Just want to throw a question out there. has anybody modified a TPI engine to use a hydrogen cell? I think it's called HHO, i had seen a site for it (http://tophhogascar.com/) but was wondering how hard it would be to do yourself and what kind of modifications would be necessary? i figure obviously you would need to program the computer because as i had heard the engine will thin it is running lean when technically it is running rich, also i figure different spark plugs maybe different timing... i dont know. so please enlighten me (and the rest of us) if you know anything about it.

 

I have looked into hydrogen power before. I have thought for a while now that a Hydrogen powered internal combustion engine could be more powerful than a comparable gasoline powered engine. Hydrogen seems to combust with more motive force than gasoline, however, gasoline actually has a much greater energy/mass ratio.

I found in my research that the hydrogen fuel cell actually produces electrical power. Most hydrogen powered vehicles today use the fuel cell to react hydrogen with oxygen to produce electrical power and run electric motors. This is the avenue that the automotive industry is taking, rather than internal combustion. A Ford R&D fuel cell project went 207mph at Bonneville using this technology. It carried a high pressure oxygen tank to increase power.

There are engines today using hydrogen to power an internal combustion engine but these are not as common. One problem is storing enough hydrogen on board to power the vehicle over a reasonable driving range. Mazda has experimented with converting gasoline engines to burn hydrogen and some industrial applications have had success. You might want to research those projects to see how they made it work.

 

N.H.R.A. ban it's use yrs ago because of the high hazard low flash point and unpredictability.A minor spark sets it off.Here in Roch,GM's own research refill station blew up hurting people's ears two miles away from the force of the blast.The other component is to handle the force of a crash and shut off the generator afterwards.No love shown to home brewers after the EMT's find that installed in their vehicle.Lastly the amount of energy it takes to produce enough hydrogen is more than the energy hydrogen produces.This finding was a Calli federal sponsored research done.

Don't fall into the traps of internet searches.This isn't anything new.Distribution for public use is maybe never going to happen.Certainly not for backyard faint of heart shade tree mechanics.WAY TOO MUCH HAZARD TO MAKE THE RISK WORTH WHILE.

 

Too true. There are means in place to supposedly reduce the danger of handling and storing hydrogen, like stratified storage tanks something like an Acetelene tank, but still, very hazardous. Especially the filling stations that would need to be in place. Huge tanks of either high pressure or liguid hydrogen. Hydrogen production at this time is very inefficient and does take more energy than what the hydrogen produced can justify but work is in progress to improve that. Hydrogen is one byproduct of nuclear power generation and as nuclear power is a necessary reality in our future, hydrogen production may become less of an issue. Still, don't think I want a filling station next to my house.

 

see, i was more or less looking into the supplementation of hydrogen(and oxygen i suppose) by chemically breaking down (saline) water with an electrical current, nothing pressurized. and the tank where the reaction takes place would be in the engine compartment with an automatic shut-off switch in case of an accident much like some racing fuel tanks do and the idea of shutting off power with a sensor much like an airbag has. obviously you could program your o2 sensor to accept the different readings the plumbing would be easier than a turbo, im guessing a perceived gain in mileage or horsepower or both would be there (which is what the system is touted as). i have heard of production cars that do something like this (volvo i think?... at least one of the german mfgrs)... so thank you for the info on pure hydrogen but i am not trying to have a hindenburg incident in my (nearly) classic camaro, i like the direction this thread is going, real information, interesting facts and people taking it seriously... so lets ask- how could it work if we were to make it(supplemental hydrogen/oxygen) work? there's a simple chemistry to it for sure.

 

I've read internet postings on this. People claiming huge fuel mileage improvements with on car hydrogen generators. I've also read postings of people who spent alot of money and time and found no improvement at all. As 1gary said, since it takes more energy to produce hydrogen using electrolysis than the net energy of the hydrogen produced, I have a hard time believing that these systems actually work.

Speaking for myself, I have a good deal of money and time invested in my IROC's engine and would never risk its health by using something like that. However, I have thought hard about trying it out on my little Suzuki Swift beater. If it worked there I might think about installing it on my wife's Suzuki Sidekick.

Before all of the research that I've done in the past few years, and all that my son(a chemical engineering major at OSU) has learned about hydrogen as a fuel, I used to think alot about a hydrogen powered HP monster. I have learned that, at least with the current state of this technology, it just isn't practical. My son talks about hydrogen and even gasoline being produced as a byproduct of nuclear power generation. This and the possible benefits of emerging technologies for the efficiency of hydrogen production, transfer and storage. We could see things change in our lifetimes.