I've been thinking about building up (eventually) the old 283 that my dad has left over. It's just the short block, so I'd have to add heads, intake, etc.

I was thinking about using vortecs for heads and a Perf. RPM intake, but I wanted to know about the bottom end components and cam selection.

Do aftermarket companies have rods and pistons available, or is it just stock replacement stuff. I suppose that prepped stock rods would be okay to use, but considering how long the motor has been sitting I don't know their condition. Ditto the crank and pistons. I'm looking for a 6000 rpm safe redline.

Now on the cam, I was thinking about doing a retro fit for a hydraulic roller, and using the Magnum cam with 206 duration (.050) and .500 lift. The duration should be low enough that it won't be too wild a cam for the small motor. I checked it out with desktop dyno and the power peak was at about 5000-5500 IIRC, but I could always retard the cam some if I need a little more top end.

(This motor would be going in a 3rd gen Firebird w/ a manual trans btw)

Anyhow, I just wanted to see if anybody here had experience with a 283 and could comment on my bench racing combo here!

Thanks!!

 

part would be hard to come by since all 283s would be small journal and not a 4" bore. you're looking at more work and expense to make less power than you could have from a 350 that you could find parts for anywhere.

 

Well, I am not THEGENERAL, but i have done extensive work on the 283 that is sitting in his car. Dont use vortecs. 64cc combustion chamber is too big for the 283, you would need domed pistons for compression, and they suck even more.

In all honesty, i wouldnt touch the 283. The only reason the one in thegenerals impala is built up, is cause it is the original engine to the car. We had an interest in keeping the original engine in the car. The 283 is massively inferior to the 350 or even a 327. It does not have the 4" bore that makes the 327 or 350 so much better. You will always benefit from using the most cubic inches as possible.

It would be a terrible shame to put all of that money in a 283, just to find out that you are making 75-100 less HP than if you would have started with a 350 block. And no joke man, that is about what the difference would be in the end. Do yourself a favor, get a 350 core, and forget about that ol' 283, leave it to the resto crowd.

 

What kind of power are you looking to make? I think it would be a fun little motor if you could raise your intended redline so to spin 7-8grand 400hp would be easy.

Dont use vortecs. 64cc combustion chamber is too big for the 283, you would need domed pistons for compression, and they suck even more.

Then what heads would you suggest he use? AFR's?

It would be a terrible shame to put all of that money in a 283, just to find out that you are making 75-100 less HP than if you would have started with a 350 block. And no joke man, that is about what the difference would be in the end. Do yourself a favor, get a 350 core, and forget about that ol' 283, leave it to the resto crowd.

He has goals and obviously put some thought into the buildup... Is anyone else getting sick of reading "just get a 350?" If that arguement holds true then why not "just get a 400?"

 

Actually, many castings of the 283 blocks CAN safely be bored out to 4"!! Most, if not all, also had a forged crank, so thats good too! The only things that make this little mill tricky are the fact that they are small journal crank and rods. Thats not a bad thing necessarily, though. Just restricts parts selection a bit.

If the parts are in good enough shape to reuse, I'd rip it apart and have the block punched out to 4" (assuming its one of the good castings) and either build a nice 302 out of it with the stock crank, or you could find yourself a 327 crank and build a 327 out of it.

 

Still leaves you with less than 350 cu. in. I'd put it aside and try and find a car for it to go in and build a 350+ for the thirdgen.

 

Not sure about all 283s, but a lot of 327s did. Unfortunately, due to the small journal, snapping the "snout" off wasn't uncommon.

 

Never worked with a 283, huh? I have. I wouldnt recommend any heads for it, I would recomend a different engine. If you dont know why I wouldnt recommend vortecs, then that is reason enough for this person to not listen to you. Plain and simple, you couldnt pay me to put one in my car.

As for him having goals, etc. Yes he does, and a 350 meets every one of those goals much easier than a 283 will. The same money is going to be spent, why not get more cubes and more power? We're not here to flame, we are here to help and offer good advice. Take your flamebait somewhere else.


Air Adam--Yes, they you might find one with a forged crank, but it is also a 30-35 year old forged crank, I wouldnt be using it. Its just not a great route to go. Even if the block can be bored that far, why waste your time, you still wont get the power offered by a 350, or as Sir Flame-alot above posted, a 400. I've worked with them before, a 283 isnt what its cracked up to be, but some people need to learn the lesson the hard way.

