car won't start
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Junior Member
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 13
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From: northeast ohio
Car: 04 silverado 4x4, 91 firebird
Engine: 5.3-silverado--3.1-tbi-firebird
car won't start
i have a chance to pick up a 92 z28 with 65,000 miles,garage kept for 800
the problem is the guy that is selling it lost the ignition key, so he changed the steering column,the car has the key with the little chip in it(vats) so since the column has been changed the car won't start, how would i go about fixing this, or having it fixed?
the problem is the guy that is selling it lost the ignition key, so he changed the steering column,the car has the key with the little chip in it(vats) so since the column has been changed the car won't start, how would i go about fixing this, or having it fixed?
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 558
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From: Baton Rouge, LA USA
Re: car won't start
i have a chance to pick up a 92 z28 with 65,000 miles,garage kept for 800
the problem is the guy that is selling it lost the ignition key, so he changed the steering column,the car has the key with the little chip in it(vats) so since the column has been changed the car won't start, how would i go about fixing this, or having it fixed?
the problem is the guy that is selling it lost the ignition key, so he changed the steering column,the car has the key with the little chip in it(vats) so since the column has been changed the car won't start, how would i go about fixing this, or having it fixed?
Member
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 364
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From: Walker, Louisiana
Car: 84 trans am
Engine: 305 5.0L HO
Transmission: TH350
Re: car won't start
Normally one would take a digital multimeter and measure across the resistor in the key. But your case is different...kind of reversed if you get me.Usually you have to match the resistance from the key. I used a potentiometer and set it with my multimeter to the exact same as the key.
installed across the vats wiring and it's fine.
I had to do it for my remote start function.
I actually found a suitable potentiometer in an old walkman cd player I had laying around which was broken anyways.
It's actually very easy.
Much info is available if you google it.
The resistance possibly can be learned from the ECM but I'm not 100% on that.
I read about that too.
I'll google and post back here for you.
OK
back with the edit::
I just copied and pasted this so there may be useless info here.....
installed across the vats wiring and it's fine.
I had to do it for my remote start function.
I actually found a suitable potentiometer in an old walkman cd player I had laying around which was broken anyways.
It's actually very easy.
Much info is available if you google it.
The resistance possibly can be learned from the ECM but I'm not 100% on that.
I read about that too.
I'll google and post back here for you.
OK
back with the edit::
I just copied and pasted this so there may be useless info here.....
Here's an explanation of the VATS system (which was culled from a locksmith selling VATS blanks on eBay.)
WHAT IS VATS?
Vats stands for Vehicle Anti Theft System. Lots of people refer to this type of key, as a " computer Chip key". This key or "Chip" has nothing to do with a computer, nor is it a chip. But because of the popularity of calling it a computer chip key, so will we. So that we don’t confuse. The black chip on the blade of the key, is actually a resistor. GM first started using the Vats key in 1986 on the Corvetts, then some of the Cadillacs, ect. GM uses 15 different resistors in their VATS keys. Just by looking at the keys you can’t tell the difference.
How does the VATS System work?
Each VATS key has it’s own unique cuts on the key to operate the lock. but the cuts alone will not allow the car to crank. This is called a mechanical key. Each car has a VATS module (Brain) under the dash that communicates to the starter, fuel pump, and the ignition lock. Each VATS module is randomly given a # (value) from the manufacturer. When the proper mechanical keys, along with the proper VATS chip (resistor value) turns the ignition lock, the VATS module reads the chip on the key . If it is the correct chip, the VATS module will tell the starter and the fuel pump to operate. If the wrong chip is read, the VATS module will tell the starter and the fuel pump to shut down.
How to determine the Value of your key:
By chance you may know what VATS key you now have. Most people do not. There are basically two ways to determine what VATS key you have. Remember, there are 15 differrent possibilities. First, your key can be "read" in a VATS tester. Most locksmiths have these readers, and don’t change anything to tell you. There is another way for you to read the key value yourself. If you have a Volt Meter you can test the OHMS (resistance value) of the chip yourself. Just set your Volt meter to check OHMS, take each lead and place it on each side of the "chip" on your key. A number will appear. Take that number on your volt meter and apply it to the OHMS chart below. Keep in mind that it may not be exact. Just pick the closest value to your reading.
