OK, got an LG4, it has a half assed pulley and belt setup... some are v groove, and one serpitean.


Serpitean belt runs from crank to alt to water pump and back

Why can't i find a replacement alternator with a serpitean pulleyt already on it? I keep having to change pulleys and i think that is why my alternators keep going bad...

anything would help, suggestions etc. i think the serp. pulley is slightly smaller which would make the alt turn faster...

Steve


------------------
88 Firebird Formula- deseased 2/9/99- 305 TPI, SLP 3 inch exhaust, SLP Intake runners, SLP cam, 3.45 BW disc brake posi, WS6, NOS, and all that good stuff, 13.~ sec 1/4 mile- hit by what else!?!? a FORD EXPLORER!!!!!!

86 Firebird, LG4, t-tops, slp 3 inch exhaust, catco cat, and a bunch of new/replaced stuff, open element, soon to come, 2 inch cowl hood, 3.42 posi disc rear from a 4th gen, and hopefully a 6 speed!
My Webpage- Battle of the birds, My own Thirdgen Page, still under construction, http://www.geocities.com/soares711/index.htm

 

My engine is and LG4 setup, and that does not sound stock. I have 4 belts, all V belts. Sounds like you have some weird mix of pulleys.

------------------
1983 Pontiac Firebird SE
LG4-Based Chevy 400
700R4 Tansmission
Modified 4 Barrel Q-Jet Carb
Accel Super Stock 8mm Wires
Edelbrock Pro-Flo Air Cleaner
3.23 Posi Rear
14X7" Cragar SS/T Wheels
35X4 CD/AM/FM Head Unit
100WX2 Amp
2 Pioneer 12" Subs in Custom Box

[This message has been edited by Ward (edited September 12, 2000).]

 

yeah but in 86 they made changes to the lg4 didnt they? i have a total of 4 belts, including the ac.

Steve

 

My '86 V6 has 2 v-belts and one serpentine belt. The alt. is driven by the serpentine belt. It sounds the same as yours, it goes from the crank pulley to the alt(passenger side) around the water pump and back to the crank. Maybe you could ask for a alt for a V6 and see if it mounts the same.
By the way, I bought a serpentine setup off an '89(that uses one serpentine belt) to put on the 400 I will be dropping in in a couple of weeks . It was pretty cheap but the water pump needs to be reverse rotation.

 

FB,

My '86 TPI has the "hybrid" belt setup as you described. Standard 37° 'V' belts on PS, AC, AIR, and a poly 'V' (serpentine) on the alternator, WP, and crank. Try finding a replacement alternator for a LB9 (TPI) engine and you should have better luck.

I've always said the '86 is the "bastard-child" of the breed.

Later,
Vader

------------------
"Make Me Bad"

 

yeah i know its the bastard breed thats for sure...

i will try that tommorow... its gotta be that it is spinnin to fast. cuz the ones i get are a v belt, so i change the pulleys then all i have to do is brig the rpms up once, 5 min later it will throw 18 volts out... and i gotta turn every freakin thing on in the car to get it back down to 14...

oh well.. this kinda confirms my thoughts that i have been getting the wrong alt. Anyone else have anything further to add?

Steve

 

nevermind.. answered my own question!

Steve

[This message has been edited by fb305svs (edited September 11, 2000).]

 

I change the pulley on my 86 when I got the new alt and I have had it in the car for a year now and have hed no problems.

 

well, i hot 4500 and my alt went belly up 5 min later soooo i dunno...

 

hehehe guys i have to agree with Vador. the 86 firebird IS the bastardchild of the breed. hehe

------------------
click below to check out MY FORMULA PAGE!
http://www.members.tripod.com/~Astra...uild/front.htm

or click below to email me
Astralbaby@webtv.net

 

I have an 85 Camaro with the LG4 and it has that same damn mixed belt setup. My alternator died about 2 years ago, the voltage regulater fried. I just bought an alternator rebuild kit from Pep Boys for ~$20. It came with a new front bearing, diode trio, regulator, and brushes. My alt has been at a steady 14.7 volts for the past 2 years with no problems yet. HTH

-Dave

------------------
Better to keep one's mouth closed and be thought a fool, than to open
it and remove all doubt.(Mark Twain)
Homepage of VTCamaro/Arntzman
Need Wiring Diagrams??
darntz@vt.edu

 

And here I always thought it was the '85.

 

RD,

O.K. you got me on that one. The '85 is the "bastard-child's" half-brother - the red-headded stepchild. At least the mechanicals of the '85 are like every other SBC made before then. The electronics are the oddity on that one. But you DID get a little more power.

