Alright so to start with I have searched this forum numerous times and read all threads I have come across with a description of no spark/no start and have not found a fix.

I just replaced the head gaskets on my LB9 and made sure all electrical connectors were being plugged in as I went.

New ignition system parts:

Distributor
Coil
Plugs (wires coming tomorrow)
All fuses have been checked as GOOD (even the 20A by the battery)

I even went as far as replacing the ECM because of how desperate I am to get this car back on the road.

The coil is getting voltage:
Battery/system voltage to the grey wire and the same on the pink wire.

I have hooked a spark plug straight to the coil and cranked it to see if I could get anything out of the coil and nothing.
I have hooked the coil and dizzy together with only the #1 cylinder plug hooked to the dizzy and the plug out of the block to see spark and nothing.

I removed the dizzy cap and had a friend crank the car and the rotor spins while cranking.
I also went and removed the ICM from the dizzy and replaced it with the original which yielded the same no spark results.

Also, at KOEO the security light goes out after 3 seconds (good VATS system) and after a quick flash, the SEL light is steady on (good PROM).

I am currently at a complete loss for what the problem could be. ANY help would be GREATLY appreciated as I have run out of ideas here.

Thank you!!

 

I'll give a shout out.
You had the heads removed. Did you re-attach the ground strap to the block and firewall? Just something to check. grounds, grounds, grounds!

 

Yes sir!! Triple checked all connection to the block. The 2 on the passenger head and the one on the driver's head are all nice and snug.

Can't see any loose/not connected wires anywhere when I look.

Thanks for the reply!

 

Humm......if it ran before you fixed the gaskets, you must of forgot/missed a few connectors. Check the 2 connectors that go to the ignition control module on the distributor. Those had to be disconnected to take it all apart, and to pull the heads.

I'm just pulling ideas here. There's really not much electrical to be disconnected when doing that job.

 

Sadly I've triple checked all connections I can see and reach. I have no idea what is causing it to not fire the plugs.

Thanks for your ideas

EDIT: Just remembered... When I pulling the engine apart I removed what was left of the smog/A.I.R system (the black box by the A/C compressor) due to the previous owner having removed the cats and the smog pump. The connectors for the box I pulled out are sitting up under the intake manifold to keep them out of the way. From what I read before I made the decision to remove the system is the car should still run fine without it.

This is the change to the car that has been made and it ran perfect before the head gasket blew.

 

Did you try this...

KeyOn- Unplugging the 4 pin connector at the dist and quickly touching +12v to the ppl/wht wire terminal should make the injectors pulse (once) and the pump briefly run (about 2 seconds, same as prime). If this is true, then you may have a dead ignition module in the distributor.

Did you check for codes?

 

Well I've already replaced the distributor with a new (came with new ICM) and thinking the new ICM was DOA I replaced that with the original one I took off the old dist. but I can still do this test for you.

+12v to the harness side or dist. side?

Also, I do not have a scanner so I'm unable to retrieve any codes. But it would be unlikely that I could retrieve any anyway due to the battery having been unhooked 3 times through this troubleshooting process and also due to an ECM replacement that just went in an hour ago.

EDIT: Picture of the distributor to see if you can find anything wrong with it.

 

Harness side

The pic looks like a 5.0 305 rotor, which looks fine to me

If you don't have a scanner, try this trick. The are are tips all over the board on how to do this:
https://www.thirdgen.org/service-eng...ht-error-codes

Try starting the call as normal. Then if it don't start, try this trick. It may or may not set a trouble code. If it does, I'll bet it will be in the:
Code 42. Fault at electronic spark timing circuit OR Fault at direct ignition system OR Fault at fuel cutoff relay circuit You need to call out to Vetteoz on here.
I'm at a loss.

 

Alright well I plugged one end of a wire into the purple/white terminal on the harness and touched the other end to to positive terminal on the battery. Nothing happened.

Also, I have the SEL blinking the sequence talked about in the tutorial but how do I decipher what code it's giving out?

Thank you for your help thus-far. Really appreciate it!

EDIT: After watching it flash the sequence in the tutorial for about five minutes I have to say that there are no codes present in the ECM.

 

OK, one more....
Why did you change the dizzy??
Have you checked Pickup Coil in the distributor. Try this

To test the pickup coil, first disconnect the white and green module leads. Set the ohmmeter on the high scale and connect it between a ground and either the white or green lead. Any resistance measurement less than infinity requires replacement of the pickup coil.




Testing Pickup coil-Test 1 should read infinite at all times. Test 2 should read a steady value of(NNN) NNN-NNNNohms.
Pickup coil continuity is tested using an ohmmeter (on low range) between the white and green leads. Normal resistance is 500-1,500-. If a vacuum unit is used, move the vacuum advance arm while performing this test. This will detect any break in coil continuity. Such a condition can cause intermittent misfiring. Replace the pickup coil if the reading is outside the specified limits.
If no defects have been found at this time, and you still have a problem, then the module will have to be checked. If you do not have access to a module tester, the only possible alternative is a substitution test. If the module fails the substitution test, replace it.

