I recently purchased a 383 forged blueprint engine for my gta after installation I realized that the driver side exhaust from the header has no room between the crossmember and oil pan. Have any of you come across this and if so how did you run your exhaust. I'm assuming you changed the oil pan anybody out there have any recommendations?

 

Or is it okay to swap my l98 oil pan onto the 383? I believe the courts of oil is the same correct me if I'm wrong

 

Before changing oil pans I would check with blueprint on voiding the warranty if anything is changed or swapped. I know when I got my 383 blueprint engine for my 69 camaro I was so worried about doing anything to void my warranty thet I even left the branded blueprint valve covers on it till I was out of warranty. I even used the spark plugs they recommended, the oil they suggested and exact timing they wanted. The other option that might worth checking into is running true dual exhaust on it. Which honestly wouldn't be that bad of an idea given that those 383 crate engines start at 430HP trying to push that much air out of a 2-1/2" or even a 3" intermediate pipe would be choking that engine down. I have always been told by old school engine builders that you want 1" of diameter pipe for every 100hp you have. Maybe its just old mechanics tale but it has worked for me the last 25 years.

As for the blueprint engine itself it has been awesome! you made a great choice. I have since purchased a second blueprint 350 crate engine for my wifes 56 Belair

 

Yes you will need to change the oil pan.

Whether you can use your stock one depends on what block the 383 is built out of. If it's a 638 or 880 (modern 1-pc rear main seal 4.000" bore) then your stock L98 pan will work fine on it.

Unfortunately it's kinda a major witch with a capital B to change that out with the motor already in the chassis; butt at a certain level, you just gotta do what ya gotta do, with what ya got ta do it with, when ya gotta do it.

 

Unfortunately True dual dosent fit on the ta. I immediately changed the valve covers as I didn't want to be a walking advertisement for blueprint and got off the phone with blueprint today and they were suggesting other oil pans so I don't believe it will affect the warranty.

 

blueprint suggested a Canton race oil pan

(15-244T Small Block Chevy F Body Road Race Pan 1 Piece Seal)

a little shocking when I saw it was $600 plus needing the pickup. That's when I thought about using the stock one but that racing pan will give me an extra quart of oil ,worth it? More oil cant hurt.... can you confirm that the Canton pan will work for this trans am application and that blueprint is correct in suggesting it. Thanks

 

You have 2 options. Change the oil pan or fab up an exhaust section that goes from the headers back and merge behind the trans. The LS conversions do it all the time. They use X members w areas for the exhaust to pass through.

your 3in exhaust is fine for a 383. I had a 430hp/tg w a 3in. It was fine. I went to 3.5 when i put a blower on.

 

Thanks for the reply, yeah when looking at it today the only option would be to run the driver side from the header and turn right at the converter but then the exhaust would have to go towards the front of the car for a few inches to make it into the y pipe. Which would be kind of silly I guess I'm getting an oil pan. Do you have any experience or knowledge with the Canton racing oil pan?

 

well that’s all good stuff to know. Then I would just swap out your L98 pan on the new blueprint engine andgo for it. I know my 383 was built using a seasoned 1pc rear main seal block and the L98s are the 1pc rear main. My new blueprint 350 in the wife’s bel air is actually a new 1pc rear main block, not sure on the more current 383s?

 

Yes mine is also a one piece. I was contemplating the Canton oil pan as it gives me an extra quart of oil but the $600 price tag is hard to swallow. On the other hand if I'm doing all this work maybe I should at least get the upgrade of an extra quart out of it.

 

$600 for an extra quart of oil in a street-driven car...

*consults financial adviser*

Canton makes good stuff, butt I'm struggling with the cost/benefit ratio here, compared to your old pan.

 

An extra quart would have what benefit? Nothing really. I have that same pan (albeit the 2-piece RMS version) and the intent behind it is oil control in the sump. It has the lateral kickouts and trap doors to keep the oil surrounding the pickup. The scraper/windage screen is also a benefit.
The additional quart...not so much. That's my opinion anyway.
There is another advantage to having the added capacity. In the ultimate chase for reducing windage losses caused by the crank whipping the oil into a froth is that you can run just the 5 quarts and lower the oil level. The sump is still submerged and the lower level keeps the oil away from the rotating assembly and reduces the HP lost due to windage.

Personally, while I the like the Canton pan (and in my modest drag racing it keeps the oil where it needs to be at the launch) I could race as I do with a stock pan. In your case, I'd then take that savings and invest it a proper set of headers and a custom y-pipe.

