TBI Throttle Body Injection discussion and questions. L03/CFI tech and other performance enhancements.

Dual TBI yet again...

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Old Apr 16, 2005 | 11:17 PM
  #1  
odddoylerules's Avatar
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From: TACOMA WA
Car: 1992 rs 355 TBI **swapped**
Engine: 80 Ford Fiesta GHIA dual carb
Transmission: 72 Cutlass S 350/350 3.42
Axle/Gears: s10 tq converter/stock rear gear
Dual TBI yet again...

ok so heres my idea.

2 454 tbi's
4 injectors that are half the pulse width of stock
2 stock 454 ss or suburban 454 ecu's
Dual Quad intake
455 Olds
Torque cam (like a trucks)

the question:

Is there a way to use 1 stock GM ECU to control both TBI units? Or will I require another ecu to work the second tbi?

The trucks were all done by 4000 right? so is my cam. 1 cubic inch difference...

Would 1 ecu controlling it need to have the signal modified in order to have the correct voltages to operate?

2 ecu's operating two 1/2 duty units getting readings from seperate banks sounds liek it would work.
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Old Apr 17, 2005 | 03:03 AM
  #2  
SchwarzCamaroRS's Avatar
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you might be able to make it work with one... either way its going to be complicated... if you use two, you have a lot more than just injection management to synchronize and tune...
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Old Apr 17, 2005 | 08:26 PM
  #3  
Low C1500's Avatar
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From: Red Deer, Canada
Car: 89 Shortbox
Engine: 350 Vortec
Transmission: 700r4
Read up on the injector driver boards, alot simpler than to ECM's.
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Old Apr 17, 2005 | 08:28 PM
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transporter's Avatar
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From: Jeffersonville, In (Louisville, Ky)
Car: 92 Z28
Engine: 305 TPI, Edelbrock headers, 3in Flowmaster exhaust
Transmission: 700R4
How about a ECU out of a cross-fire camaro or vette. They had dual TBI's.
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Old Apr 17, 2005 | 08:29 PM
  #5  
JPrevost's Avatar
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Car: 91 Red Sled
Axle/Gears: 10bolt Richmond 3.73 Torsen
Originally posted by transporter
How about a ECU out of a cross-fire camaro or vette. They had dual TBI's.
But each TBI only had a single injector.
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Old Apr 18, 2005 | 11:44 AM
  #6  
dimented24x7's Avatar
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From: Moorestown, NJ
Car: 88 Camaro SC
Engine: SFI'd 350
Transmission: TKO 500
Axle/Gears: 9-bolt w/ 3.23's
Nother vote for teh inj. driver board. This should work pretty well on a larger motor. Youd have to watch out for async fueling, though. IIRC, the inj. driver board didnt account for it.

Its definatly possible to use two ecms. The way to do it would be to have a master/slave setup and split the drp signal between the two ecms. Set up a one way serial link between the two so the master can feed pulsewidths and the mode of fueling thats desired. I know the outputs can switch fast enough, but the inputs may be another story. Anyway, this would require that you do some source coding. It would make a neat project, but would be alot more then one might be willing to do.
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Old Apr 27, 2005 | 02:51 PM
  #7  
odddoylerules's Avatar
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From: TACOMA WA
Car: 1992 rs 355 TBI **swapped**
Engine: 80 Ford Fiesta GHIA dual carb
Transmission: 72 Cutlass S 350/350 3.42
Axle/Gears: s10 tq converter/stock rear gear
i may be missing somthing but is there a reason why this wouldn't work?

2 ecu's, 2 454 throttle bodies, injectors with half the pulse width of the stockers, 2 o2 sensors feeding off seperate banks.

each ecu would read one bank (left right), and control one 1/2 duty tbi unit (front back). by reading one bank, the ecu would see a picture of how the engine was running as a whole, since instead of reading just directly off the 4 ports it's tb was feeding, the ecu would be getting input from all the ports on say the left side, fed by both tb's.

the benefit of this would be that each tb would be making decisions based on how the engine was running on a whole instead of working against each other.

does anyone make a squarebore mabifold to tbi adaptor/spacer? I'm thinking about just trying to use a single tbi from a 454. I think TBI FI would be cool in an old beater 442.
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Old Apr 27, 2005 | 03:36 PM
  #8  
dimented24x7's Avatar
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From: Moorestown, NJ
Car: 88 Camaro SC
Engine: SFI'd 350
Transmission: TKO 500
Axle/Gears: 9-bolt w/ 3.23's
Keep in mind that the runners typically cross feed to each bank of injectors so on each side the cylinders are fed by both injectors. Even with a single plane the cylinders will be stealing fuel from both injectors. Itll be really hard to coordinate the two ecms. Much easier to only have one ecm making all the decisions.
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Old Apr 27, 2005 | 08:02 PM
  #9  
Low C1500's Avatar
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From: Red Deer, Canada
Car: 89 Shortbox
Engine: 350 Vortec
Transmission: 700r4
Two ECM's could cause one to start going lean with the fuel , while the other one is going rich.

There was some talk awhile ago about running the ECMs in open loop all the time. This has potential.

But as posted many times above: Driver boards!
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Old Apr 27, 2005 | 09:45 PM
  #10  
dimented24x7's Avatar
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From: Moorestown, NJ
Car: 88 Camaro SC
Engine: SFI'd 350
Transmission: TKO 500
Axle/Gears: 9-bolt w/ 3.23's
If you jsut want to try it out, you can wire the injectors on each driver in series on both tbis and adjust the BPWc to reflect the extra injector that will be firing. The injectors will only have half the voltage present so they may be a bit flakey, but at least youll be able to try it.
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Old Apr 28, 2005 | 02:43 PM
  #11  
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Originally posted by dimented24x7
If you jsut want to try it out, you can wire the injectors on each driver in series on both tbis and adjust the BPWc to reflect the extra injector that will be firing. The injectors will only have half the voltage present so they may be a bit flakey, but at least youll be able to try it.
I did this with a 7747 and a 900cfm Holley Projection TB for a while. It worked well after quite a bit of tuning.
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