Excuse my noobness, where in the log do I view how much it is retarded?

As noted in my above post, the DC under WOT was hitting above 80 a few times. Kicked the log to RF who made the decision that we need more injector.

Took a nice road trip to RFMaster's warehouse (garage) yesterday, dropped of the cherry picker, and picked up a new 62lb @17psi injector pod he had on the library shelf.
Those should provide enough fuel for this beast.

RF adjusted the bin for the new injectors and I've been running ve learns since installing them. Looks mostly rich in most areas which is expected. Screenshot below.

Also took the car to an exhaust shop, had them cut the ypipe and bend a new section for the driver collector as it was slightly off and leaking. Then found a leak at both header gaskets which turned out to be loose bolts! They were all about 2 turns loose! One bolt actually backed all the way out and is missing. Bought a replacement from Oreilly. Shop also made a new hanger for the transmission/cat. This should fix the dragging issue I had whenever I would go over anything.

Running good! Special thanks to RF for his continued support and putting his warehouse up for use!

 

Thanks RS!! Meanwhile I have bunch of cranks, heads, etc that I would like to clear from the shop floor to make room for a new project...

Yes, just continue with VE learns and later ease into AE tuning. Be on the lookout for bogs - a lot more fuel being dumped at once so that TPS AE and MAP AE tables may require manual tuning.

//RF

 

When you are looking in the Knock tab, see the box under pause and above the clear data button, labeled display. Notice yours has "Counts" selected. Move the selection to "Peak" and it will now display the highest knock retard value for each cell. Anything 0-2 and IMO you are fine.

 

Wouldn't it be nicer to say "special needs?"

 

Ran the car again tonight with a datalog. The actual Driving was fine and it ran with power. Problem is at idle it was running rough in closed loop. Did some idle ve learns and every time of about 6 times it kept pulling fuel out at idle but didn't fix the idle.

Remember we have 70pph injectors on it now.

In open loop it idles fine but as soon as it hits closed it starts running rough. Also I noticed that the PW at idle was around 1.1 with SA bouncing between 14-18. Any ideas? DC at WOT- never got above about 62 so we have plenty now at wot. Log attached. You guys can see the idle towards the end.

 

More tuning going on here. Injectors are flowing too much fuel to the engine at idle causing rough idle in closed loop. Will force open loop at idle to address since it seems to idle nice in open.

Did some more driving today and came up with reduced knock. On the first WOT run I had no knock, second popped up some. Better than before though. Fast355 I've attached the spark retard and knock counts. What you think about them? This was done in clear weather at 93* F ambient temp.

Any objections to forcing open loop at idle?

Knock


Spark Retard

 

Spark looks fine. Probably need to reduce the proportional duration to lessen the fuel injected as the 02 sensor falls lean. I would think you could still run closed loop idle.

 

We did this in the current BIN to account for pressure increase from 12 to 17 PSI. After reviewing logs it looks like it is idling just fine CL.

//RF

 

Yes yesterday or idled fine in closed for some reason. Will attempt to capture the rough idle next time.

On another note, changed her oil today at the 3k mark. Then washed her up. She looks nice. Needs paint!

 

Couple more

 

Your car is like the opposite of mine, blue vs red, 305 vs 350, chrome irocs vs my satin, blue underlighting vs my red, lol.

 

Haha don't think I've seen any pix of yours. Curious how my 305 would fare against that 350. Raw power you have more of obviously.

 

Don't want to clutter up your thread too much so a lonely pic will have to suffice.

 

Very nice. Wouldn't mind trading the chromes for those. What size are they?

 

They are 18s with 245/40s wrapped around them.

 

Thought they looked a little bigger than my 17s.

 

The car came with 16s, the 18s are +2'd. I didn't have to do anything for the speedometer at all. 17s probably ride a whole world better.

 

The CS144 alternator blew last night on a part throttle pull. Its been cutting out the past few weeks. Possibly damaged it when the accessory bracket broke.

Let it cool overnight and still wouldn't charge today. Sent it back to rockauto and they are shipping the replacement.

 

You have the worst of luck! Should have stuck with the old alternator. :P

 

No way! The cs144 is a beast, when operating.

 

There in lies the rub

 

My CS-144 could not keep up, had to upgrade to an AD-244 with 200 amp rating.

 

AD-244 has upgraded electronics, but upgraded electrical parts can be retrofitted in to CS144. For example:
Bridge rectifier (late style case): DR5179PF with avalanche diodes 6x 60AMP diodes.
Voltage regulator - multiple choices are available depending on application
D445XHD - Voltage Regulator 12 Volt, P-L-F-S Terminals, 14.7 Voltage set point, 10 second delay.
D411XHD - HD Voltage Regulator 12 Volt, B-Circuit, P-L-I-S Terminals, 14.7 Volt set point, 2.5 sec.
capacitor - 461104 - Capacitor
In most cases stator and rotor are good to go. Check rotor for bad solder joints and slip traces for excess scoring.

AD-244
Rectifier -> DR4401HD - Bridge Rectifier Early Design w/ Heavy Duty 50 amp Diodes
T25XHD - Bridge Rectifier 70A press-fit avalanche diodes (good for 210 Amp).
Rectifier diodes alone do not determine alternator output capability. AD-244 was specifically designed to operated at lower RPM's. To accomplish this both stator and rotor windings were designed to generate higher magnetic field at lower RPMs. But that's another discussion all together.

The problem commonly faced with AD-244 swaps has to do DE-frame ears located 90 deg apart vs conventional 180 deg shared by 10DN/10SI/12SI/CS130/CS144

For a late third gen (aluminum driver side bracket) - the AD-244 might be a ticket - I simply do not have one laying around on shelf to try it out...

