ShiftyCapone

iTrader: (7)

Well the time has come for me to put money into the RS and get it back on the road. As many of you know I wrecked the car 2 years ago and it has been sitting since patiently awaiting funds. I just sold my 95 Z to help alleviate some monthly payments that can now be directed into the RS. I will be putting a tremendous amount of money into the body and brakes to get her back to show room shape. Needless to say this leaves me with slim pickens for the motor. As I pay for body work and brakes I will be patching together a cool combo for the 305 until I can finish a scary Gen II or III build. Just for some fun I want your guys opinions on a unique TBI build. If all goes well I plan on having the car done by the end of the summer in hopes of getting a few track runs in before the season ends. Here is a list of the parts i will be keeping and the parts that will be going. Suspension, traction, gears and fueling are not an issue and are already taken care of. I want some ideas on some sort of heads and cam combo you TBI gurus would like to see in a car. Tuning is also not an issue and will be done via my buds WB02 and chip burning stuff. Let me see your ideas!

What I am getting rid of
B-body LT1 cam (it sucks)
Flowtech headers (they suck) Going with Macs or 2055's

What I am keeping
Edelbrock TBI intake (bored to 2")
Possibly the TBI spacer with various track runs to vouch for its effectiveness.
Ignition stuff (MSD)
T5 and 3.42 POSI
Stock TBI (unless I pull vacuum with the new cam)

My original plan was to find a used Hot Cam and 081 heads. Well I can get a nice hot cam for 100 bucks but I am having a heck of a time finding some 081 heads. I would go for some 416's but the Edelbrock TBI intake does not fit well with them and I do not want to grind on it to get it to fit. Azolfan and Bruce shed the light to me on this issue. I also pondered the idea of building up some bare SR torquer 305 heads.

So what would you guys like to see? Any crazy durations you want me to experiment with? Injector sizes? Fuel pressure? Anyone have some 081 or SR torquer heads I can buy?

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

cc306 meant for a LT-1 as I have seen one used for $100.00. Y-body LT1 cam (whats in mine).
Smaller injectors and alot of pressure- 4.3s with 22 or so PSI.

Dewey316

I don't know that crazy duration will get you anywhere. You can only spin so high. My combo doesn't really start to pick up steam unitl 3k.

I say, don't mess around.



You know you want to.

SchwarzCamaroRS

LOLOLOLOLOLOL that would be nice... ive heard of 500+ hp out of a 4.3L TBI with a vortech supercharger, so imagine what that 5.0L would make... lol

BronYrAur

iTrader: (1)

Yeah, I'll second that SC. There's been a lot of talk lately around here about superchargers. Let's see ya roll with that Shifty, that'd be pretty sweet. Otherwise I'd say some decent heads and a cam in the 218/228 neighborhood with as much lift you can fit. Best part is, we know you'll do it right and not half-a$$ the job like so many people do. Let's hear some more thoughts guys.

Dewey316

The roots style stand to have alot more success on TBI than a centrafugal does.

Do it.

thedogs

I say get the relativley low cost torquer sr's, and the supercharger. I can't think of a better combo then good heads and a SC. Also I think a good job without extravagances is more important and relative to most uf us. I think that would have more intrest because it is easier in reach.

I'm chuffed you doing the rebuild as well.
Good luck :-)

cali92RS

383 +

BronYrAur

iTrader: (1)

"Unique TBI build"

Dewey, I agree on those roots style blowers, they look like the best options. I remember a while back seeing a guy on the classifieds selling that exact SC for a super low price, wish I had the money to buy that oooo yeah.

cali92RS

C'mon...

OK, mine may not be TBI related, but sticking a supercharger on a 305?

Why not just go for the popular 335 stroker option.

If u have to build up that 305, i say zz4 cam, vortec heads and manifold. Thats as far as i would go.

Edit: If i didnt live in cali, i would get that HSR on a 400 so fast. I like proven stuff. How many people on this board have gotten a supercharger to work well on a TBI?

