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Firebird that doesnt have any get go...!?

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Old Nov 27, 2008 | 09:27 AM
  #1  
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Car: 82 T/A 47,XXX
Engine: 305 until the ZZ4 355.
Transmission: turbo200
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Firebird that doesnt have any get go...!?

I have a 82 T/A with a 305, its out of another car, ive put on a new weind intake, brand new Holley 600 CFM carb, air cleaner, flex fan, fuel pump,new plugs and wires, and changed the dist with a USED (vacuumm advance) I feel like the car had more go with the spreadbore and quadrabog. If I try and do a brake rise it doesnt wanna like rip tire its very slow and you can tell SOMETHING is wrong, Im thinking the coil? the car maybe not timed and tuned properly as I dont know how to do that stuff but any other ideas...I KNOW the timing is off, but I dont know how to use the timing gun and all the markings and stuff. The car also SOUNDS cam'd but we have no proof, or maybe the cam is bad, it has a top end tick not bad just slightly, the rockers were just adjusted so its not that, it may actually just be low on oil . So any ideas or suggestions are greatly appreciated. Thanks guys
- -Josh
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Old Nov 27, 2008 | 10:26 AM
  #2  
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Re: Firebird that doesnt have any get go...!?

Check your oil, time the eingine, tune it, and a full tune up probably wouldn't hurt.
If you don't know how to do it, have someone else do it, or ask in the carb section.
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Old Nov 27, 2008 | 10:30 AM
  #3  
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From: Harrodsburg,Ky
Car: 89 T/A and 97 Formula (sunny days)
Engine: 305 TBI / LT1
Transmission: 700R4 / 6M
Axle/Gears: 89 IDK / 97 3.73
Re: Firebird that doesnt have any get go...!?

There are many things that can cause power loss. First thing I would check is to make sure your getting full throttle when the pedal is mashed. Have someone sit in the car (motor off) and press the gas pedal down while you make sure it is opening all the way.

Next thing I would do is a compression check just to rule out most mechanical issues.

You can loosen the distributer hold down bolt enough you can move the distributer by hand. Bump it just a tad counterclockwise to see if the car does run better. Best thing is take it to someone who can set it right.

I've seen alot of 305 nonroller motors have worn out cams by 100K miles. That will kill the power. Someone might have picked the wrong type cam for that motor to.

Valve have been adjusted? What preload are the lifters set to? It should the 3/4 turn after 0 lash.

My cousin built a 55 Chevy once and had a very good running 283 in it with a 4 speed. Later he built a 355 and his brother put the 283 in his 75 Malibu. The Malibu was a slug! The 283 had been built with a 4 speed & 4.11 gears and absolutely failed in the heavier automatic car with who knows what for gears.
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Old Nov 27, 2008 | 10:57 AM
  #4  
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Car: seeking '90.5-'92 'bird hardtop
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Re: Firebird that doesnt have any get go...!?

And throw that flex fan in the trash. Any JY should let you get the electric fan setup from a later car for $20. Don't wire it to be on anytime the ignition is on.
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Old Nov 27, 2008 | 11:01 AM
  #5  
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Car: 1987 SC/1985 TA
Engine: 350/vortec/fitech
Transmission: T56
Axle/Gears: 3.27 9-bolt
Re: Firebird that doesnt have any get go...!?

I gotta recommend the haynes or chilton manual. Unlike some of the 'better' shop manuals it will walk you through things like setting the timing which a shop manual may already assume you know how to do. If your timing is not correct NOTHING else will be.
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Old Nov 27, 2008 | 12:30 PM
  #6  
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Car: 82 T/A 47,XXX
Engine: 305 until the ZZ4 355.
Transmission: turbo200
Axle/Gears: 3.42's
Re: Firebird that doesnt have any get go...!?

thank you for all of the replys, my car has new plugs and wires already. I am getting full throttle, I prob will do a compression check this week hopefully that turns out well, if not maybe a bad cam? id hate to have to do the cam and lifters and tear it all apart though...but at the exhaust it sounds a littly lumpy nothing big at all.... So do you think i should have it timed first then check for compression? this car doesnt smoke or burn any oil by the way, but I think it has some blow by my teacher said so because it had a little smoke coming out of the valve cover breather a couple months back but it went away? its very confusing...I wish i had money for a new bottom end 350 but I just want this motor to last me this summer.
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Old Nov 27, 2008 | 01:52 PM
  #7  
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Car: 82 Berlinetta/57 Bel Air
Engine: L92/LQ4 (both w/4" stroke)
Transmission: 4L80E/4L80E
Axle/Gears: 12B-3.73/9"-3.89
Where did you set the timing? If you left it at the stock 0 degrees, it's going to be a dog. You need to set the total mechanical timing at 36 degrees or so (vacuum advance disconnected, RPMs up so the advance goes as far as it will). That is beyond the timing tab, so you either need an advancing timing light or timing tape. If you don't have either of those, set the initial (no vacuum advance, at idle) at 12 degrees for a starting point.

