is it worth the money to buy the umi performance cnc machined tie rod adjusting sleeves versus the stock parts?

 

your alignment person will love you, and they will be usable for longer than the stock ones which rot pretty fast and seize up

 

good deal.i will invest in those then.

 

Plus its stronger and eliminates flex and deflect on hard cornering

 

Worth it no question. Huge design improvement when compared to the stock stuff.

 

Seems like a waste of money to me if your factory adjusters are fine.
Can anyone produce any numbers concerning flex or are these just advertising claims? I replaced a bent tie rod end and the adjuster on that side was fine, in fact, the bend started right outside of the adjuster on the threads. That's something to think about, the tie rod went into plastic deformation before the adjuster. Does that mean the adjuster has a greater range of elastic deformation? I doubt it.

I just did my own alignment in my garage and turned the factory adjusters by hand without a problem. If you alignment guy has problems with the factory adjusters while its up on a rack then I think they are either damaged or he is just not very bright.

You could spend your money on many other things with a much greater bang for the buck

 

You can FEEL the difference the first time you drive the car!

 

Feel? So then using the stock tie rods, you can actually feel a difference? I seriously dought it. If theres any change, then it would be after replacing struts, bushings, or getting a new strut tower brace. Having aftermarket tie rods installed do NOTHING,,,, other than giving a bit more reassurance of your alignment. Go hit a good sized pot hole and then tell us if it got bent just like a stock one would. There would be no difference in feel because all that tie rod does is allow for adjustment of the wheels (toe in-out). Thats it,, it has nothing to do with the smoothness of driving.

 

Besides, there is no performance in the aftermarket tie-rod, just durability, looks, and high cost.

 

We are not talking about the tie rods, but the adjusters. The stock adjusters are made for as cheap as GM could buy them. The after market adjusters were made to improve the situation. I could definitely feel the difference, just like I could feel the difference with the STB, and when I put on Sub Frame connectors. IF everything is worn out, and sloppy, then you might not notice. On a maintained vehicle, it's not the change sub frame connectors are, but there is a difference.
That's my experience. If you don't think it's possible, don't bother.
I think the best comparison is to polyurethane bushings. If you like the poly better than rubber, then get the adjusting sleeves. If it doesn't matter to you which bushings are on your car, forget them.

 

The adjusters!!!! OOOOHHHHHHH. Please excuse my abrupt entry. What is it that you feel?

 

It gives a more solid feel to the steering, like there was just a hair of give in the stockers.
Like I said, if you like polyurethane bushings, you will probably like these.
It might be you can't feel much of a difference if you have rubber bushings, I can't say.

 

Gotcha.

 

The stock split sleeves are marginal at best, they do bend under load. The solid sleeves are a great upgrade. The threads are regular 5/8unf RH & LH, you can get sleeves and lock nuts super cheap from speedway outlets. Alu hex, swaged steel, normal straight....whatever you want. Want a bumpsteer kit? The adjustable tie rod ends are super cheap also. No reason to pay stupid money for that stuff.

 

well i just bought the moog stock style adjusting sleeves.granted they are original design they have a life time warranty sooo...cant beat that.and my originals werent seized and according to carfax its never been aligned.or at least never recorded.so i think factory in this case is ok.the original reason i was asking was because idler arm was shot.just replaced it all since it was original and it was gonna be apart anyways.

one more question...i know this is probably off topic but it also pertains to my rebuild and i dont wana start a new thread.... can a pitman arm on a third gen not be replaced?i cant find one anywhere.noone even lists one or can find one.

 

Dont worry about the pitman. If you go to Sears for an alignment, they WILL RECOMEND a new pitman just to squeeze out more money from you. I think there is a pitman bushing though. The rubber boot that you see when you look sown from the top is the rubber boot from the center link, not the pitman. So dont worry about the pitman arm.

 

Thats one component you'll never need to replace is the pitman arm on a 3rdgen.

 

carfax is one of the biggest crocks out there. the only things on it are whats reported through insurance and such. If somebody fixes damage themselves, or at a shop out of pocket, it never will show up on carfax. For that matter, i dont know how a 3rd gen would ever have a record of alignments on carfax. all that showed up on mine year back was title changes and registration.

 

Have you ever heard of the placebo effect?

 

They bend under load huh? Under how much load does their bending become significant, and what do you define as significant in this case?

Have you tested and compared the flexural modulus of a stock adjuster vs the solid sleeve?
Furthermore have you measured (or at least modeled) the forces at work in the steering system to determine how much stress the adjusters actually are subjected to?

Got an FEA? Any data whatsoever?


I always find it interesting that on thirdgen.org, in the absence of any hard data, people default to the notion that since it costs money and looks cool, it has to work.

 

my carfax went back to where the car was sold.where the car went.when the oil was changed.new tires.brakes checked.

 

Yeah sure, I made it a science experiment. Of course not. What you do is, have an assistant sit in the car and rapidly turn the wheel from left to right, then you lie under the car and look at the sleeve. You can see it flexing.

Reliable data doesn't always have to be backed up by tons of measurements and a complete science project.

I'm the last person to spend money on stuff because it looks cool. I completely redid my car and i didn't buy aftermarket arms and what not because I feel they don't offer any gains. No sense in stiffening up the arms if the chassis/crossmember itself flexes. It's just relocating the issue.

I severely detest your attempt at ridiculing my input here.

 

Well I severely detest the fact that almost every post telling people to buy things like this has 0 data to back it up.

I will however grant that your visual observation of flex is of value and I will recreate this experiment to validate your specific findings.

Had you posted this information to begin with, I would have performed the experiment myself before questioning the veracity of your claims.

Even so, rapidly moving the wheel while stationary hardly represents the forces exerted on the adjuster on a moving vehicle. We can only make assumptions.

I don't like assumptions, I like numbers.

 

I bought coleman racing sleeves, they were cheap and alot more heavy duty just by looking at it. My stock sleaves looked fine and I have a new mexico car so there were no rust issues. If your concerned about spending an extra $20 bucks, then i feel sorry for you.

 

My opinion about the tie rod adjusting sleeve is its a better design overr the stock one. With that said, anyone replacing the front steering parts should upgrade to the newer design even if dose not do anything else. My front end kit included the newer one and was impressed with the ease of adjustments & locking.

 

Agreed, they are worth it for ease of adjusting alone.

 

Split sleeves are known to skip threads also under very heavy loads.

 

Hey guys. I am looking for some clarification on these adjusting sleeves. I want to use them for a custom project. They are 5/8-18 thread correct? How long are they? I need something around 4 or 5 inches long?

 

Yes 5/8 UNF LH & RH

not sure exactly how long but you can go a lot longer than most of the aftermarket ones

 

Thanks! Im actually going to use them for some Corvette control arms I am designing. I need them to be 4-5" long.

If anyone has some on their car and would be willing to measure for me that would be great.

 

Corvette control arms? Why would you need the camaro length for a vette control arm?

if you need the camaro length, hold the 2 tie rod ends together, measure the length of thread, deduct the thickness of the 2 nuts and a little more and you have the max. length of your sleeve. That's what I did but it turns out the moog ends are too long so I need to cut some off them and the sleeve... a minor issue.

 

I am making adjustable upper front control arms for my C4 Corvette race car and Im using 5/8" heim joints on the ends. I used to own a 3rd gen and thought the threads would be the same but wasnt sure so I asked.

 

What model year? If C2/3 Savitske (SCandC) sells adjustable arms. They are the arms that were orignally manufactured and sold by PolePosition Racing. The PP ones were just universal units, SCandC has bolt on ones.