Again, my 2 cents. 1.45 cents really after the CDN/US exchange rate.

 

Hard to beat this logic.

 

Keep in my mind what was mentioned above. To change the pan, the engine has to come out. Or very nearly so.

 

Sounds like the pan needs to be changed either way unless I'm reading it wrong. So pull it, put on the stock pan, then put that $600 towards getting a y-pipe/headers as you suggested and make sure it all fits before fully re-installing the engine.

 

Unless there's chassis interference, I would think that the BP pan could stay. Then some mid-length headers (like the Headman model I have) and a fabbed y-pipe to what ever cat back setup you have now.

Sort of like this:



That's a couple of chassis' ago but the idea is the same.
Headman headers. Fabbed y-pipe (could be in mild steel rather than stainless) and a Magnaflow or Flowmaster merge.
It's difficult to see (and I have better pictures) but the oil pan doesn't come close to headers. And I went with a mini-starter (OEM style ) for added clearance.

 

It might be more than you're willing to get involved in although you did buy an aftermarket engine!

Here's a better view.

 

what car is that on? I don't have the same room down the driver's side on my 88 gta.
I am currently using Doug's shorty headers and y pipe. The drivers side crosses over to passenger side between the oil pan and cross member. The drivers side runs out of room for exhaust just past stall converter.

 

Can any of you confirm the clearance is ok on the stock pan with the 383? I'm seeing some posts that talk about using a hammer to gain clearance on a 383. Id rather change the pan then adjust clearance on a new motor with a hammer. Any other options in pans?

 

The same exhaust has been on a couple of 86 Camaro chassis'.
I would think that the floor plans and engine fitment would be the same with an 88 Firebird.
The cat back portion is an old 3" Flowmaster that was built for any 3rd gen.
What room on the driver's side are you referring to?. The cat back runs down the passenger side between the driveshaft and floor pan. The same cat back was originally on an earlier Camaro with a catalytic converter and Edelbrock shorty headers and y-pipe in the traditional sense. Just as what you're dealing with. I tossed all of that. The forward part of the Flowmaster intermediate pipe was cut off and adapted to the custom y-pipe.

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/FLO-17233

 

Your stock pan will work w a 1 piece rear main seal. Id be really surprised of you couldn't do an exhaust like what has been posted in the pics w any pan.

 

I thought the floor pan was different, I will have to look again,

 

when I was under the car today there was no room to put the exhaust on the driver side unless it was fully below frame of car.

 

I also have a 700r4 trans, so the brace bar (torque arm)is also in the way, no?

 

I run a canton rr pan, don't forget to order correct oilpump pickup and plugs that don't come with it

 

it worked on this car and numerous others like it. If you look, theres plenty of room around the oil pan. This car could get even better clearance w an x member w recesses in it for the exhaust.

this isn't the best execution but you get the idea.

 

thanks, it's tough to tell but is that exhaust out below the oil pan, my car is lowered (only a inch) but I also live in NY. So ground clearance worries me, as my taxes go to everything other than paving the roads🙄. I will have to take a look with myself under the car while viewing this picture thank you

 

yes I noticed on their site that it said you needed the pickup and the plug thank you. Is one of the reasons you're using their pan for the exhaust as well?

 

I will post a number of exhaust installation pictures when I'm back at my desk this evening.
The lowest part of the entire exhaust is where it passes under the transmission crossmember. That crossmember was modified for some additional clearance and the pipes are tucked up as tight as they can go with out contact.
3" to the ground on a 1-1/2" lowered chassis.
As was suggested, yes, even more clearance could be gained with a crossmember such as Holley's which has arches built in for the pipes to pass under.
I have one waiting for a future upgrade.
For the record, the only part of the exhaust that is on the driver's side is the header and the portion of the y-pipe connected to it. The two sides transition together on the passenger side. The pipe was fabricated such that there's a hanger for it directly beneath the transmission extension housing. The TA support is on the driver's side and is not in the way.

 

For shorties, you will need to fab a ypipe to go under converter and merge past the normal point. Not runnin pipe towards front of engine. Or run stock style pan or see if a tube k member helps gain some room but i assume its the sump that causes the clearance issue

 

thanks the explanation clears it up a lot more

 

I was taking a look online at Holly for the crossmember the only one that I see is PART # 71222005HKR. Just to confirm if that what you are referring to. Thanks again

 

I have this crossmember on my car and can't recommend it enough. You'll need an adjustable trans mount from summit if you're running a Gen I small block and 700r4.