 

I should mention that this project would be just for fun. I wouldn't do it if I wanted dragstrip domination.

I just like the idea of using that old classic motor in a modern car, and preserving that tiny bit of the past.



Now as for the internals, I'll have to ask my dad what he did for his motor. He's got an original style 283 in his Corvette. It was rebuilt by a local hot rod guy/engine builder. I'm pretty sure it was overbored some, but I'd bet they just reused the factory rods. If I remember right, the guy said the engine was good for 6000 rpm.

It's got factory original iron heads, intake, and exhaust, but he put a Comp High Energy 218/218 (.050) and .454/.454 lift cam in it. That thing would really scream..... at least until the Holley carb started leaking gas due to casting flaws. (he hasn't had time to tune the new carb yet).

 

as stated above i have a 283 in my 66 impala and its the numbers matching engine and thats the only reason i have one ...LOL

if my car didnt have the original engine in it i would have built a 350,400, or a big block for it and that will probably be in the near future any way now that money is getting better here...

as for the original poster of this thread dont waste your money on a 283 for your thirdgen go get a 350 or 400 for it and go from there itll be well worth it in the long run and you can get 7000-8000 rpms out of a 350 or 400 easy i have and so has ljnowell the main thing you have to do is build the proper valve trane for your engine and get good heads and the proper cam for your rpm goals then work on which kind of intake and fuel delivery set up you want ..........good luck if you decide to use the 283 but if it were me i wouldnt take it from someone that owns one now a 350 will walk circles around it all day long

 

6000 RPM isnt really pushing any properly assembled shortblock, be it 327 302 350 283 whatever. Like I said above, the 283 is best for the resto guys, but if you arent interested in making power, go for it. But, it will be a disappointment. After all the money spent, you will be able to step back and say, "damn, i could have had 75 more hp for nothing" All the coolness in the world wont make up for that.

 

yes like i stated above the 283 is in my impala only because of originality (for now) ...LOL..but when i pull it out im going to save it because if i ever sell the beast the engine can go with it .....make it worth a couple bucks more.....

yeah take the advise here and go find a 350 or 400 and make some good power for enjoyable driving pleasure...LOL..not that the 283 is as bad as a 6 cyl persa but i wouldnt use this as an engine to build up if it were my car

 

So, General, can you give me some info on your combination? What heads/intake/cam are you using, and what does the car run?

 

cars not been ran in 6 years doing a resto on it and ive been down myself with a bad back the last 3 years but finally got my spine fused and am getting ready to work on it again this winter with my boy

as for engine specs ill have to get back to you its has been a long while now since that engine was assembled and id have to go look up the paper work on it again ...lol

the engine its self has less than 500 miles on it right now after the build

 

I see. Sorry about your back. I know how easy it is to mess it up while working on cars (or any heavy lifting; that's one of the reasons I went back to school. )


Good luck to you with the car and everything though.

 

thanks and yes it is easy to mess up your back when doing anything if you dont watch what your doing...LOL

yeah when i get the specs on the engine ill look ya up and pm you on them

 

Thanks, I'd appreciate that.


Well, it's getting late here so I'm gonna call it a night for now.
See ya.

 

305 heads might work well on a 283. Small chamber, small valves.

 

About the only way really. Even though the 283 has a larger bore than a 305, you still cant get the real big valves in. A nice set of 58cc TPI 305 heads would probably do it nicely. Or some S/R Torquers.

 

Aluminium l98 vette heads would be good. Or modified late model LT1 heads (if you can get the holes in the deck welded up cheap its possible to modify a regular intake and sort out the cooling routing very easily, I've done it, cost me about $10). They breath well with 1.94 inch valves and with the right cam mucho power is possible and torque needn't be all bad.

I'm putting the LT1 heads on a 283, many have told me not to, but for me it was the cheap way to go. Here in england a 350 costs silly money but 283s are cheap when they come up, so it was an easy choice for me. I'm not looking to drag race the car (I have a BB '73 camaro for that sort of thing )

 

The L98 heads wouldnt be bad, they flow enough for a built 283. I never like the idea of modified LT1 heads. Just not my cup of tea, I guess. Neither is building 283's, I like to go fast.

