Well one of my buds got a 2002 Camaro with a 3.8 not too long ago and I keep talking trash to him and tell him that I will beat him. I just wanted to know what you guys think would happen before I go ahead and talk any more trash to him lol. Do you think the old LO3 has it in her? His car is bone stock and I have the mods in my sig. Thanks guys.

 

well my girlfrinds 97 3.8 kills my lo3 tbi 91 rs so id assume you would have the the same fate
but at the same time my 89 iroc with the same 2.73 gears just owns here car

apperntly 190 hp rating was a joke i blow her doors off in the iroc but the weak lo3 needs alot of work to do the same

 

Whats up with your mods?

 

the way her car killls mine a few exhaust mods are not going to help you
i have an open element on my tbi only mod she pull on me by 3 car langths by 50
my 89 iroc dose just the oppisite to her kills her by 3 car langths by 50
apperently tpi and 081 heads make all the differance in these cars

whats going to happen to you is this light turns green you will get minor wheel spin from 1 wheel pell they will get none from haveing posi and jump you off the line
then there overall hp advantage will keep pulling from you you may only lose by 1 -2 car langths because you have a 5speed but there is no way unless you got better heads and a better cam the tbi cars just dont seem to have much

do you have any 1/4 mile times?

my tbi ran a 16.9 at 81 we havent tested her firebird yet
but my iroc ran 15.2@95 both camaros have the same tranny and both have 2.73 gears so the only differance is tpi and the heads

im assumeing her bird would run around a 16.0 @89 just the way her car pulls on the tbi and the way the iroc beats it but thats just a geuss

 

Exhaust is like 30hp on these cars dude.

 

for a tbi more like 8hp.. add a cam and some heads and yes 30 is expected..

 

man my car WOKE up with exhaust, looks like ill have to beat him then tell about it. Why would he have posi?

 

For a catback yes, 8 is about right, but I think he's talking about headers back. That should be around 30hp and there's plenty of proof over on the TBI boards to back it up. I know my car felt a lot stronger after the headers were on.

 

her firebird is a base model 96 and it has G80 posi and 4 wheel disc
with 3.23 gears i would believe that a 02 3.8 car would be posi aswell

 

Think it could be an option? You gotta remember I have 3.08s with rubber that is less than a month old.

 

i cant see 3.08 being all that much better then 2.73s these cars needed 3.08s as the 5speed would have been much more prone to stalling with 2.73s
i have almost new 245 goodyear Gs-c's

id say hope for the best but im pretty sure your gonna lose
i known a few people from these boards that had modded tbi cars that lost to 3.8 4th gens they have 30 hp over us to begin with and are lighter

 

yeah, I dunno, those 3.8 motors can move, I was foolish enough to race a supercharged 3.8 GTP and he absolutely destroyed me.

I raced the 3.4 liter V6 camaro, with a 5 spd I think and I beat him pretty good I'd say.

I am not saying the V6 camaro you will race is supercharged or anything, but they are mid 15 second cars. If your car is in tip top running shape then yeah, you should be able to put a fight up against him, but honestly, I think he might get you.

 

If it is an auto 3.8 it should be a good race. If it is a 5 speed I give it to the 3.8. The 5 speeds run mid 15's in stock form. I had my LO3 too and it too felt stronger with the headers and the cat back but not 30hp stronger. Either way I look to hear from you on a good race and maybe a WIN for the Third Gen!

 

ummmmm. V6 cars = no posi. Sorry.

My predictions.

Auto - you win.

Manual - depends on how long your race is from a dig. Roll = you not happy camper.

Made it simple.

 

I think it'll be a driver's race. Your open element and headers back exhaust give you about 30 hp over stock, bringing you both to the same level around 200.

In any case, it'll be a slow race.

 

With the mods you have it should be a close one.I raced a 96 firebird last week and I destroyed the guy,but then again I have a few more mods than you.I'd say if you had some gears in the back you'd take it no sweat.

 

the average stock 3.8 m5 hit mid 15s with a good driver low 15s. there is one guy that removed his jack and spare, descreened his maf, removed his exhaust at the cat and ran a 14.4

 

When my 87ss monte was stock with the 305ho 180-190hp I would smoke my brothers 90rs.Alot of this was gear. I had 3:73 when he had 2:73.If we ran on the highway he would win after 70 but I don't think you are going to start racing at 70.I ran a best of 15.5 in the 1/4. I did lose to several 3.8s but never a 3.4. His hp in the top end is were he is going to pull you. It could still be a close race if he is a bad driver and make sure your car is properly tuned.

 

the car he is racing is a stock 5 speed 3.8 with 200hp 225 tq NO posi and 3.23's. The tbi should have that much hp and a hell of a lot more torque which should make up for his 3.08. They weigh about the same so you really cant say his v8 is heavier since fouthgens are alittle more heavier then thirdgens. And for the record the only 4th gen v6 cars that came with posi are the y87 performance option. It should be close but i think the lo3 would win. And 3.8 sound horrible with exhaust the ones at the track modded ran 15.5s they sounded like hondas my old 3.1 sounded meaner.