Vats stands for Vehicle Anti Theft System. Lots of people refer to this type of key, as a " computer Chip key". This key or "Chip" has nothing to do with a computer, nor is it a chip. But because of the popularity of calling it a computer chip key, so will we. So that we don’t confuse. The black chip on the blade of the key, is actually a resistor. GM first started using the Vats key in 1986 on the Corvetts, then some of the Cadillacs, ect. GM uses 15 different resistors in their VATS keys. Just by looking at the keys you can’t tell the difference.
How does the VATS System work?
Each VATS key has it’s own unique cuts on the key to operate the lock. but the cuts alone will not allow the car to crank. This is called a mechanical key. Each car has a VATS module (Brain) under the dash that communicates to the starter, fuel pump, and the ignition lock. Each VATS module is randomly given a # (value) from the manufacturer. When the proper mechanical keys, along with the proper VATS chip (resistor value) turns the ignition lock, the VATS module reads the chip on the key . If it is the correct chip, the VATS module will tell the starter and the fuel pump to operate. If the wrong chip is read, the VATS module will tell the starter and the fuel pump to shut down.
How to determine the Value of your key:
By chance you may know what VATS key you now have. Most people do not. There are basically two ways to determine what VATS key you have. Remember, there are 15 differrent possibilities. First, your key can be "read" in a VATS tester. Most locksmiths have these readers, and don’t change anything to tell you. There is another way for you to read the key value yourself. If you have a Volt Meter you can test the OHMS (resistance value) of the chip yourself. Just set your Volt meter to check OHMS, take each lead and place it on each side of the "chip" on your key. A number will appear. Take that number on your volt meter and apply it to the OHMS chart below. Keep in mind that it may not be exact. Just pick the closest value to your reading.
This chart is for any GM product, Buick, Cadillac, Oldsombile, Chevrolet, and Pontiac that has a VATS key (single or double-sided.)
ALL OF THE ABOVE IS NOT REALLY IMPORTANT FOR YOU
VATS # (K)OHMS (Set your meter to the 20k ohm setting)
Remember, there are 15 different possibilities.
THESE VALUES ARE
1———— 0.402
2———— 0.523
3———— 0.681
4————-0.887
5————-1.130
6————-1.470
7————-1.870
8————-2.370
9————-3.010
10————3.740
11————4.750
12————6.040
13————7.500
14————9.530
15————11.801
------------------------
Now if I were you, I'd go to radio shack and buy a potentiometer that is capable of creating all those values.
Google the vats bypass instructions.
Use a DMM (digital multimeter) and set each value in turn. Trying after each attempt.
One of those values will work on the car. It has to.
Once the exact one is found you should permanently solder it into the wiring and terminate the wire that goes up to the key. this will prevent the vats from reading a combination resistance. this is very important.
Simple as that.
You're welcome.
I can go into more detail if you'd like...just PM me. I've done it more than once.
ALL OF THE ABOVE IS NOT REALLY IMPORTANT FOR YOU
VATS # (K)OHMS (Set your meter to the 20k ohm setting)
Remember, there are 15 different possibilities.
THESE VALUES ARE
1———— 0.402
2———— 0.523
3———— 0.681
4————-0.887
5————-1.130
6————-1.470
7————-1.870
8————-2.370
9————-3.010
10————3.740
11————4.750
12————6.040
13————7.500
14————9.530
15————11.801
------------------------
Now if I were you, I'd go to radio shack and buy a potentiometer that is capable of creating all those values.
Google the vats bypass instructions.
Use a DMM (digital multimeter) and set each value in turn. Trying after each attempt.
One of those values will work on the car. It has to.
Once the exact one is found you should permanently solder it into the wiring and terminate the wire that goes up to the key. this will prevent the vats from reading a combination resistance. this is very important.
Simple as that.
You're welcome.
I can go into more detail if you'd like...just PM me. I've done it more than once.
Last edited by astrosurfer; Feb 11, 2009 at 11:04 PM. Reason: added info
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Re: car won't start
I have a 92 RS(305TBI, 700R4), I purchased it as an abandoned vehicle for $300. I don't have any keys or title for it, but it has not been stolen(according to a DMV check on the VIN) and I have a friend with a towing service who says he can get a title. I have bypassed the start enable relay, but it doesn't seem to be turning on the fuel pump or maybe the TBI unit. Is there anything else I can do to get this thing going?
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From: Southern IL
Car: 88 GTA "Cocaine"
Engine: 350 tpi
Transmission: 700r4
Axle/Gears: 3.27
Re: car won't start
this guy is good and for the same money as a vats eliminator mod he can improve the spark and fuel curves to get the most out of your engine
http://www.scotthansen.net/index.html
http://www.scotthansen.net/index.html
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