The '86 has perimeter-bolt valve covers and flat-tappet cam, non-self-aligning rockers, but it has a one-piece rear main seal, and partly into production the auto transissions were changed to the newer-style pump and auxilliary valve body. It was the first full year for the "new" ECM and the Delco programmers hadn't quite figured that one out yet. Some of them had the VSS in the speedo head and some were remote. Some had a 85 MPH speedo and some got 140MPH. The '86 has a nice assortment of drive belts for the accessories, as outlined above. Some were all 'V' and some were a mixture. Some of the later cars got the extra bracket for the AC compressor and some didn't. And that's just the beginning. The Purchasing people in Van Nuys must have been smoking some good stuff back in '86.

Actually, the differences may have been partially attributable to the impending shutdown of the Ohio assembly plant, and a subsequent cleanup of inventory.

IMO, the best years for the ThirdGen were '88-'89 for various reasons, but I still like my '86 enough to keep it fairly prisine. Maybe when it get its first set of new tires I'll think about a few more changes.

------------------
Later,
Vader
------------------
"Make Me Bad"
Adobe Acrobat Reader 4.0

 

Yeah, My 88 formula was the most pristine car. everything appeared to be easy to work with etc... too bad it got wrecked.. that car had some serious potential!

Steve

 

Hahaha! Ok, ok, I'll take it! You have a strong argument with either, but the '86 may edge out.

I can live with this. I personally prefer the '89. No 9th. But I can settle for the '88. I hated the '87 MAF placement and box enough to not want another. I would include the '84 for the carb version (IIRC).



------------------
If you have a problem,
If no-one else can help,
And if you can find them,
Maybe you can hire....
THE A-TEAM

 

Dont crap on the 86 firebird too much... Remeber the Turbo Trans Am?

------------------
1983 Pontiac Firebird SE
LG4-Based Chevy 400
700R4 Tansmission
Modified 4 Barrel Q-Jet Carb
Accel Super Stock 8mm Wires
Edelbrock Pro-Flo Air Cleaner
3.23 Posi Rear
14X7" Cragar SS/T Wheels
35X4 CD/AM/FM Head Unit
100WX2 Amp
2 Pioneer 12" Subs in Custom Box

 

what years were the turbo trans ams made?

Steve

 

Not 86... Guess we'll have to continue to bash the 86s, lol.

The TTAs were 89 only.

------------------
Ray87Z
-Vortec headed 350.
86 IROC w/ a cammed 305 TPI.
Formerly Ray86IROC.
www.inter-scape.com/Ray

 

Red Devil, I must say the 88 Sport Coupe I have will NEVER be a winner of awards of any kind!
so hopefully this narrows down the good years for 3rd Gens to 89...
just my 2¢. (side note for Vader... trannys fixed and motor runs!!! Tomorrow... new shifter cable-- draw your own conclusions)

------------------
Duffster (age 31)
BEAT DOWN HARD 88' Camaro SC,
1978 Caprice Classic motor havin'(WITH NO COMPUTER),84' Z-28 Nose clip wearin',
84' Z-28 Hood covered,
AND THE TIRES:
245/60-16 Firehawk SS20 (1),
245/60-16 Bridgestone CompTA's(on rear),
235/60-16 Pirelli P600 w/a curb check or 3(1),
REAR HATCH MASTER OF ALL!!!
Duffster_Camaro@HOTMAIL.COM
Owner of the Camaro 0 out of 10 Third-genners approve of, also part of the non-existent Iowa crew.

 

Scince it was said already,my thoughts are that 1989 is the best year for thirdgen f-bodies for a number of reasons other than the TTA was made in that year only

Some of them being first year for the better injectors without the 9th injector while being the last year for MAF.Another is the belt setup(which started in 88)is just better,I mean,have you ever changed a water pump on an 87?Everythings attatched to it,where on an 89 it's 4 bolts and your done

Oh yeah,and the TTA was made in that year only

Now onto why the Firebird is better than the Camaro....

Steve

------------------
TTA#850,bone stock,best 13.68@100
TTA#861,near stock,best 11.99@112.26
89 GTA,nowhere near stock,longing for 10.0

 

Well, unless you guys are talkingg about the '79 Turbo Trans Am, in 1989 was the only thirdgen Turbo Trans Am.

 

No 79' Turbo T/A, just 80' and 81'. ike it matters though.

