them they will continue to get better, learning new tricks as I go.
Building 5 more kits starting next week sometime.
Jay
Being that your making these for other people, I'm sure your back purging those welds. Would be a shame because that is some very good welding!!!!!
Of Course, their crap is made in China. I should know because my CX Racing headers will crack if you look at it wrong, I'm always repairing cracks at the welds. DO NOT BUY, make your own like Jay!
Being that your making these for other people, I'm sure your back purging those welds. Would be a shame because that is some very good welding!!!!!
of course I am! 100% backpurged. Wasnt cheap to backpurge all that pie. I have $150 just in argon invested on this thing LOL. Hoping to tame those numbers down after I get quicker
So upon doing some cardboard mockups and having some interest in being able to adjust the turbo to keep it way from the frame rail some more. I came up with this bracket. Im hoping to have this laser jet by Friday from 3/16 steel.
The slot for the turbo is made to pivot with the Hooker V-band outlet
I havnt bolted that all on. I'm borrowing this kit off my Friend to mock the kit up. All I have bolted on is the passenger side. I like the idea of keeping the heat behind the motor for sure. It is a really nice setup for sure.
I have the bracket laser cut, but need to adjust it a bit. fits the head MINT but i made it slightly too long. I just tacked a second setup up last night for a friend who is running stock Camaro accessories NO AC, i was able to move the pipes around slightly to make the lower rad hose a bit better. but what i plan on doing is buying a bunch of stock truck/LS2 style stats and extending them. Hopefully more photos soon. i am dealing with rebuilding a room in my basement due to a frozen pipe, which has turned into a complete reno converting what was a walk in closet into a laundry room. #happywifehappylife lol
So upon doing some cardboard mockups and having some interest in being able to adjust the turbo to keep it way from the frame rail some more. I came up with this bracket. Im hoping to have this laser jet by Friday from 3/16 steel.
The slot for the turbo is made to pivot with the Hooker V-band outlet
Jay
Who do you use to do the laser cutting?
I've designed some blower brackets, and I'd like to have extra's made now that I have a solid design.
Been a stranger on here the last week. I have another identical kit tacked up, and started on a a 3rd kit last night (NO AC) that makes the T-stat alot more accessible by using a LS3 style. gives TONS of clearance everywhere. it however may require a stand up style rad. Hoping to get this one welded up this weekend. Waiting on the guy that im building it for to send me some flanges for the wastegate
Well here is a non ac kit I'm building for a friend. This one will be getting a cold side and possible partial downpipe since I have my car apart. Little but of a different twist and the first version but makes the thermostat easier. Just an LS3 stat required. No custom extension. Plus miles of clearance around the turbo.
Ran out of argon again....back to the store hopefully Wednesday so I can wrap most of this up. My friend is shipping his turbo and gate to me shortly.
I have material to build 3 More of either style. This one being probably the most asked for.
Sadly no, I got argon on friday, been working on redoing my laundry room every night after the kids are in bed. Im hoping by next week that will be done! Its killing me!
Sadly no, I got argon on friday, been working on redoing my laundry room every night after the kids are in bed. Im hoping by next week that will be done! Its killing me!
