87WS6

iTrader: (1)

Well less than an hour ago I almost wrecked my car. I was driving back from my girlfriends place and I was in the Trans-AM. I get cought in the rain. You would think that it wouldn't be a problem. Anyway I am crusing down the street in the left most lane. The light turns red and I stop. Light goes green and I start to move. I feather the gas and get up to about 30 when my car starts to slide and is uncontrollable.

I end up pointed straight for the street light. When my car hits the curb of the median I pop up on the curb and the car stops. Just before hitting the post. I missed it by six inches. I pull back onto the road and start driving. Everything feels fine. Steering is good brakes work. No alignment issues that I can detect. I make it the rest of the way home.

I park my car and begin to survey the damage. I can't find any. No curb rash on the rims and my cars nose and air dam are intact. As are my fog lights. So I got lucky.

My question is this: Does anyone else have problems with thier thirdgen in the rain? Mine is near undrivable and I nearly wreck the thing everytime the weather is bad. I have only driven it a couple times in the rain. (Only when there is no choice or I get cought in it on my way home.)

I posted this on the suspension board because I figure you guys might be able to tell me what the deal is. My tires have good pressue. I checked last night. My tread is good. I have no brake or suspension issues. I only have a near stock LB9 305TPI and 700R4 Transmission with 2.73 gears. Nothing unusual and no awesome power under the hood that should make the car behave like that. Why is it the car handles so bad in the rain?

Also I have no idea what brand tires I have. They don't say. They just give the size, the M&S rating recommended pressure information and that's about it. They are stock 245/50/VR16 tires. The same as what came from the factory.

Any information would be appreciated. If you need more information on my car see sig or ask. I will respond as I am curious about this.

The car handles badass when it's dry out. Corners awesome. I just can't figure out why it's so bad in the rain. I know theres no weight really in the back. Which leads to some fishtailing in the rain. But it's worse than that. My car will just flat out slide in the rain. Sorry for making it such a long read, but I would really like to know what's up with this.

laiky

You probably have some worn or deteriorating tires. They may not have been good when new. I would reccoment a premium all season hi po tire, my self, i'm about to get a set of BFG KDWS's. they are 113 each from costco installed. I remember a friend back in college had a TPI 305 that he decided to race against a K-Car in the rain. I'll make the story short he hit a bridge!! Now he was a moron but he also had parts store tires on a car with very abrupt throttle response and great torque off idle. I have heard people complain about Camaro's in the rain for manny years but it always seems to be TPI auto cars that are the problem. At present i drive a fuel injected 383 with a stick and i still don't have any problems. I blame it on a tight converter and that abrupt throttle response, combine that with 2.73's and once the tires break they will spin up quickly. My 2C

MdFormula350

that is very strange, my car with all my suspension upgrades is good in the rain, and was just as good in stock form.

i had to lock the brakes up in the rain from a 45 mph i slid for just a bit but missed the stupid car that pulled out on my by a few inches.

i try to keep good performance tires on the rims at all times, and try to have over 1/2 tank of gas.

my other two thirdgens, were also pretty good in the rain; no driving problems at all when just driving regular with no sudden acceleration.

MdFormula350

like laiky said, its most likely the tires.

glad u didnt hurt your car, u got lucky 87WS6.

Tibey

I agree... my IROC with the old Gatorback 245/50-16 tires was very good on the rain, my '87 Z28 with 235/60-15s Eagle IIs is good in the rain too, my '86 with 215/65-15s Bridgestone Eagers is not so good, but the thread is very shallow, time to get new tires for this one...

MrDude_1

my 91 currently handles fine in the rain, however my 82 with the 400 in it was totally undriveable....

tire choice is the biggest varible in wet weather handling though.. put new tires on it (i hear nittos work GREAT in the rain) and it will probly behave totally diffrent.

CrazyHawaiian

It had to be your tires. You describe exceptional performance in the dry so maybe the tires are just not made for all weather driving. I am riding on Potenza S-03's and wet handling is AWESOME. Very expensive fix, but you'll probably need some better tires for better wet traction.

Side note, sounds crazy but you might want to go out in an empty parking lot sometime when its raining and practice recovering from a slide or fishtail. There are a few things you can do to regain control when sliding in the rain and prevent yourself from crashing. Namely do not use the brakes, and countersteering is good.