89 Transam GTA, a few bolt ons

 

transamgta350- ur from CT huh? do you go to school or are you older? just curious, i would kinda like to get a CT groups of birds and camaros goin.....

my aim sn is fb305svs, feel free to drop me a line!

Steve

------------------
88 Firebird Formula- deseased 2/9/99- 305 TPI, SLP 3 inch exhaust, SLP Intake runners, SLP cam, 3.45 BW disc brake posi, WS6, NOS, and all that good stuff, 13.~ sec 1/4 mile- hit by what else!?!? a FORD EXPLORER!!!!!!

86 Firebird, LG4, t-tops, slp 3 inch exhaust, catco cat, and a bunch of new/replaced stuff, open element, soon to come, 2 inch cowl hood, 3.42 posi disc rear from a 4th gen, and hopefully a 6 speed!
My Webpage- Battle of the birds, My own Thirdgen Page, still under construction, http://www.geocities.com/soares711/index.htm

 

You got me there Transamgta350, i don't know my second gens very well and that was just a guesstimate. But I knew they put that Turbo 301 into something of the later second gens.

 

I had a similar problem of wiping out the bearings in the alternator every 6 months.

Turns out miles on the pullies wears them out. I put on a set of Underdrives... and haven't had a problem since.

The Crank pulley was "worn" but really couldn't see it. So I had to over tighten the belt to keep it from squeaking, which killed the bearings in the alternator every so often.



------------------
It's always SOMETHING
"Sounds like Barry White at idle, Teddy Pendegrass wide open..
if it don't sound like Micheal Bolton your alright"

 

Duff,
Actually I'm just a firechicken type of guy. The '88 Bird really was not bad, but I'd still take my '89 GTA over the '88 I had, well everything but my digital dash.

TTA850, I thought it was accepted fact that the Bird was better than the 'Maro!
The only thing I want to mention to you though, is that the injectors on the '89 suck. The Multecs have got to be one of the worst they put out. Rich at Cruzin' says he has yet to see a set sent to him that doesn't leak. I've swapped the originals twice before I buckled under and swapped in Motorsport ones. BUT other than that, I think my '89 is a Prince! (And before anyone cries about the 'Prince designation... well my 'vette is still King!)


------------------
If you have a problem,
If no-one else can help,
And if you can find them,
Maybe you can hire....
THE A-TEAM

 

Getting back to alternators and belt types, my '86 SC donor had the belt system described above. The alternator started overcharging after about 2000 miles (it looked fairly fresh when I got the car). I did the rebuild kit thing, and havent' had a problem in the 10 months since. And, no, the V-6 alternator does NOT fit.

I have an '87 LB9 sitting in the garage waiting for my attention. It has exaclty the same belt configuration. I know it is not an '86, because it has the center two intake bolts at the different angle and a factory roller cam.

If someone has seen this hybrid belt configuration on an '85, then there must have been three bastard years.

------------------
82 Berlinetta, orig V-6 car. Rescued w/86 LG4/TH700R with all harnesses, sensors, ECM, etc. 3.08 open, cat-back from '91 GTA, Accel HEI SuperCoil. AMSOIL syn lubes bumper-to-bumper. Daily driver, work-in-progress (LB9 w/ZZ3 cam, World 305 heads, exhaust, paint, etc.).
57 Bel Air, my 1st car. Currently 396 .030 over, Weiand Action+, Edelbrock 1901 Q-Jet, Jacobs Omnipack, 1-3/4" headers, TH400 w/TCI Sat Night Special conv & shift kit, 3.08 10-bolt, AMSOIL syn lubes bumper-to-bumper. Best 15.1 @ 5800' Bandimere. Daily driver while Camaro was being put together.

[This message has been edited by five7kid (edited September 14, 2000).]

 

My '86 v6 also has two v-belts and one serpentine belt. Go figure! I think the '85 V6 is also set up like mine.

-Tom P (Hot rodded 1986 Firebird 2.8l) from http://www.f-body.net/mailbag/3rd/3rd_mailbag.html message boards

 

Red Devil,I have never had a problem with the injectors myself but have heard of problems with them.

What I ment was the start of better fuel management by eliminating the 9th injector and more precise fuel control by the ecm.

Steve

------------------
TTA#850,bone stock,best 13.68@100
TTA#861,near stock,best 11.99@112.26
89 GTA,nowhere near stock,longing for 10.0

 

I had an 85 and I have an 86, and they both have the stupid 3 v-belt and one serpentine setup. I think 85 was the first year and 87 was the last to do that.

