What's the deal with this company? Good/bad record? I did some research the other day, and while I couldn't come up with much, I did find some support for their heads. Check out this link:

http://www.jegs.com/p/Patriot+Perfor...22043/10002/-1

What's the catch? 500 horses and a year warranty for less than $5000? They have two others for sale on Jegs - one with 415 hp and the other with 450.

Would it be a safer bet to go with one of these?

http://www.jegs.com/p/GM+Performance/1127485/10002/-1

It's twice the money - why go there? Besides the fact that it's an LS series. Any input is appreciated.
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Also, there is a guy on Ebay selling his engines (base) with well over 400 horses for under $4000. I checked the guy out and he has a REAL business with a REAL reputation so now worries about Russian scams or the like. Hes got hundreds of reviews over the past couple of years....ALL good (that's a little suspicious). Why spend money going to the junk yard, tearing out used engines, cleaning them up and customizing them when you can buy these crate engines for so cheap? What's the catch? I can appreciate the immense pride and sense of accomplishment that comes from building your own engine but for someone like me, who knows very little, wouldn't one of these crate engines be more appropriate?

 

The 383 is basically an engine built with Patriot heads. You can on Patriot to find out about their heads.

The LS3, you basically have to be dedicated to an LSx swap. Much more involved than a 383 swap.

Why build? For the reason you stated, and to know exactly what's in your engine. If you aren't confident building an engine, buy one already assembled. There was a day that anyone not building their own engine was considered a poser - those days are gone.

 

Haha I sure hope so - I mean, I could understand me not fitting in with a crew of rag tag wrench monkeys who think of building the perfect engine in the same way I do about tying my shoes but on a website like this....? SHOOT, this is for third gen fanatics, right? I fit in gewwwwwd. I have just always loved the car and always loved horsepower. The two just happen to come together in one sweet package. Maybe one day I'll graduate to an engine build.

 

My mission right now is to nail down an engine in order to begin planning the other modifications that would need to be installed on a stock third gen camaro in order to cope and perform well. I would like to, like anybody else, spend less and get more. So which of the engines I listed above would be a good choice? Why pay $9000 for an ls3 with 480hp instead of paying half for a PP 383 that produces 500hp? What would you guys do?

 

buy my 350 short block for $900 that will make 500hp with good heads and intake...lol
like many things it is about what you want and want toi spend. i hate to admitt it but the ls series will have a very tame idle and good vaccume with 500hp and weigh less and get better mpg, ran the ac,power brakes,ect,ect

so why doesn't everone do it...well the price of the motor is the start, what about the install,time,wiring harness,trans,clutch,computer,smog,ect.....

I would love a ls series motors in any of my cars or trucks for that matter. but with all the motors and trans i already have it is just alot less money and easier to make do with what i've got. the price difference for me would be thousands plus alot of time, you could pay more and have someone else do it. hope that helps.....cheers and hapy new year

 

There's nothing wrong with buying a crate engine. Obviously, depending on the source, it's going to be built correctly, all you will have to do is drop it in, get it ready, and fire it up. For someone without all the specialty tools involved in building an engine, crates are a very good way to get a well built engine, without going through all the trouble of running around and finding the correct tool, or worrying about the correct installation method. The actual process of building an engine is not really that difficult. It is very VERY meticulous.

On the other hand, it's a really great feeling finishing an engine that you built yourself, firing it up for the first time, cracking open a beer, knowing you built it yourself.

That said, if you were to get a crate, of the ones you listed, the 500's look alright to me (what's the difference between the 3833S and the 3833SK?).

Another option, if you want to be slightly hands on with your motor, but not have the "hastle" of doing bearing clearances, piston rings, etc, is to buy a short block. Once a shortblock is assembled, from there to complete engine, is pretty much just bolt on stuff, which isn't all that difficult, as long as you can follow torque specs. And you still have the option of really dialing in the engine (cam selection, heads, rockers, etc).

For what it's worth, many years ago, when I was in your shoes, I opted to build my own engine. Best decision I ever made with my car.

 

That's pretty much it. A 500 HP 383 would be a bear to drive on the street, while a 480 HP LS3 would be a kitten.

And, $9000 would only get you the engine. You'd still need transmission and what it takes to mount engine/transmission.