Forgot about that.

 

I replaced the dizzy because the original was rusted beyond belief. It actually made me wonder how exactly spark was able to travel anywhere.

I did the pickup coil test and I got a reading of 876 Ohms which seems to be within tolerance going off of the paste you did below your post.
Also received an infinity reading when going from ground to green and then ground to white.

 

FLASH......FLASH FLASH is Code 12 Which is normal. It will flash each code in threes. So, it will look like this: FLASH...FLASH FLASH.........FLASH...FLASH FLASH.........FLASH...FLASH FLASH. Then it will go into codes. If it flashes the first code, say a 22, it will look like this: FLASH FLASH....FLASH FLASH 3times

Then it moves on to the next code, if any. If not, it goes back to the 12 1 FLASH...2 FLASH .

As I said, there are several post on here on how to read codes, just got to look and search a bit. You'll get there, these guys have a lot of knowledge.

Its just hard for me to understand that you have this issue by just replacing head gaskets.

 

It just kept doing this over and over:

flash, pause, flash-flash, long pause flash, pause, flash-flash, long pause flash, pause, flash-flash, long pause

Yeah trust me, I know the confusion haha. Too bad it's turning into frustration as well.

 

Well, you got familiar with the Code 12

 

1982 – 1992 ECM Trouble Codes For Camaro &
Firebird

Code Problem
or Description Possible
Causes
12
No
reference pulses to ECM.

(All)

This
code should flash whenever the “test” terminal is grounded
with the ignition on and the engine not running.

If
the engine is running and the code appears, this indicates that the
ECM is not receiving any references from the distributor.
Faulty
or loose EST connector at the distributor.
13
Oxygen
sensor circuit

(All)

Sticking
or misadjusted TPS

Faulty
wiring and/or connectors from the oxygen sensor.

Faulty
oxygen sensor.
14
Coolant
sensor circuit
(All)

If
the engine is experiencing overheating problems, rectify before
diagnosing further.

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connectors from the coolant sensor.

Faulty
coolant sensor.
15
Coolant
sensor circuit
(All)


See note for code 14.

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connectors from the coolant sensor.

Faulty
coolant sensor.

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections at the ECM.
21
Throttle
position sensor (TPS) circuit

(All)

Sticking
or misadjusted TPS plunger.

Faulty
or loose wiring/and or connectors at TPS and/or at the ECM.

Faulty
TPS.
22
Throttle
position sensor (TPS) circuit

(All)

TPS
misadjusted.

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections at the ECM.

Faulty
TPS.
23
Mixture
control (M/C) solenoid circuit

(1982 to 1984 vehicles)

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections at the M/C solenoid and/or at the
ECM.

Faulty
M/C solenoid.
23
Manifold
Air Temperature (MAT) sensor

(1985 and later vehicles)

Faulty
MAT sensor.

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections to the MAT sensor.
24
Vehicle
speed sensor (VSS) circuit

(All)


A code 24 should only be set while the
vehicle is in motion. Disregard
code 24 if set when drive wheels are not turning.

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections at the ECM.

TPS
misadjusted.

Faulty
VSS.
25
Manifold
Air Temperature (MAT) sensor

(1985 and later vehicles)
Incorrect
voltage level of signal from the MAT sensor to the ECM.
Should be above 4 volts
32
Baro
sensor circuit

(1982 to 1984 vehicles)

Short
between sensor terminals B and C or faulty wiring therein.

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections at the ECM (Terminals 1, 21 and
22).

Faulty
Baro sensor
32
EGR
system

(1985 and later vehicles)

Faulty
EGR valve.

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections at the EGR solenoid.

Faulty,
loose and/or leaking vacuum hoses to EGR valve.
32
Digital
EGR circuit

(1985 and later 3.1L V6)

Faulty
EGR valve.

Open
or short to ground in EGR valve circuit.

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections of EGR circuit.
33
Manifold
Absolute Pressure (MAP) sensor

(All 1988 and later TBI V8, 1990 and
later TPI V8)


Low vacuum sensed

Faulty
or disconnected vacuum hoses.

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections at the ECM.

Faulty
MAP sensor.
33
Manifold
Absolute Pressure (MAP) sensor circuit

(1985 and later 3.1L V6)

High
signal voltage, low vacuum.


Engine misfire and low unstable idle can set
code 33.
Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections in the sensor circuit.
33
Mass
Air Flow (MAF) sensor
(1985
to 1989 vehicles, MPFI V6 and TPI V8)
Excessive
airflow indicated.

