Hey this isn't my car but a friend of mine in Memphis. He's got a 1988 GTA. Here is the what he posted on a local board.



Ok here is the situation...

I had a bad intake gasket and a kickdown cable. I took them into *Shop Name Removed* on Tuesday (they told me it would be done by the end of the day.. it wasn't ) and they kept it over night.

On wed. about 10am I called to check up on it and they said it would be about an hour. At 2pm I called again, and again they said about another hour . At 3:30pm I called again and they said it was ready.

At this point I get there and they were supposed to do the intake gasket and kickdown cable... what they did was the gasket, cable, a hose in the rear of the TPI , and a thermostat (which Richard and I had just put in 3 weeks earlier), and changed my oil (which I had done last week).

So I pick it up, and drive home. I take 385 from 51 to the back gate of the nave base. About half way home I start to hear a knock...

I brought it home and listened to it idle for about 5 minutes, no knock until I give it some gas, and theres the knock. I called *Shop* back, and they said bring it back, so I did.

I bring it back, they hear the knock, and commence changing my oil again. There were metal chips in the "gray" oil they had just put in.

They have now kept it for another night , and plan to drop the pan first thing in the morning.

Any Ideas, recommendations (besides not bringing it to *shop* again), or concers are appreciated... SERIOUS ONLY PLEASE.



The car was not knocking before he took it in.

We think it's a rod but they aren't admitting to anything and he, the owner of the car, is unsure what to do.

Please help so he doesn't get screwed!!

 

Educated guess here... I betcha they got water in the oil when they took the intake off, and they didn't get all of it out. Thats prolly also why they changed the oil.

Water in the oil could easily be the cause of a rod knock.

 

Would that have messed up the rods/bearings, or would he be alright if he just got all the water out?

 

if it was indeed water in the oil that caused the problem then the knock noise is bearings .....

the reason they are making a knock noise is becuse the water broke down the oil and starved the bearing for lubrication ....which in turn either spun the bearing or gouged the bearings and crank id say a full rebuild is in order if this is in case the problem

 

We were afraid you'd say that...thanks for the info.

 

they may have changed the oil at the shop but when they put the new intake gasket on they may not have sealed the water jackets very well on the gaskets and this could have caused the water in the oil i wouldnt doubt that the problem was caused by them

and the oil did it look like chocolate milk almost ?

 

When they take off the pan, tell them you want to them to show you what they find. Have them actually show it to you, not just tell you.

 

yes that would keep them from telling you a lie , not that the shop isnt reputable but when it comes to paying for a complete engine overhaul for someone they do tend to forget to tell you about certain things they find when they open up the engine....

 

I dont know how far the shop was from this guys house, but I'm gonna take a wild guess and say its not that far. I honestly dont think water in the oil for a few miles would cause failure so fast. I'd say there was a good chance water and/or gasoline was in the oil from the leaking intake gasket BEFORE it went into the shop (for who-knows how long)

 

Well with them delaying like that, you kind of wonder if they didnt take it out and flog it or something. Did he check the in/out mileage?

 

Sounds familiar, being an auto tech for the last 17 yrs I `ve seen it happen many times, usually with a cam swap though not an intake. Even if the tech had taken every precaution Servicing an old car with alot of miles is a risk, I have turned down cars in need of major service just for the age and miles, pulling heads, swaping cams, even intakes I guess, can dislodge small carbon particles which is like pouring sand in the engine and then there`s anit freeze Ethyl glycol that attacks bearing babitt and Solvents used to clean mating surfaces and let`s not forget the ever famous 3M cookie wheel, a 20,000 rpm sand dispenser used by most "professionals" to clean gaskets from surfaces. By and large doing any engine service to an aged engine that has need service for quite sometime is like doing heart surgery to a 90 yr old, you just might lose it on the table, a little carbon or a little antifreeze or a little of anything is not likley to cause a rod knock on a sound engine now on a engine that`s half way out the door, That`s another story

 

No, he didnt record the milage when he took it in.


UPDATE:

"Went there last night to "talk" with them and see what the final outcome is... nothing! they will not fix it because they do not think it is their fault. They said it did not knock when they had it. But even now you can't hear the knock it you don't rev it up quite a bit. They agree that they didn't hear a knock before it went in. The first time they changed the oil they didn't see the gray and metal (looking or not I don't know), but they did see it after I brought it back to them. He says that rods go over a period of time, and they are not at fault. So I had them take it out of their lot, told him thanks for all of the info, and that we will probably be talking again."

 

If the oil came out looking like the oil in these pictures, but didn't look like that when you brought it in then they screwed up bad.







BTW, I bought my car for the body, and options. Not because of the engine. Which I knew would need to be replaced. But when the transmission was bad too I was . They said the trans was GOOD. First time i drove it it didn't have 4th gear!!!!

 

He's SOL. He can try taking them to small claims court, which requires no attorney in Tennessee (although you can pay one to help prep you)...but he'll have trouble proving the engine was in good shape before the shop worked on it. Old car, lots of mileage, no 3rd party statement of the engine's condition previously. Near guaranteed loss.

I'd file a complaint with the Better Business Bureau and go from there. Maybe file a claim in small claims court and prep a case if he can build any evidence that the engine wasn't knocking prior to the shop visit.

Otherwise, it's time for either a rebuild or replacement.

 

Thanks to everyone for their comments, replies, and recommendations... I am trying to get alot of questions answered, and planning a rebuild already, hopefully in the next week or two. This really sucks, but life goes on I guess. Just trying to plan carefully to what steps I am going to take in this situation, and not ruling anything out yet.

Again thanks!

Mike