 

How fast is "fast"? Does every street car need to be an 11 second drag machine in order to be fun? I don't see the point of building a huge power motor for a routinely driven street vehicle, because past a certain level you can't ever use that power (safely) on the roads anyway.

 

Vortec heads on a 283 would be like running 215cc intake heads on a "street" 350. You'll make more peak power at the cost of a bunch low end. Same with your cam, a magnum .500 lift cam will probably kill what little bit of lowend that 283 makes. It'll sure scream from 3,000 to 6,500rpm! I say go for it!

Do it on a budget though, use a flat tappet cam with lower lift numbers. A cam that would work with the vortecs stock spring setup would save money. You'll still have good mid-top performance minus about 500bucks into the motor. Find a factory forged crank if you dont have one in it already. Stock rods could be reused if properly modded. ARP fasteners and smoothing the stock rods over with a grinder would reduce the chance of cracking. I'm sure you could find some pistons on ebay...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...sPageName=WDVW

Compression is easy to fix, assuming your machine shop can mill heads and intake. I bet you could throw everything together for very little investment.

I don't agree with spunkmaster-flash here, you want to have a matched combination. A built 350 in front of a T5 is bad news. Since you have the 283 already, run with it.

 

Yeah, the simple bucks down approach has definate appeal. I've got a set of 305 heads that have been lightly ported, with a 3 angle valve job, and the guides cut for up to apx. 470 lift with positive seals. It would be an easy and cost effective build to put those heads on the motor and just stick with a basic flat tappet hydro cam.

I don't know the condition of the rotating assembly, but it's possible it may not even need to be bored over. In that case I could just have the machine shop clean everything up and then I could reassemble it as is (with ARP hardware as mentioned).

That would be a easy way for some cheap thrills!

 

Thanks for the flame. I'm not the one dumb enough to tell someone to build a 283.

I offered the help that was requested. THEGENERAL told you the exact same thing, and he has a 283. Both of us have lots of experience working with them. You will work 2X as hard to get decent power out of it. Simply put, its not a good performance engine.

 

Ive been reading this for a day now, dident have anything to say until now before this thread get locked.

You say you want an old school engine and this one is avalible. Thats all fine by my book if your set on building it then go for it. It will run fine and you probably wont notice any difference in this 283 and your current 305 mill since the 305 probably has a few miles on it.

The downfall of building the 283 is part avalibility. Yes you can get parts thats not a problem but they tend to be on the high side and are all special order. Ive built them before so I know.

If you are looking around for a power house engine this isnt it, neither is a 350 for that matter. Dont listen to all the crap about high reving no low end garbage. Its just an engine, runs like any engine it just doesent have as much potential as some of the other engines avalible.

 

EXACTLY! I dont know if I would leave it at low potential though, I would call it crappy. If we were to throw all the parts that we put on THEGENERALS 283 onto a 350 I bet we would make almost 100 hp more. Its just sickening when you are done and you look at it. Sure, it runs good. Sure, it'll outrun some stock 350's. Sure, its also a waste of money. Unless its a resto project. If I were looking for a "nostalgia" build for a thirdgen, I think I would use a 327 instead. For lots of reasons. And, like stated above, the stroke has nothing to do with it.

 

Why is a T5 bad news?

 

It generally can't take the pain of an engine above 350 ft-lbs of torque. Especially if its used. Its starts to cry for soon after the swap if you're too hard on it.

 

Okay, I got a little more info on the 283 in the garage if anyone wants to know:

When my dad got his Corvette, the car had the original engine but the heads had been f'ed up by somebody else, and they also had a crack in the water jacket. In short, they were scrap. So he went looking for replacements.

He found a guy with a worn out Chevy sedan that had a 283 engine. All my dad wanted was the heads, but the guy told him he could just have the whole engine. Since the Corvette came originally with the base 230 hp engine, the engine from the sedan was essentialy an identical type. So, he took the heads off of that motor, and used them on his Corvette motor.

So, as for the extra motor he's got, it's probably got a lot of mileage and will need to be bored at least before it's usable. Which means new pistons, which means $$$ like somebody else said, because I don't know where you get 283 pistons nowadays unless one of the aftermarket companies can do custom jobs for you. So, this wouldn't be a job I'd tackle unless I just had some money burning a hole in my pocket (yeah right!! ))


But I'd like to say that the 283 is not a junk motor. As I mentioned earlier, the combo in my dad's Corvette is essentially a factory stock motor with a cam upgrade. Stock iron intake, stock iron heads, stock exhaust manifolds and pipes. It's not even the high-perf motor either, it's the base 283.