Incorrect
voltage level at
terminal C on the MAF sensor. Should
be 0.5 volts at idle, 4.7 volts at wide open throttle (WOT)

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections at the MAF sensor.

Faulty
MAF sensor.
34
Vacuum
sensor circuit
(1982 to 1984 vehicles)

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections at the ECM (Terminals 20, 21 and
22).

Faulty
vacuum sensor wiring and/or connections.
Faulty
vacuum sensor.
34
Manifold
Absolute Pressure (MAP) sensor
(1988 and later TBI V8, 1990 and
later TPI V8)

High
vacuum sensed

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections at the ECM.
Faulty
MAP sensor
34
Manifold
Absolute Pressure (MAP) sensor circuit
(1985 and later 3.1L V6)
Low
signal voltage, high vacuum
Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections in the sensor circuit.
An intermittent open will set code 34
34
Mass
Air Flow (MAF) sensor
(1985 to 1989 vehicles, MPFI V6 and TPI V8)


Low
airflow indicated.

Incorrect
voltage level at terminal C on the MAF sensor.
Should be 0.5 volts at idle, 4.7 volts at wide open throttle (WOT).

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections at the MAF sensor.
Faulty
MAF sensor.
35
Idle
Air Control (IAC) circuit
(1987 to 1989 vehicles, MPFI V6 and
TPI V8)

Closed
throttle engine speed is 125 RPM above or below desired (commanded)
idle speed for 45 seconds.
See
a dealer service department for trouble diagnosis.
41
No
distributor signals
(1982 to 1984 vehicles)

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections at the distributor.

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections at the pickup coil.
Faulty
vacuum sensor circuit (see code 34).
41
Cylinder
select error
(1985 and later vehicles)

Terminal
D3 of ECM not properly grounded to engine.
Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections to the ECM.
42
Bypass
or EST problem
(All)

If
vehicle will not start, check wire leading to ECM terminal 12.
An
improper HEI module can cause this code.
43
Electronic
Spark Control (ESC) system
(All)

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections to ECM terminal L.

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections from the ESC controller to the ECM.

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections from the knock sensor to ESC
controller.

Voltage
at ECM A-B connector terminal B7 should be over 6 volts unless the
system is sensing detonation.
Faulty
ESC sensor and/or module.
44
Lean
exhaust

(All)
On
carburetor-equipped vehicles:

Faulty
or sticking mixture control (M/C) solenoid.


Faulty or
loose wiring and/or connections at the ECM, terminals 9 and 14.

Vacuum
leakage at carburetor base gasket.

Faulty
or loose vacuum hoses.

Faulty
or leaking intake manifold gasket.

Air
leakage at air management system-to-exhaust ports and at decel valve.

Faulty
oxygen sensor.
On
fuel injection vehicles:


Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections at the ECM.

Incorrect
fuel pressure.

Faulty
or leaking throttle body gasket.

Faulty
or leaking intake manifold gasket.

Faulty
or loose vacuum hoses.

Water
in fuel.
Faulty
oxygen sensor.
45
Rich
exhaust

(All)
On
carburetor-equipped vehicles:

Faulty
or sticking mixture control (M/C) solenoid and/or wiring.

Fuel
in evaporative charcoal canister and its components indicate rich
condition exists.

Faulty
oxygen sensor.
On
fuel injection vehicles:


Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections at the ECM.

Incorrect
fuel pressure.

Leaking
fuel injectors.

Intermittent
bursts of fuel from the injectors at idle indicate a faulty TPS.
Faulty
oxygen sensor.
46
Vehicle
Anti-Theft System (VATS)

(1985 and later 3.1 V6)

Ignition
key and/or starting procedures incorrect.

Open
or short to ground in the VATS decoder module circuit.
Should
be checked by a dealer service department if engine does not turn
over.
51
PROM
problem

(All)

The
PROM is located inside the ECM and is very delicate and easily broken.
An authorized mechanic should do all diagnostic procedures.

PROM
not properly installed in the ECM.

Faulty
PROM.
Faulty
ECM.
52
Fuel
CALPAK
(1985 and later vehicles)

CALPAK
PROM not properly installed.
Faulty
PROM.
53
System
over-voltage
(1985 and later vehicles, except
5.0L carbureted)

Voltage
at ECM terminal B2 is greater than 17.1 volts for two or more seconds.
Faulty
charging system.
53
EGR
control error
(1985 and later 5.0L carbureted)

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections to EGR solenoid.
Faulty
or loose vacuum hoses to EGR valve.
54
Mixture
control (M/C) solenoid
(1982 to 1984 vehicles)

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections from M/C solenoid to ECM.
Faulty
M/C solenoid
54
Fuel
pump circuit
(1985 and later vehicles)

Voltage
at terminal B2 is less than 2 volts for 1.5 seconds since last
reference pulse was received.