25THRSS

I second the roots blower idea. Go with the holley tbi truck kit and make it work. If not, get a real cam, some aluminum heads like the L98's or maybe even the trick flows, through they are expensive, high CR, nice exhaust, etc. I could go on, but you get my drift.

ssxmac

iTrader: (1)

just outta curiosity...

People always say no to the centrifugal style sc b/c of all the tuning issues w/ TBI. You're saying go with the roots blower, does this eliminate the tuning problems b/c the boost comes after fuel and air pass through the TB? I really think that would be totally bad ***.

Wouldnt he need a new hood if he went the roots style route? that things gotta be pretty damn tall.

Otherwise i'll second the vote for the SR's or Vortecs, watch ebay.

-chillen

90RS305

Holy crap, now we get to watch both azvolfan AND Shifty do a LO3 build up?! How great is this!! Chris, if you supercharged that beast, I would fly out there just to see it (and then somehow talk you into letting me drive it )

Bruce (90RS305)

azvolfan

Shifty,

You don't have to grind away at the intake to get it to fit 416 heads. We did it, but it ended up we did not have to. James came up with the idea of using a screws all and cutting it to the four lengths we needed and then bent them to the proper angle needed for them to come out of the block and go pretty much straight up. The intake sat right down over it slick as a whistle. You will them be using nuts to secure the intake rather than bolts. But I have not had any problem with it so far.

Just something to consider.

azvolfan

Sounds like a plan Burce. We can go on my buddy passes!

Dewey316

Well, it still has tuning issues, as you are still forcing air into the system, but you take care of a couple of the critisism that TBI gets with centra blowers. Since the TBI is on top of it, the injectors themself never see boost persay, so you don't have to compensate the FP to over come the boost + enrich. IIRC Kingsta1on did a 144 blower, with a c950 TBI setup on a 355, got somewhere in the neighbor hood of 500hp/550tq. The two things to work out there, will be 1 getting enough fuel period. Support that blower at even 5psi will likely more than max out the 90pph injectors. Problem number two, is properly fueling under boost. Hopefully the speedreader and $60 code will be out by then, That should make the computer side of things easier.

kdrolt

Fairly low budget.
Unique TBI build.

I don't care what cam you use because no cam will make it unique unless you use a high-lift race cam (which won't happen in a street car).

The blower is too expensive, period.

There is only one other option: buy or get get a freebie intake manifold that can be cut and rewelded for dual TBI. Revise the ECM to run a second set of injector drivers. Use two Rochester 220 TBIs. That would be unique. And cheap if you can DIY.

Dewey316

Well, yes unique is sometimes hard to do. Shifty will come up with something. I have a list of idea's I would love to try, if I had more money. I'll hit him on AIM, and give him a list of my crazy ideas .

On the forced induction note.... I may just give everyone what they want.

ShiftyCapone

iTrader: (7)

By unique I really meant cam and injector selection wise. I should have substituted the word 'unique' for 'neat'. The only way I would try a blower application is if I could land one for next to nothing. Which will unlikely happen and I hadn't even planned on it becuase of cost. I am willing however to pay for a custom cam with certian specs that people would like to see TBI behave with. That is unique in the fact that we don't have to many people that try different cams with proper tuning.

Pablo

iTrader: (1)

and what are the odds of me having not one but TWO 2" throttle bodies Id like to sell! What a perfect addition to their projects. One is a massaged 670 holley with GM injector pod and GM "90" lb injectors

The other is a factory 454 TBI unit, ill throw in the stock 305 injectors go go with it. PM me if your interested.

*shameless sales pitch*

ShiftyCapone

iTrader: (7)

Perfect. I will send you a PM later today. I was going to try to stick with the stock unit but I am afraid I will pull vacuum with the new cam.

Chuck!

Keeping budget and the community in mind, I'd like to see a 1.5 rocker hot-cam, with the LB9 heads. It'd be .492 lift which is where, personally, Id like to be and its not so radical so to be hard to tune. Plus this would be a combo that people could easily duplicate assuming we got the chip burn down, like I never did with my combo.