Justins86bird

I agree with everyone on the tires. Cheap tires work poorly in the rain. Combine that with a smooth slippery spot on the road and trouble starts. My Radial T/As were nearly bald and very bad in the rain. Even when new they weren't so great. I put on my g-force KDW tires and its so much better. But still its better to drive slower when its wet out. The backend always seems to want to slide out on corners.

trans87

My car was exactly the same when I had the dried out BFs on the car when I first got it. Any water get on the tires and it was like driving in an ice rink. Soon as I got new tires the car handled much better in the rain. Now the car just doesn't like going around corners in the rain but when just driving straight she is stuck to the ground

Wolfpack

Check for Recommended Tire pressure for the Maro not whats written on the Tire, as that is max pressure. Over pressure makes for great Handling when dry and horrible when wet.

Personal exp with Maro's and Corvette leads me to believe that our cars are great dry weather handlers but are poor when the weather gets nasty(combination of Torque and stiff suspensions imo) so only thing I can say is Check the PRessure, Get good all weather tires(you get what you pay for imo) and tread lightly

87WS6

iTrader: (1)

I thought it could be my tires. But the tread is really good and the tire pressure is right on. In fact I just filled them up the day before as they were all a little low.

Since the tires are probably cheap ones I will go with that. However since they match factory specs according to my manual, I thought that they should be better than they are.

Oh well I'll keep them for burnouts or something and get a better set of tires for the car.

Now anyone have any good recomendations for a good street tires for dry and wet conditions? It never snows here. Occasionally ices over but I can avoid driving the car in those conditions. Thanks for the advice.

Slo86TA

I have to agree with everyone on this that it is your tires. I purposely slide my car in the rain and still able to control her with the Michelins on her.

Electron_Blue

tirewise...what tires are the best bang for the buck...

laiky

see my first reply, KDWS's for 113 installed is pretty good in my book

2.73's Suck

Ive got yokahama(sp?) avid s/t's on mine and they are great in the rain 235/60/15s for like 50 bucks from tirerack.com and another 10 or 15 for mounting and balancning at a shop.

BADBIRD009

you could just throw a bag or two of sand or salt in there if its that bad.

i personaly have never had many problems in the rain, then again i dont get on it when its slick out. give it just enough gas to go and if they do spin you let off it in time to keep the car from spinin around.

87WS6

iTrader: (1)

I wasn't going 30 miles an hour when the car decided to hydroplane into the curb. I feather the gas because the car will break loose and go sideways in the rain pretty easy.

The time before this that I had to drive it in the rain, I was making a turn and I got spun around facing the wrong direction. I wasn't doing but about 10 miles an hour when that happend.

So far I have been fortunate not to have damaged the car or myself. But right now the car scares the **** out of me in the rain.

BTW I found out what tires I have. Bear in mind that they were on the car when I bought them. This was not my choice.

Grand Spirit Aqua Flow GTX 245/50VR16 tires. They even have the water grooves in them. I found out what they were on the web. The supposed specs look good on the web site. But in reallity these tires suck. On dray pavement I have no complaints. To me a tire with "Aqua Flow" on the side should be halfway decent in the rain. At least safe on a mostly stock vehicle of any kind. In reality they smoke the fat one in the rain.

I am looking at BFGoodrich G-Force KDWS tires now. About 107 or something on www.tirerack.com

87WS6

iTrader: (1)

BTW anyone ever even heard of Grand Spirit tires? I never have. The tread is still 80% there and these tires still suck the grand one.

laiky

if you have a costco membership, you can get the KDWs's installed for 113 a piece. I used to swear by tire rack but if costco can get what you want, they mount and balance on the correct equipment, give you lifetime flat fixes and rotation and can warrantee the tire if anything goes wrong without having to remove the tire and send it through the mail. Besides the mounting and balancing is included in their price.

AGood2.8

You want the ultimate rain tire? Goodyear F1 GS-D3. This tire sticks as predictable in the wet as it does dry.

Here's a quote from a professional track time test reveiw,
"On the track in the wet, the Pilot Sport-equipped car continued to understeer slightly, yet remained predictable and ran lap times that were competitive with the Potenza S-03 Pole Position, but couldn’t match the lap times of the Eagle F1 GS-D3."

83firebirdS/E

I have Grand Spirts on my formula (16 inch size). Lets just say the are the sh!ttiest tires I have ever seen. I could spin the tires with ease on dry pavement with a stock 305 tbi and 2.73's. Wet was I laugh. Snow was a comedy act. I tried driving in snow once and I made it only 5 ft out of the garage befor getting stock in 1.5" of snow!! I was forced to replace the rears with BFG's. I would get KDW's if I were you. Good luck man.

88TPI406GTA

I agree also that the tires suck...it has nothing to do with tread life...they are just cheap tires...the design and/or tread compound isn't working...I would suggest finding a tire with decent siping to help improve wet weather traction...

