I'm assuming they don't but do they make Dart Iron Eagle Heads with 58cc chambers?

 

Hello? By the looks of it I kinda need 'em ehh!

 

Port your stock heads. They'll flow as well as the standard Iron Eagles.

 

Stock heads flow better than Dart Iron Eagles?

I don't think so....

If you need a set of 58cc heads, get the World Products S/R 305 Torquers.

 

Porting my heads is not acceptable cause they have the post '87 intake center bolt crap.
beside I want an all new assembly with new valves,seats,springs,studs,blah,blah,blah.
I'm just not porting them.
Ohh and the stock late mode heads are known to crack and that is what I have experienced.

 

Please get the 64 cc chambers. You'll be glad you did in the long run. You'll want to get rid of that high milege block eventually.

 

Hmm, did I say stock heads will flow better than Iron Eagles?

NO I DID NOT!!!

I said port your 305 heads, they will flow as well as the Dart Iron Eagles. And if you think that is BS, then go take your argument to F-Bird'88, whose ported 305 heads flow just as well as the Iron Eagles. He has flowbeched them. It ain't rocket science.

So, keep the BS to yourself and reserve your space on this board for intelligent discussion.

 

You stated they would flow as well. Spend the money on a set of 305 heads, is now just ported 305 heads.
Some flow numbers for you, all done at .600 lift.
Stock 305 heads:
199cfm intake,159 ex. with 163 runner cc and 58cc combustion chamber.
Stock S/R heads out of the box:
225 intake,155 ex., 170cc runner cc and 67 combustion chamber, with 2.02 valves over the stock 1.94's on 305 heads.
Dart:
248 intake,179 ex.,200cc runner cc, and 69cc combustion chamber, and can be ordered with up to a 2.05 intake valve.

So spending the money to port a set of 305 heads, with bad quench area to begin with, bad flow design, versus ordering a new head with better flow characteristics, with screw in studs,ect that flows better right off, with no BS, would be a waste IMHO.

 

I like the Dart's. I picked up between 60-70 horse with my 180's. But really, don't go posting 200 cc runner flow numbers in comparison with a 305 head.

 

when using 1.94+ inch valves. You will probably need to limit cam lift to .45 or less.

 

Fair enought...
Dart 165's:
.500 lift is 210 intake and 138 ex.
.600 lift is 208 intake and 139 ex.

Dart 180's:
.500 lift is 209 intake and 175 exhaust
.600 lift is 209 intake and 177 exhaust

 

Here is what F-Bird'88 has achieved by porting and polishing his own "416" 305 heads:

"I ported the hell out of a pair of 305 "416" castings. I installed 1.94 and 1.60" valves and got them flow tested. The intakes came up to 225 cfm @.450" (185 cfm stock). The exhausts came up to 140cfm@.500" (110 to 120 cfm stock)."

He also found his porting efforts had raised the 305 runner volume from the stock 166 cc (which he has measured on different heads) to around 175 cc. (GM says 155 cc but that has not proven to be correct.)

So, lets compare the Iron Eagles 200's flow at the same lift. These numbers are drawn from the head flow files in DD2000 and Dart's website.

Intake: 226 cfm @ .400 lift

Exhaust: 178 cfm @ .500 lift

So, they are practically identicle at the intakes but the Iron Eagles' exhaust will outflow the 305s at .500 significantly.

The comparison becomes even more favourable if we compare to the Iron Eagle S/S heads, which flow like this.

Intake: 210 cfm @ .500” lift / 28”

Exhaust: 138 cfm @ .500” lift / 28”

Still, on a street 305 we are unlikely to see cam lifts above .450 on either side. (Moreover, you will never see lifts of .600 anywhere on any 305 except on the most heavily modified strip-only engine.) At this lift we are dealing with kissing cousins, very close to each other, with the award going to our home ports when compared to the Iron Eagle S/Ss. (The case is the same with Vortecs and World S/R Torquers. And if you are concerned with combustion chamber shape, the "801" 305 castings offer an interesting wrinkle on the standard D shapes.)