Dewey316

The hot cam would be interesting.

Actualy, A couple of crewbies here, have had a swirl port theory going, aftering seeing how my cam reacted with the swirl port heads. Low lift, long duration cam may be the route to go....

dimented24x7

iTrader: (2)

I think the 081's would be a good match to teh cam, but they definatly would need some work. A good porting and larger valves would be in order.

ShiftyCapone

iTrader: (7)

This is the plan providing I can find some. About 1.5 years ago they were all over this area. Now it seems as if they are all picked over. Must keep looking. I can get a new bare set of worlds for 450 bucks. I could just build the heads myself whch would tack on some more.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

I am running worked 305 TPI heads and a LT1 cam on top of my 355 . Makes gobs of torque and decent horsepower. If I had someone willing to burn chips for me (as I am a poor college student) I bet I could make even more horsepower and torque. I made 265 rwhp with TBI and 275 with a carb. The carb had alot more torque though.

TonyC

iTrader: (1)

Run Vortec heads, a Carb Intake, and a Decent sized cam and see if you can get in the 12's with the 305.

Chuck!

Interesting, keep the heads right around .430 lift and go for ~215 duration? I just have a hard time seeing those heads making power at anything over 5200-5500 rpm.

Dewey316

thus the long duration. actualy, i think a cam that is say 220* 220* .450 .540 116 would be a nice fit, since you have the big swirl inducer blockage, no use going with high lift, and killing off your velocity. also, since the exaust ports don't have the same blockage, I am not sure a dual patter cam is needed.

**note** this theory came about after quite a few beers were consumed.

In other experment news... I think I have secured a pair of eaton M90's. stay tuned.

sunset92

i posted on another string about the 081's you can get for 474 bucks!
1.94 int 1.5 exh valves, ported polished and .510 lift, also they are magnafluxed. bronze valve guides, free shipping all for 474 buckerooni's if you want i'll get the num,ber again for them.

DM91RS

It's a shame the LO3's came with the swirl ports instead of the 081's because if I remember correctly your car has low miles didn't it Shifty? I agree with Chuck about the hot cam sounding like a good project. I found a ZZ4 cam for cheap $95

sunset92

i have the performer rpm intake and the holley 670 and in a few days i will have my 081's with 1.94 valves!!! i'll let you know how it goes! right now i am in the process of putting on a centerforce dual friction clutch. and i put on my hypertech power charger and it fits nicley!

ShiftyCapone

iTrader: (7)

Hey thanks for the heads up. Let me look into them and I will get back at you with a PM.

Gunny Highway

iTrader: (1)

Yeah, but a .492 lift cam is HUGE for a 305, not including the tuning it would require to work with the TBI. . . hell, it's bigger than what I'm running in my 350.

What's the LSA of the hot cam?

DM91RS

I think (without checking so don't hold me to it) that the LSA is 112.

I don't think .492 plus lift is too much. I've been running .480 for years and have seen others run the ZZ4 in a 305. It has lift up to .510

ShiftyCapone

iTrader: (7)

The Hot cam should not be too hard to tune or feed with fuel. I have been pricing some worked 081's and it looks like that is the route I will go. I will keep you all posted.

Gunny Highway

iTrader: (1)

For easier tuning, I would look for something with 116 LSA. It seems to be the sweet spot for easy tuning.

BronYrAur

iTrader: (1)

I don't think you'll find any kind of performance cam with that kind of separation. 112 is ok in a 305, 110 is getting harder to tune, but 110 in a 350 may not be too bad.

The cam I'm planning for my buildup (hopefully) is a .488/.509 lift cam.

Gunny Highway

iTrader: (1)

That's why you get a mild performance cam with that kind of LSA for easy tuning, then you drop some 1.6 rockers in there to bump the lift up to something like what you're trying to reach.

I think people put FAR too much weight into the lift of cams, rather than looking at good heads and usable duration.