Options include Kumho 712, BFG KDW, Firestone Indy 500...it depends on the price range you are looking for...The Kumho tires work well, but have a shorter tread life.

Whatever tire you decide to use, ditch the ones you have...sooner rather than later...

ShiftyCapone

iTrader: (7)

I have expensive tires (Goodyear Eagle F1-GS 17x9) and you can see what the rain did to my car in the rain. I hit a concrete wall on an on ramp at like 25mph. Pics are in the website. The wider your tires are the more problems you will have in the rain (all tread patterns and tire compounds aside). You are dissapating the weight of your car over a larger area and a larger distributed load will not push the water out the same as a narrower tire would. In essence your tires cannot "ice scate" with a really wide tire. You hydroplane a lot easier. Now of course this is completely opposite on dry roads but no one builds their cars to be fast in the rain. The tread pattern really come into play here as to what is the most effective way to displace the water and maintain a contact point on the road.

FLYNLOW92rs

iTrader: (53)

\
Yes, Yes they do....

Although i have a 305 POWERPLANT pushing those things.....:lala:

SLP IROC-Z

iTrader: (1)

my toyos are a decent in the rain, Fz4s 245 50 16s. i find them to be a really good all around tire. wet, dry, hot, cold, stopping, braking, accelerating. the only place ive found them to leave more to be desired is the track but i wouldnt expect a radial unless its a DR to perform good at the track.

jpk91rs

I am happy with the Kumhos I have on my Ram Air and will probably use them on my 91 RS. They are awesome in the rain, the car is totally predictable. Also, these tires are the 275/40/17's. :rockon: :rockon:

TomP

I can't offer too much; I've never slid in the rain or snow unless I wanted to kick the back end out- gets a great response from the passenger! Tried it a few weeks ago, "first time" with the new suspension in the rain, and didn't lose it.

I've had the following tires over the past 9 years:

1. Goodyear GT+4 (P215/65r15 front, P245/60r15 rear)
2. Daytona Radial S/R (P215/65 front, P255/70r15 rear)
3. BF Goodrich Radial T/A (P225/60r15 front, P275/60r15 rear, and currently using P245/60r15's in the rear now)

So maybe if you want to try one of those sets of tires...

It could be too, that I do slide, but just correct it without thinking. Next time it snows, bring your car into a parking lot, and practice recovering from skids. The time it takes your car to react on snow takes much longer, so you can learn what to do really easily. The tires don't "bite" as quickly. In the rain, the tires bite faster... and if you spin out on dry roads, you'd better work lightning-quick on that steering wheel/gas pedal, because the "bite" time is instantaneous.

Glad you didn't hit the pole. Definately get to an alignment shop soon.

Oh and I've never put concrete or sand or bricks or wood or steel or anything in the hatch in the snow. That's just ridiculous, in my opinion. Adding 50 pounds to a +2,000 pound car isn't going to do a damn thing for traction in a few inches of snow! Make sure your tires have some tread to them and you'll be fine.

89IROCZ28

iTrader: (14)

Any chance your tires are directional and are mounted incorrectly? On dry pavement it wouldn't matter too much. In the rain it would be very poor.

Just a thought.

waltersb

I have BFG Comp T/As 245/50 R16s all round and although rain is always a problem with our cars....

unless I was stupid they haven't got me into trouble yet (note the 'unless I was stupid bit')

and my rear tires are getting pretty bald.

Barry85Iroc

I bought 4 Yokomama's from Discount Tire for like $130.00 ea., and they do VERY WELL in the rain, but mine's a 5-speed

Project_1986_TA

I dont seem to have that much of a problem in my T/A unless i give it too much gas then i can get sideways doing 40mph. Although when it does break loose it is a PITA to keep it under control. I even have really sticky tires that are pretty new too.

George

Even though there's tred left on the tyre it could be that the compound is hard as hell.

The cars are inherently bad in the wet but you get used to it and begin to think that they're not that bad after all.

However, I had a 1978 Caprice wagon which felt comfortable at 70-80 mph in heavy rain - my 83 TA has never been like that in heavy rain but it's also not as bad as you're describing your car to be.

Chickenman35

A lot of the local Autocrossers up here run the Kumho 712's as their street tires. Vancouver BC....where it's nearly always raining.

A GOOD rain tire depends on compound as much, if not more, than tread patten. Tires with a high Silica content work well in the Rain. The Kumho 712's have a high Silica content as do the Yokohama AVS series. A tire with a very high tread wear rating is usually not that great in the rain.

waltersb

Oddly enough it rained today for the first time in like a month, we've been waiting for it... wishing for it even....