Faulty
fuel pump relay, circuit and connections.
Faulty
oil pressure switch.
55
Oxygen
sensor circuit
(1982 to 1984 vehicles)

Faulty,
loose or corroded wiring and/or connectors at the ECM.

Four-terminal
EST wiring harness too close to electrical signals such as spark plug
wires, distributor housing, alternator, etc.

Faulty
or loose wiring and/or connections of various sensors.
Faulty
oxygen sensor.
55
ECM
(1985 and later vehicles)

Faulty
ground connections to ECM.
Faulty
ECM.
61
Degraded
oxygen sensor
(1985 and later 3.1L V6)

Faulty
oxygen sensor.

 

So pretty much everything looks okay?

Everything at the distributor is perfect. In-fact I just went and fine-adjusted the cap to be more in-line with the rotor on firing order. Still nothing.

EDIT: I just did a continuity test of the ignition coil through the main power connector. Reading I got was 0.5 Ohms
Also did a distributor ground check by going from the dizzy body to the engine block. Reading I got was 0.4 Ohms.

I did the dizzy check following instruction from a post on CarJunky.com posted in 2008. This is what it said:

I also probed the 4-pin dizzy connector with a test light with the key on. Not sure if there be power going through the harness but I didn't get anything from all 4 wires.

 

Since no change , go back and do it all again

http://easyautodiagnostics.com/gm_ic...n_module_1.php

 

This is just an outside the box idea, but since the problem started after the head re&re, you have tothink something went wrong on installation. If my memory is any good, I believe the 2 pin connector at the distributor uses the same connector as the IAT connector on the bottem of the plenum. Not sure if they are even long enough to be interchanged, but it might be worth a check. What color are the wires on the external 2 pin connector going in to the ignition control module, pink/white or tan/black?

 

OMG, I was trying to think of that connector last night! I DID THAT when I changed my intake gaskets. It cranked and cranked, no spark. I looked at it and said...hummmm. I changed it after looking at it for 15 minutes and it fired right up. Damn......that was 15 years age. I think you're on to something eseibel67!

 

The 2-pin connector going to the dizzy is tan/black.

I have uploaded a picture for you as well.

Thanks for all the help guys!


HUGE Edit:
Absolutely amazing! Can't believe I switched those two connectors!! After staring at an ignition system wiring schematic for near 3 hours I never caught on to the mistake I made.
I've got spark!! No I need to get it to actually start. I get a pop every now and then so I think the timing is WAAAAY off right now.

Thanks for all your help guys!! Wouldn't have been able to find the issue without you!

For anyone that finds this thread in the future, this wiring diagram is a big help. Just look CLOSELY haha.
http://austinthirdgen.org/mkportal/m...ine_wiring.gif

Thanks again!!

 

SAME connector that I was trying to think of last night. I did the same thing, don't feel bad. Glad you found it! Make sure timing is all correct TDC#1 plug, Rotor pointed to one and all. You'll get it! Let us know the outcome!

 

Lol well at least I'm not the only one

Time to take the plugs out and see how the timing is. Not gonna be easy due to having hooker headers that are in the way of the plugs haha.

Will update when that's finished!

UPDATE (Not finished):
Pulled the valve covers, saw cylinder 5 at TDC (both valves closed) and the dist. rotor point at terminal #8. I think it's safe to say that my timing is definitely off haha.
Gonna pull the dist and set it pointing at #5. See if that helps.

UPDATE 2:
Got it! Still won't start because I think I've drained the battery of a good amount of CCAs lol but when cranking (which it does slowly) I can pops coming from each cylinder in-time and can smell it firing (which is an amazing smell btw lol)
Time to put the battery on a 15 amp charger for a couple hours and try again!

Well I think I've narrowed the slow crank speed down to a failing starter which I n\knew was going bad a while ago (only way to start the car sometimes was with a bump start due to stuck starter armature).
So I went and searched for symptoms of a dying starter motor and low-and-behold I found this:

I am facing all the problems they've listed in that quote. A LOT of chugging with all of my interior lights and instrument panel lights going VERY dim.
Time for a starter!

 

She has come back to life!!!

After getting a battery that's actually worth a d***, it was able to crank with enough force to actually fire up and run.

I had to dial in the timing a bit but it wasn't too difficult once I found which piston was at TDC and setting up the rotor to be a bit after that terminal on the cap. Setting the rotor up that way was the key to get it to run!

Started and ran the first time I did that and after a little fine tuning with moving the dizzy body around so the ICM connectors were closer to the firewall she got to idling on her own with no shaking what-so-ever!

I'll upload a video once my friend comes over and acts as the cameraman lol.

Thank you eseibel67 for the help and pointing out my mix up with connectors and 1RAMAIRWS6 for the support and help through this project!

Check back for the video later tonight!