 

^^If I could get the transmission and engine installed and tuned for under $12k then I'm golden (labor done myself, family and friends). I could spend another few thousand on a mediocre roller with suspension, brake, rearend and reinforcement mods and worry about fixing the little amenities later. I'm sure my goal will change in the near future, though. There are just too many possible pitfalls for some as mechanically illiterate as myself and too many things that I hear can and eventually will fall apart on these cars. I'm probably going to be asking questions like this, watching and listening for the next few months before I even decide on a used car. I'm just beginning to lean towards the LS series because I hear they can be tuned with a laptop computer in such a way that I can use the car as a daily driver during the week and then as a monster racer during the wknds haha. I appreciate all of your help, guys. Thanks a lot.
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Yah, and it may be something I do after this car. I try and take baby steps these days. A failed attempt at putting 500hp to the wheels on my is300 has left me a little jaded so I'm going to try and take some well educated short cuts on the next vehicle. Thanks for the input, though!

 

http://www.gmhightechperformance.com.../photo_04.html

I found this ^^ and followed it to this:

http://www.sdpc2000.com/product/19171224/ENGINE.aspx

That's over a thousand dollars off of Jeg's price, although SD's website doesn't seem to give any information that would lead me to believe they even have it in stock? anybody know whats up with that?

 

I did some more shopping and found the LS3 376/480 for even cheaper but am now intrigued by the LS3 376/515.

My question is: If I purchased one of these engines along with the controller kit that's offered for the LS3 on Jegs.com, what would I need to have and need to do to install it in a third gen camaro? I understand that some things may even have to customized and cannot be bought?

Any input or link would help me out a lot. Thanks.

 

It's an LSx swap, which is detailed in a sticky in the top section of the Engine Swap forum.

It will be more involved than an LS3 swap into a 4th gen f-body.

 

There is a guy who street races his buick T Type, with a patriot engine in it. His is holding up well. It hauls *** and he hasn't had it act up. I know that patriot heads are awesome! I have a set on my 383. Their way better than edelbrock heads for example.
I'd have no problem with trying one of there engine packages.

 

Yah I hear they make good heads. I dunno about the crate engine they make, though - the point of going with an ls3 is to get a soft idling/fuel efficient car with monster power. I'm just not sure yet.

 

Alright guys, we'll I'm not getting anything out of PMing so I've done as much research on an LS3 swap as my engine illiterate mind can comprehend and come up with the following numbers - any input will be much appreciated.

Project third gen camaro (89 iroc or 90-92 28) - $1000 after haggle
Crate LS3 376/480 - $6500 plus shipping
Controller kit for engine - $800 plus shipping
Rebuilt T56 from Tremec (handles over 500 hp) - $3000 +
Accessories for swap - $2500 + considering I have no fab skills when it comes to cars.
12 Bolt rear end - who cares I'm already over budget haha
Brakes - who cares
Suspension - who cares
Reinforcement - who cares

This can be filed under "huge fail" because my target was to build a fuel efficient road monster for under $14k with minimal knowledge of cars and has pretty much left me with two options.

An LS1 junkyard swap with upgraded internals OR a simple stroked 383 like those I've listed in this thread. I think that may be the way to go for me.

What do you guys think? Is it possible to do an LS 376/480 swap into a barely driveable roller I bought for cheap? It just doesn't seem doable. Some of the guys on this site have put over ten grand in their LS1 swap (see engine swap forum) and they didn't even use crate motors.

Like I said above - any input is appreciated as I am close to dropping the LSx swap idea and going for the more forgiving 383 swap. Thanks.

Oh and btw - I don't think I've found one person with the LS 376/480 or 515 engine in their third gen. Too new? No point? It's perplexing.

 

This may be a "dead" thread, but if not I wanted to tell you that I put Patriot performance heads on my 383 build. This was supposed to be a "mild" 383. I only put a 260 cam in it! With those heads this car became a beast! I can't brag enough about them. My next engine is gonna have them on it. I was slaughtering other 383'd 3rd gens. I eventually sold that car to a buddy who put a bigger cam in it and dumped a 200 shot of NOS and he had it making well over 500HP. That was about 7 years ago and he's still running that car and the same engine. Those are really great heads for the money!