 

that's good to hear are you also using it to help Run Exhaust

 

will I have any problem with the fitment on the Gen 1 SBC with the 700R4

 

okay I think I'm going to go this route I'm going to buy the adjustable transmission mount and the

71222005HKR crossmember.

 

I have the entire blackheart system, headers and exhaust. The mount was pretty much required.

 

Thanks I just bought the cross member and the adjustable mount

 

Here a few pictures of what put together over the years. A few different iterations as you can see.
Hedman headers.
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/h...maro/year/1986
I cut the ball flange off and went with a 3 bolt flange. These days if I were to do it again I'd go for v-band clamps. They were rare back then.







Plenty of clearance for the headers but you can probably see the y-pipe has seen better days.
Here's a shot from below showing the general layout.



I've pictures of the modified factory crossmember but I see you've purchased a Holley version.

 

thank you very much, I think I will keep the shorty headers for now, they are coated and wrapped. Appreciate the picks It will be much easier to show my exhaust guy.

 

There was a reference to an adjustable transmission mount.
Toddoky, the former Holley engineer who helped decided the LS swap parts for our cars had mentioned that that particular crossmember isn't a direct fit when used with a Gen 1 SBC.
IIRC, it's because the engine/transmission mounting plane is approximately 5/8" further forward with an LS engine. There's an adaptor tab Holley sells that will account for this. This is going from memory but I'll post the links to those conversations and you should be able to get the details. It's not a big deal but worth mentioning.
FTR: I've never used mine (it's still in the box) but I intend to with my 350 and 4L60. One day. Maybe.

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/exha...xhaust-12.html

Jump to page 12 as that's where toddoky and I start this compatibility conversation.

 

That post is filled with great info, On the holly site description, I don't see mention of use with 700r4, is it same distance ? i Will need the mounting plate with sbc and 700? Or am I confused and the adjustable mount only needed?

 

I used the 4l60 tab and it wasn't like holy crap how am I gonna make this work, but it was far enough offset that the adjustable mount was required. Fore or aft I can't remember, but I've had zero issues with the setup, it's just a lot of fasteners to remember to tighten once everything is in place.

 

I think the post above answers your questions.
The whole setup will move backward when compared to the LS installation so I can see that the "tab" needs to be supplemented by some other means.
BTW: 700R4 = 4L60.

Out of curiosity, why did you get this crossmember? Is it that you intend to run the pipes from each shorty header in the same fashion as a long tube? Makes sense if you are. Something I wouldn't have thought of and it saves using (IMO) that performance robbing Y-pipe that otherwise brings everything to the passenger side.

 

yes I bought it because I didn't realize that not having the stock oil pan was going to change my exhaust route.correct im going to use the shorty in the same fashion. Just too many things going on at the beginning of Summer exhaust wasn't even a thought. As so many things have popped up that have been unexpected. So at this point I'm just trying to figure out what I'm doing as I go. To the point where as I'm writing this I'm going to order that bracket.
I thought my only option was to cross over to the passenger side further back and use the Y , Do I have an option of not crossing over? I owned this car and been on this site for about 30 years now you would think my knowledge would be a little better

 

As my hot rodding friend likes to say, " It's always something!"
Such is the nature of the hobby.
Case in point: Built a 355 which was a step up from what I had (which was already a 12 second all street car).
The weak link now became the transmission.
So I commissioned a friend of a friend to build a stronger 4L60. I selected excellent internals and he assembled it all.
Thing is he put it all in a Corvette 4L60 case which doesn't fit in the 3rd architecture!
So I went down that crossmember rabbit hole (part of which was that thread I linked). Never did resolve it fully as there were a lot of other life projects that had priority.
Eventually I gave up on racing for nearly 10 years and just kind of cruised it with the occasional WOT stab before that transmission gave up. Then I had another builder put together an even stronger one. This time in the correct case.
So far so good.
Yep. It always something.
What next?

 

This is the tab 71223003HKR correct?

 

Yes, I do believe so. Idk what torque arm you have, but I used a umi adjustable with the round end and their bushing for stock mount. So if you're running a stock style mount it should transfer over without modifications.

 

thank you sir!

 

my torque arm is stock. I just purchased the " tab ". And then of course had to spend some more money and bought the Panhard bar relocation kit.