wow. whats with all these people showing up running like 16's-17's WITH mods??
my car:
1)open element
2)245/50/16 goodyear eagle t/r's
3)shocks in the back dont's match.
4)auto car with a slipping 1st gear
5) no exhaust from the cat back
6)emissions stuff all disconnected though the pump is still there pumping, same with the A/C.
7) stock tune, stock gears, interior, no real weight taken out.
8)timing is advanced like 10 degrees.
thas all folks and im running a solid 15.7 and 15.6 if its cold out.
oh, i do have posi out of a trans am but the gears are the same 2.73's i had.

wtf?? my car is nothing special. it's going to be this summer though
1)getting a laptop and autoprom
2)eibachs kyb's and eagle gsc's plus subframe conectors and and a shock brace up front.
3)3.73's
4)lca's
planning on low 15's high 14's with no motor mods.

 

The earliest of TBI 3rd gens are pushing close to 20 years old and don't run the same way as they did when new. This is due to improper maintenance, abuse, neglect, worn parts etc etc. Track conditions, temperature and poor driving skills are also a factor. Your car is right where it should be.

 

90RS305's car is visually stunning, but as far as the powertrain... its seen better days... he managed to run a 15.3 on an LO3 w/o open element... only mod was a flowmaster 40 series muffler... stock cat still too... i think it was powered by posession of the devil... but yeah, it all depends on the car/driver and how well it was taken care of...

 

ahh. my cars pretty whooped, not well taken care of at all, guess it was just a good day at the factory.
whats crazy is there was this kid at my highschool with a 92 in purple haze. his was even more whooped and it was a LOT more torquey then mine but then again his wasnt missing anyparts at all and everything was still working for the most part. i was really surprised though because we swapped cars and went driving and without posi his was hands down faster but it was so obviously more abused.
then again my freind had an 87 tpi 305 trans am and my car was way more powerfull then his, but he had a dented runner and wouldnt listen to me when i told him that was causing him his problems. he traded it in for a neon r/t and it was just as fast with less miles and no problems but i was still sort of pissed because the fix on it would have been sooo easy.
yea that t/A was runnin like a 16.5 in the 1/4 too.
welp, we shall see what happens when i start cranking on this motor, going old school.
heritage package makes me e check exempt so im going to old style pulleys and brackets to eliminate the a/c and AIR pump, that ought to free up a lil power and also some weight, maybe 15 lbs out of the front. get the tuning crap together and if i can afford it at the end of the summer im getting an exhaust.
hopin to stick with the 305 as long as i can stand it, think they're fine lil motors and that if GM had done as good a job on it as ford did on the 302 we wouldnt have so many arguments about 350 vs. 305 crap. i mean really the ford guys dont whine about 351's..
anyways, heading for 14's

 

i have a 350 in mine and bruces' 305 beat me the 1st time we raced... it wasnt from a stop, but he floored it and left me, i couldn catch him... now with a lil better rearend and a different tune, the story is different... dont underestimate the power of an LO3... they rock!! lol there's lots of guys on here running 14's with them

 

Keep in mind that you have a lot of variation between tracks. In Ohio you have pretty good air, and near sea level elevation. The times coming out of the cars in New Jersey are just rediculously fast (relatively), I don't know if it's because of track prep, sea level, quality air, or what, but there is a lot of variation between tracks. Add in good driver/ bad driver and you have even more variation between IDENTICAL cars. If you go high 14's with no motor mods, I'll be very impressed, but not saying it's not possible.

 

Might be able to hit 14's without getting into the motor. But you'd need some pretty good improvement to get there. What are your trap speeds now?

Also, on teh Ford comment, keep in mind that a 302 motor had a 4" bore, just like a 350 Chevy does. That's why there is no complaints there. 305 is a whole different story with the small bore, that's the limiting factor.

 

Exactly... does anyone remember the chevy 302 that was in the 1stgen F-bodies? an excellent motor... it didnt have a baby bore... its the small bore of the 305 that makes it weak.

 

my traps were around 88 mph i think, ide have to dig up a slip to check it.
the 3.73's alone may kill some of my traction, right now i have not even a squeel coming out of my tires off the line and im revving it on the edge of barking them on the line. however, shocks, springs and the zr rated goodyears in a fairly track freindly size with some psi dropped out of them ought to level that back out.
assuming no huge loss of traction im thinking the gears alone would drop me down to a 15.0-2.
past that the tune and loss of emmissions equipment may help.
im just repeating myself here..this is do-able though right??

 

it is very doable. Most stock LO3 guys see only slight ET drops with gears. They do however tend to gain a mph or two. None the less it is a wise mod that will be utilized down the road. Traction is never a bad thing no matter how little power you may have.

 

Yeah, I'm with Shifty. I think some 3.73's, a little suspension work, like LCAs and a panhard bar would help a lot. I think a good high stall torque converter would go great with the gears too and get you where you want to be.

 

Its not that the 305 is weak, it was just meant for something else. If you stuck heads that flowed similar to the first 302, flattop or domed pistons, the 780 holley and high rise, the 302s distributer, the early camaro exhaust system and the solid lifter cam, there would be very little difference performance wise except the 305 would not twist as high.

Fortunately or unfortunately however you look at it the 305 was tuned for great fuel mileage and low emissions. Notice how the LG4 and L03 can knock on 25 mpg very easily. A L98 is lucky to get 18-20. The 305 was designed to pull adequately with 2.73 gears and a 700r4. Heck my van came with 3.08s and a 700r4 behind a LE9 305. The factory tow rating was 7,000 lbs with that gearing too. The advertised power was 255 ft/lbs @ 1,600 and 170 hp @ 3,800.

 

wait, with 3.73's im looking at only a slight drop in et's? what do you consider slight because like i said im aiming at losing 5-6 tenths assuming no loss in traction.
whats with that? i thought gears were gears no matter what car.
oh and by the way, an ecm out of a 91 tbi 350 truck oughto be a 7747 right? my freind has one and he said its mine when he junks the truck.

 

All cars are different so it is tough to say. Dropping that much time off of your ET with just gears is going to be tough. You should see some quantifiable gain but many stock LO3's don't see extreme drops in ET's. They are still extremely valuable and offer many benifits. You will really like the way they make your car feel. You will be happy either way.

 

Yeah it'd be a 7747 so it woudln't work in your car.

As for the 3.73's I don't think you'll drop 5-6 tenths, that's a he!! of a lot. Don't expect that at all. Some cars don't pick up anything from gears, I think Dewey said he actually lost a tenth going with 3.42's stock. It depends on a lot of things, I think they'll help you but not that much.

edit: Shifty beat me to it, what he said.