"Quadrabog" is a pejorative term, coined by those who didn't understand how the carb works and aren't willing to learn. As stated in the 305 thread in the FAQ forum, the carb and distributor are the last things to replace on a stock 305 carb'd car when performance is the objective. That includes replacing the 305 itself (see sig - that's the original carb, distributor, and ECM). The exception would be for a T5 car, which you have, in which case you should be using a double pumper Holley.
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Old Nov 27, 2008 | 02:10 PM
  #8  
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Car: 82 T/A 47,XXX
Engine: 305 until the ZZ4 355.
Transmission: turbo200
Axle/Gears: 3.42's
Re: Firebird that doesnt have any get go...!?

Originally Posted by five7kid
Where did you set the timing? If you left it at the stock 0 degrees, it's going to be a dog. You need to set the total mechanical timing at 36 degrees or so (vacuum advance disconnected, RPMs up so the advance goes as far as it will). That is beyond the timing tab, so you either need an advancing timing light or timing tape. If you don't have either of those, set the initial (no vacuum advance, at idle) at 12 degrees for a starting point.

"Quadrabog" is a pejorative term, coined by those who didn't understand how the carb works and aren't willing to learn. As stated in the 305 thread in the FAQ forum, the carb and distributor are the last things to replace on a stock 305 carb'd car when performance is the objective. That includes replacing the 305 itself (see sig - that's the original carb, distributor, and ECM). The exception would be for a T5 car, which you have, in which case you should be using a double pumper Holley.

my car actually is a AUTO car, im doing a T5 swap somewhere down the road, i have 3.42 posi also.

I wish I understood your outlook on the timing situation, honestly, i think the motor is plenty strong...but lets say i wanna redo this all and get it correct, where do I begin step by step, should i pull it all out, set number 1 to TDC drop it in? i just dont know much about the timing tab and where to mark it and stuff>
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Old Nov 27, 2008 | 02:28 PM
  #9  
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From: Littleton, CO USA
Car: 82 Berlinetta/57 Bel Air
Engine: L92/LQ4 (both w/4" stroke)
Transmission: 4L80E/4L80E
Axle/Gears: 12B-3.73/9"-3.89
If it runs at all, you don't need to pull the distributor (assuming you can move the distributor base far enough to get the proper timing).

A timing light is a device that emits a very short pulse of bright light (strobe) so you can "stop" the timing mark on the harmonic damper to show where the spark is occurring relative to the crank/piston position. A sensing wire is attached to the #1 spark plug wire (most lights these days are powered from the battery with positive and negative clamps), you shine the light at the damper/timing tab, and adjust the distributor base (after loosening the clamp enough to be able to rotate the distributor base) to get the proper setting. For a stock LG4, the timing at idle is set at zero degrees. For the older mechanical/vacuum advance distributor, it needs to be more like 8-12 degrees before top dead center.
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Old Nov 27, 2008 | 02:37 PM
  #10  
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Car: 82 T/A 47,XXX
Engine: 305 until the ZZ4 355.
Transmission: turbo200
Axle/Gears: 3.42's
Re: Firebird that doesnt have any get go...!?

Originally Posted by five7kid
If it runs at all, you don't need to pull the distributor (assuming you can move the distributor base far enough to get the proper timing).