Given all that, the car did mid 14 second quarter mile times, easy, with best times of about 14.2 seconds. That's with no power shifting, and an open differential on skinny radial tires. It's a real beast on the street, and that 6000 rpm scream always put a big grin on my face. ( he and I really need to fix the carb on that car; I miss riding in it )

By comparison, he didn't much like the L98 in his 85 Corvette. He complained that while it had plenty of torque, it was a real turd after about 4000 rpm. See, even though the cars may have run similar track times, there's more to having fun than just numbers on a page.

 

Trust me the 283 is in general,a junk motor. It can be made to perform, THEGENERAL can prove that to you. But for the money spent, its just not worth it. Any engine can have that scream past 6000 just use the right cam and valve train. Its just not worth building a 283, its kinda like building a 305.

 

agree the 283 is about as much a junk engine as any SBC gm built. at the time it was introduced it sat the world on it's ear, but not now and not even long after it was introduced. they all got forged cranks, they all have what is a bastard bore size now, but still pistons can be found easy enough. i've had several and i'd rather have just about anything else. even have one still far as that goes.

 

I read postings with amusement. When I decided to put a 283 together my brother was totally distainful, "what a dumb idea" etc..
When brother takes this approach it cements my determination.
Anyway, the car weighs 3320 with me in it, is totally street legal and driven to the track, and eventually (after1 1/2 years of R & D, tearing the engine down for incremental mods. to intake and heads), ran a best of 12.19 @ 117.20 mph through mufflers with street tires. That has gotten me past lots of larger motors including some w/ "power adders". VERY satisfying project, and my brother only barely ever squeaked by me with his 350....with a blower and 200 less pounds.

 

Nice work!! :hail:

 

Just think, with all the money spent, if it would have went on a better block (350, 400) you would have went even faster. The 283 is a turd. Any engine can be made to perform. I said that above. You just have to be stupid enough to pay for it.

 

 

me thinks airflow is a troll or someone's alter ego. joined up just to reply to this thread. yeah i can believe that.

 

PAY? Pay what? I have virtually nothing in the project. The engine
has a 452 head (free) and a 451 head for $10., a $500. speedomotive balanced bottom end kit , a $50. vintage TM-1 w/ 4779 Holley,
and a $75. set of Heddmen headers. The money is all in the time and electricity (for the air compressor), to cut on the heads and intake
for flow, atomization to chamber, and equal and proper mixture/distribution , etc.( hundreds of hours taking apart, grind ,reassemble , test at the track, and so on over and over, but I like to do it)
I have by the way, done lots of heads and built lots of other (bigger) engines. Larger (good) engines often deliver more horsepower but RARELY more HP / cu. in. given similar heads.

 

ede , yes you're right , but is namecalling the rule or the exception on this forum?

 

Who is calling names? I am not, but I am calling on your post above. I am sure that ede and a few others here will agree too. If you have ever worked with a 283, you wont again.

 

???? ..on what do you base that?
..there are people around who study hard and figure things out and with lots of effort and time, do really well at what they work at; that includes making an engine run a lot stronger than yours or your local buddies at the local "Rocketburger". Go to an NHRA national event and you will see this in actual real life before your very eyes!

 

Nice. I work at rocketburger now? I dotn believe your garbage, because of the way you presented it. Your first post was to throw gas on a fire. You arent going to be believed by a lot of poeple.

As far as attempting to belittle me or my car, it wont work. If you are dumb enough to waste your time on a 283, then I definately dont need to argue with you. I can already see where this one would go. Its probably the short stroke that makes it great too, huh? Have a nice day, troll.

 

Funny, if AIRFLOW's stance were the case, you'd think that there wouldn't be rules limiting displacement in all sorts of events. :shrug:

On a side note, you'd think if you were confident enough in your convictions, you wouldn't feel the need to use a pseudonym.

 

 

Okay, ede or some other moderator please just lock this thread. It's going nowhere now, and it looks like it's about to degenerate into a cockfight.

My sole intention was to examine one of those "what if" situations, but some people would rather just have arguements.

 

That tends to happen when a certain someone feels he has to state his opinion as fact.

 

can i have some this is getting good.....LOL