 

sorry if this dont make much sence, but i am half ****ed still from tonight.... gotta love college life. Any how, my thanx go out to 86z, he had a rebuilt altenator that he sold me for 20 bucks and it has been fine even through 5200 rpm.. good so far!

thanx for the help, i was hoping i wasnt the only one with this bastrdized setup!

god i'll have to lok at this tommorow mornin and see how i did typin this stuff out!

Steve

------------------
86 Firebird, LG4, t-tops, 2.73 open rear, SLP 3 inch cat back exhaust, catco cat, Coming mods: Edlebrock 1 5/8's Headers, 2 inch cowl hood with custon alumin cold air box, 3.42 posi disc rear, T56, and hopefully a new set of heads and a nice CAM!

My Webpage- Battle of the birds, My own Thirdgen Page, still under construction, http://www.geocities.com/soares711/index.htm

88 Firebird Formula- deseased 2/9/99- 305 TPI, SLP 3 inch exhaust, SLP Intake runners, SLP cam, 3.45 BW disc brake posi, WS6, NOS, and all that good stuff, 13.8 on the motor, 12.89 on NOS and slicks! Hit by what else!?!? a FORD EXPLORER!!!!!!

 

Try looking into other years of alternators. i had the same problem on my 86. i found one by scooting around through other years of replacement alternators adn found one, i think it was an 88 or 89 alternator replacement that i found. if not, find a good one and change the pullies, changing the pully will not kill your alternator, unless you do something really wrong.

take care
C

 

Well, my theory is that by changing the pulley, i was changing the sped at which the alternator turned. they are built to only turn so fast. So basically, the problem wouldnt happen until i got on it once or twice, and brought the rpms up, there for spinning the alternator faster than it was supposed to be, creating too much voltage and amps for the voltage regulator to handle. The one 86z sold me for cheap is a newly rebuilt one. So it should be good for a while.

Steve

------------------
86 Firebird, LG4, t-tops, 2.73 open rear, SLP 3 inch cat back exhaust, catco cat, Coming mods: Edlebrock 1 5/8's Headers, 2 inch cowl hood with custon alumin cold air box, 3.42 posi disc rear, T56, and hopefully a new set of heads and a nice CAM!

My Webpage- Battle of the birds, My own Thirdgen Page, still under construction, http://www.geocities.com/soares711/index.htm

88 Firebird Formula- deseased 2/9/99- 305 TPI, SLP 3 inch exhaust, SLP Intake runners, SLP cam, 3.45 BW disc brake posi, WS6, NOS, and all that good stuff, 13.8 on the motor, 12.89 on NOS and slicks! Hit by what else!?!? a FORD EXPLORER!!!!!!

 

My '84 came with the serpintin belt on the alt only........so you might try that year.

------------------
"84Z28/'91 305TPI comp cam flowmaster TB coolant bypass/shutoff valve to heater core MAT relocated Ram-Air(home-made) gutted air-box IROC ground effects/wheels GY245/50's 700R4 superior shift kit/ corvette servo(excellent shift kit BTW) Rebuilt engine and transplanted it myself. Love this engine!
LOW performance people should drive low performance vehicles!

 

hmm....at my parts store its not uncommon to pull an alt off the shelf w/ the wrong pulley on it. we just swap them w/ the customer's old alt and off they go, not many complaints are heard. thats what i have to do w/ my 85 LG4, the alt always comes w/ a surpentine pulley, and i need a v-belt...so i swap, but ya know i do get low voltage and i cant figure out why...hmm..

------------------
350, Comp 262, Edelbrock Performer intake 600 cfm carb and exhaust, headers

 

out of curiosity, what part stores do u guys use? to be honest, i think napa's alternators suck...........

i have had very good luck with the rest of there parts though.

Steve

------------------
86 Firebird, LG4, t-tops, 2.73 open rear, SLP 3 inch cat back exhaust, catco cat, Coming mods: Edlebrock 1 5/8's Headers, 2 inch cowl hood with custon alumin cold air box, 3.42 posi disc rear, T56, and hopefully a new set of heads and a nice CAM!

My Webpage- Battle of the birds, My own Thirdgen Page, still under construction, http://www.geocities.com/soares711/index.htm

88 Firebird Formula- deseased 2/9/99- 305 TPI, SLP 3 inch exhaust, SLP Intake runners, SLP cam, 3.45 BW disc brake posi, WS6, NOS, and all that good stuff, 13.8 on the motor, 12.89 on NOS and slicks! Hit by what else!?!? a FORD EXPLORER!!!!!!