A timing light is a device that emits a very short pulse of bright light (strobe) so you can "stop" the timing mark on the harmonic damper to show where the spark is occurring relative to the crank/piston position. A sensing wire is attached to the #1 spark plug wire (most lights these days are powered from the battery with positive and negative clamps), you shine the light at the damper/timing tab, and adjust the distributor base (after loosening the clamp enough to be able to rotate the distributor base) to get the proper setting. For a stock LG4, the timing at idle is set at zero degrees. For the older mechanical/vacuum advance distributor, it needs to be more like 8-12 degrees before top dead center.

let me explain you this much, I do appreciate your help, its making sense now. car will start up, my buddy messed with the timing but I had some heavy pre-ignition happening. so i retarted the timing a bit and it went away but the cars still a dog. Lets say your looking at the motor and the dist cap, now my dist cap the little block that comes off of it where the coil wires come out and stuff is turning a little bit clockwise maybe 6-7 degrees? i have no clue but its not alot. So lets say I start my car, loosen the dizy bolt and leave it as idle in park at say 900 RPM put a timing light on it where should i go from there, Im going to retard the timing is what your saying? do i need to make any marks on the damper? i think there is one already...and your saying that line needs to be 8-12 degrees before TDC so il turn the dizy counter until it meets with that mark. ? hopefully im on the right track here somewhere..
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Old Nov 27, 2008 | 02:51 PM
  #11  
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From: Littleton, CO USA
Car: 82 Berlinetta/57 Bel Air
Engine: L92/LQ4 (both w/4" stroke)
Transmission: 4L80E/4L80E
Axle/Gears: 12B-3.73/9"-3.89
Turn the distributor until the mark lines up with a timing tab mark in the 8-12 degrees range, whichever direction that is.
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Old Nov 27, 2008 | 03:14 PM
  #12  
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Car: 82 T/A 47,XXX
Engine: 305 until the ZZ4 355.
Transmission: turbo200
Axle/Gears: 3.42's
Re: Firebird that doesnt have any get go...!?

so i just need to get that marking on the il say 10 degrees and il be able to tell which way to go by which way the marks going...NOW lets say after I do that and its still *******...whats next.
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Old Nov 27, 2008 | 03:25 PM
  #13  
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From: South Carolina
Car: 85 2M6, 87 'Bird 88 'burb
Engine: LX9, LG4, L05
Transmission: F23, 700r4, 700R4
Axle/Gears: 3.63, 2.73, 4.10
Re: Firebird that doesnt have any get go...!?

a 600 holly might be a little big for a mostly stock 305, you might me getting too much fuel, or a poor vaccuum signal at part throttle. also could be too small or too large of an accelerator pump shot.
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Old Nov 27, 2008 | 03:46 PM
  #14  
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Car: 82 T/A 47,XXX
Engine: 305 until the ZZ4 355.
Transmission: turbo200
Axle/Gears: 3.42's
Re: Firebird that doesnt have any get go...!?

I do have manifolds and the factory CRAP exhaust. But I was told a 550-600 would be fine, esp that withing a couple months it will be getting a header back exhaust..
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Old Nov 27, 2008 | 03:51 PM
  #15  
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From: South Carolina
Car: 85 2M6, 87 'Bird 88 'burb
Engine: LX9, LG4, L05
Transmission: F23, 700r4, 700R4
Axle/Gears: 3.63, 2.73, 4.10
Re: Firebird that doesnt have any get go...!?

did you buy the carb brand new? if it was used it may have a blown power valve.
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Old Nov 27, 2008 | 04:54 PM
  #16  
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Car: 82 T/A 47,XXX
Engine: 305 until the ZZ4 355.
Transmission: turbo200
Axle/Gears: 3.42's
Re: Firebird that doesnt have any get go...!?

well my buddy bought it BRAND new, used it for 2 - 4 months and then i got it, but its still perfect, i really thinks its not the carb because i had an edelbrock on before this and the same problem..
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Old Nov 27, 2008 | 11:24 PM
  #17  
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From: Harrodsburg,Ky
Car: 89 T/A and 97 Formula (sunny days)
Engine: 305 TBI / LT1
Transmission: 700R4 / 6M
Axle/Gears: 89 IDK / 97 3.73
Re: Firebird that doesnt have any get go...!?

An engine does not have to smoke to be low on compression. The main thing is it can give you some answers. If one cylinder is a bit lower than the rest you might have a bad valve or worn out cam lobe (been there,done that). If all the cylinders are lower than what a manual says it should have the cam may have alot of overlap,which will kill low end power and not run good at all if the rest of the engine does not match.

Get the timing set and check the compression. When you check the compression,disable the ignition and hold the throttle wide open while cranking the motor over. Crank it at least 5 seconds per cylinder. Post the results.
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Old Nov 28, 2008 | 08:48 AM
  #18  
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Car: 82 T/A 47,XXX
Engine: 305 until the ZZ4 355.
Transmission: turbo200
Axle/Gears: 3.42's
Re: Firebird that doesnt have any get go...!?

sounds good man I appreciate it, I'll give you results within the next 3 days.
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