//RF

 

I bolted an AD244 right in pace of my CS144.

 

Let see it -

 

 

Fast

That's on the passenger side of G20 van using stock mount locations??

//RF

 

Or REDUCE THE ELECTRICAL LOAD on the vehicle, and you don't need a nuclear generator under the hood.

 

1997 G1500 Express 5.7 on the stock bracket on the passenger side

I put the CS-144 on a stock 3rd gen L03 driverside bracket after finding a suitable bushing for the smaller bolt side.

 

I am not going to sacrifice cooling, A/C or electronic acessories to do that. The Tahoe fans move so much air I stay under 190*F in 105*F weather with the a/c blowing 38-40*F while towing the boat on the way to the lake. Fans alone are 40amps at idle.

 

Mine does actually pretty well. The biggest draw is the taurus fan. Didnt you recommend LS1 dual fans?

Cant do that. The load itself is not that big and the Cs130 kept up fine at driving RPM but in stop and go or idling wouldnt cut it.

Really want to see it on a stock LO3 bracket

My thoughts exactly, now that I have the CS144 it keeps the fan supplied nicely. The CS130 couldnt. Problem i face now is not enough fan to keep up with my new AC and new motor. Worked good with the LO3 but not so much with this beastly L30 and the added power haha.

The car is fine down the highway with AC full blast at 37* since i replaced the air dam. But in traffic when its only fan, it slowly creeps to 220. Like I said SLOWLY but still I would like to see 180 in traffic.

Fast are you positive the LS1 dual fans will fit in the Camaro? And are you sure they pull more than the taurus?

 

LS1 fans work with on a 3rd gen, but require some modification for mounting. It has been done before and the posts are in the cooling system area.

I will have to remember to take a picture of the alternator someday soon when I have the car unburied in my garage.

Your cooling issue is not the radiator or the added power, it is that extra bypass you have installed that is recirculating 210*F water right back into the cool water and a very quick rate.

 

You know how i feel about that bypass haha.

 

What bypass are we talking about here ? Just curious

 

The water pump to intake bypass. Vortec heads lack the provision for it that is normally found in all sbc heads.

 

RS

Time to make an experiment - find some plugs and lets put his long running question to bed...

//RF

 

Seems like a risky experiment RF. Although he is right in the sense that when the heater core is routed correct, there is a constant bypass there. Which it is now correctly routed.

My only concern is does it flow from the heads as well? If it does, then lets do it. The fitting at the intake manifold is seeping coolant anyway.

 

If it worries you, when you block off the bypass for test purposes, drill a couple of small holes in a thermostat. The holes will allow for more bypass water warming up, but not prohibit proper cooling when hot.

It has been forever since I have looked at the rear water passageways on a Vortec TBI intake, but a production TBI intake manifold has a water passageway on each of its 4 corners.

 

Well by the logic you said, shouldn't I be able to just run the core without needing to drill holes in the T stat?

 

CAR IS BACK ON THE ROAD!

Picked up the alternator from fedex today and got the alternator installed tonight after shaving the casing slightly to fit the caprice bracket.

After test driving the new alternator for about 15 miles, I couldn't get it to intermittently cut out like the old one did when at WOT or around 3000-3500. Seems the old alternator was just slowly dying.

I also captured the rough Idle in the log titled as such. Pulse width was at 1.1 when idling rough. I notice if I kick the fan on and put that electrical load on the motor, idle smooths.

Log below for you to check out Fast355.

Also RF, Fast, any suggestions for plugs to plug the bypass and test Fast's theory?

Small tidbit. RBob has some good stuff coming for us EBL guys! That man is a genius!

 

For plugs you can get rubber caps from the parts store that you can hose clamp on.

What is the EBL spoiler?

 

No these would have to be threaded brass plugs.

I'm sure Bob will be making an announcement soon haha

 

Why must they be brass plugs instead of caps?

 

Because the brass fittings that are threaded into the WP and intake mani are seeping as it is. So I would rather pull them out and replace them with threaded plugs.

 

RS

Take a photo of a bypass hose arrangement - picture is worth a thousand words.....

IRC intake uses 3/8" NPT and water pump 1/2" NPT plugs.


//RF

 

Changed that IAT SA compensation table to be able to use either the IAT/CTS blended value, or just the IAT value. Prior it was always the IAT/CTS blended value.

Selecting just use the IAT (option flag) is helpful when the knock is incoming air temperature sensitive.

Also, we are now putting updates on our web site. So can grab them when they are released.

RBob.

 

And that makes a world of difference. With the old table I was getting SA pulled during cool ambient because my IC value was around the same regardless of ambient temp. Now, not so much.

 

So fast, myself and RF took a minute today to actually think about how the bypass is functioning. Now it makes sense.

The bypass at the WP that GM told us to run is simply taking already hot water, and dumping it back into the water pump inlet and heating that water back up before it even hits the block. No cooling point in between.

The heater core bypass does essentially the same thing, but hits the radiator and cools back down before entering the block.

With that in mind, I'll be plugging the bypass on my next off day and seeing how it works. Any predictions on the effects on cooling?

Moral of the story, take a second to ponder on mechanical things before decisions.

 

Except the heater core bypass also runs into the "cool" tank and not through the actual core. So in essence with your bypass and the stock bypass you have 2 paths for hot water to bypass the radiator entirely.

 

I see, so I'm nearly running all hot water then. Think plugging the second bypass will cool her down?