This is more than enough to provide over 450 hp on a well matched smallblock.

So what makes more sense, if dollars are a concern? Porting your stockers or dumping nearly $900 on Iron Eagles?

 

Here is a shot of the 801s.

 

Depends on what a port job cost...ever price a fully set of ported heads. That alone will cost over half of what either the Darts or the WP S/R Torquers offer.
I ported my own heads, and ran them as well. But most 'do it yourselfers' don't know anything about porting heads. Getting a port kit and just drilling heads isn't the way to do it.
So, most people have to pay a pro to accomplish the same principle. And around here, a full port/gasket matched set of heads can set you back $250-$400. And if I pay that kinda money, it will outflow a stock head out of the box to begin with.

And, the heads can be had in Jeg's for $740. So my point, is for a simple bolt on setup, it's hard to beat a set of aftermarket heads with a better flow design, runner size,valve size,spring setup than what you'll have to pay for to have a set of 'stock' done.

 

It took me about 20 hours to port and polish mine. I don't see why anyone couldn't do it themselves, as long as they have a place to work on their car. And the price is way cheaper than even Jeg's new heads. It will cost me around $400 US, total.

 

Ever seen a set of bad ported heads....that turn to trash because someone did a poor port job that hurt velocity? I've seen alot trashed.

But if people want to try to port their own 305 heads in search of more power....more power to ya.

 

Simple "clean up" and pocket porting is relatively simple and can give some nice gains (especially by allowing you to run more spark advance without detonation). But I have to agree with Polecat that a "good port job" is a bit of a "black art" that is beyond the knowledge level of the average guy. In fact, I have read that a "good porter" requires years of experience.

The only other "black art" that seems as scary is burning your eprom and I can tell you that burning an eprom (even SD) is WAY easier to do than doing a good port job. AND, if you screw up (eprom), you can always set the eprom back to the original. You can't do that if you screw up a port job.

 

What happens if you start porting your heads, and you nick a valve seat, or you punch through the intake runner into the pushrod passage. Your cheap port job can get really expensive really fast. Not to mention the price of a good set of stainless valves, new seals, locks, and retainers, screw in studs, guideplates, springs, plus the assurance of a big name to stand behind their product. How much is that worth?

 

Defeatist!!!

Really, you have to have some faith in yourself to accomplish anything, don't you? I mean, why go out the door in the morning? A truck might hit you as you cross the road

Doing your own heads is just a matter of getting the right advice and paying attention to what you are doing. I've posted a nice long thread on this forum a week back. Go read it and then have at it!

You can do it!!!

And the only reason it is costing me much money at all is because I started with completely bare heads. I have to buy everything to complete them. That won't be the case with most other people.

 

I, personally, bought the Standard Abrasives head porting kit and practiced on a set of smogger truck heads. It's a lot easier to nick a valve seat than most people make it out, especially when trying to take the edge off the short side radius. The throat area is no picnic either. I was all set to pull my 180's off my car for a quick port and polish, but felt that the risks outweighed the benefits. Have you ever known anyone to pull the heads of their car, only to port them, ruin the airflow characteristics, and go slower? It happens a lot more than you'de think.

 

i'm with sitting bull..........your not going to get anywhere if you dont try


btw, i have a set of 305 heads in my garage in need of a port and rebuild.............best offer can have 'em

 

TPI,

You can still do it!!!

Even if all you do is follow the Standard Abrasives' instructions you will gain 20 hp on your engine. Read my posting, it is filled to the brim with pics and expert advice from the best guys on the board

Does F-Bird'88 or RB83L69 ring a bell???

Man, they will help you too, just ask :hail: :hail: :hail:

 

I'll do it, but only if you guys peer pressure me into it. I'm a sucker for peer pressure!