 

I dunno guys the 3.8 will probably not see any mods, and I will not race from a roll so we will see. What about throwing on the 1.6 rr in my closet?

 

Go ahead and put the rockers on.that should definately help you out.

 

race once b4 and again after to gauge the difference the rockers make

 

With the mods you have, I'm giving you the edge in this one, but it'll be close. Go get out there and find out!

 

i retract most all my comments me and lisa went to the track



96 firebird 3.8 91 RS 305
+.1700 Reaction +.3048
2.4920 60foot 2.4012
6.9700 330foot 6.8562
10.7100 1/8 ET 10.5851
66.27 1/8 mph 65.4460
13.8492 1000' ET 13.7131
16.6021 1/4 ET 16.4460
82.82 1/4 mph 83.96

this was the only run that i beat her she beat me 2 times in a row i took her the 3rd time

her best run of the day was a 16.44@84.19mph
my 2 best runs where 16.44@83.96 and also 16.46@84.28

my worst run was a 16.84@81
her worst run was 16.81@82



both still have the gm mufflers

i put an open element on only mod for my car
both cars are autos

i have 2.73 gears open
she has 3.23 gears posi

she makes 200hp 200 torque
i make 170hp 255 torque just going from the books dyno dosnt work with my speed limiter

both cars seem to be equal its just how hot the rs is really thats what messed with my times

 

I'm glad you corrected that. I was about to say a 16.9 sounds more like a third-gen V6 than a 305 TBI.

 

my first run of the day was a 17.04@82.40 but i had the ac on in the stageing lanes to keep the fan on forgot turn it off till somewhere around the 1/8mile marker lol
my black 91 3.1 v6 ran a 16.1@87 all i did on that was gut the ac on that
but it also weighed 2955 lbs with me in it my tbi is 3350 with me in it


mind you on the street she is still beating me as the engine temp dosnt seem to affect her cars power as much as it effects mine i had to run mine cold to get the 16.4s so at this point i think thats the best this car is good for i ran the car 6 times pulls 16.8-17 when warm and 16.4- 16.6 when cold but her car seems to run more consistantly around 16.5-6 mine is dependent on how hot the car is

also on a side note there was an escape v6 awd running 100% consistant 17.01 every time he must have ran it 20 times lol

 

dont know this for sure, but i think 4th gen V6 maros had limited slips in them. i know my 94 w/ a 3.4 did. can anyone confirm or deny this?

 

My son has a 2000 Firebird 3.8 auto w/3.42 gears. The RPO has his rearend as a G80 which is the LSD (posi). This is stock form w/the Y87 performance package & W68 apperance package. My old 90RS LO3 w/ultimate TBI mods, exhaust & Timing advance could NOT come close to it. It has traction control & that thing really launches out of the hole. So I guess all I can say is good luck & when you get done you could always say that you missed a shift or something.

 

I have some insight on this. I raced a 3.8 a while back. I had open element and lack of cat back.

He wasn't that good of a driver because he didn't get the stall up before launching.

We were dead even up to about 60 and he pulled about a car... but I still won because he broke something lol.

With just exhaust and headers back it would be close. With even some slight mods though you should take a 3.8

 

LOL@30hp increase on a LO3 with headers back. That's funny.

I'd say a driver's race, edge going to the 3.8.

 

gotta love the butt dyno. when was the last time you calibrated it?

a lot of times new products and being excited over just having bought something to put on your car with previous expectations as to what it will do even more when it makes different noises tends to throw the calibration off.

 

You probably have never seen how bad the stock exaust on an l03.

Read this
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/tbi/...m-pushing.html

 

Agreed. 30 hp is out there. It's called "exaggeration".

 

I'm sure you read through that in 8 min wise guy.

 

Actually now that you mention it I did little LO3 boy....

And your point is?

 

That you have absolutly no clue what your talking about. To be honest I'm suprised that you can read, guess that 5th grade education is really paying off for ya.

 

Can we stop messing up the thread.

 

Well whatever like I said when the kid wants to go, ill show u I can beat him. There was no butt dyno to this, the car was on stands for 3 months and there is no doubt a difference with me having no baseline.

 

My bud has a stock 3.8 '00 Camaro, with 5 spd. I posted a VERY similar thread a couple months ago.
There wasn't any trash talking about how much hp full exhaust makes, but it did yield that I would need a lot of work over my dual snorkel to even make it a race.

My thread summary: full exhaust, dual snorkel, and chip work was iffy for me to win, 3.42 gears making it less iffy, and cam and heads making me a definite win.

 

From what I've read these cars will gain about 20 to the ground from headers/y-pipe/catback. That's about 30 at the flywheel?

 

 

hey i have a 305, tbi, bone stock, and i have subs in the back of my hatch with 2 amps,

R/T - .273
60' - 2.281
330- 6.742
1.8 - 10.413
MPH - 64.91
1000 - 13.551
1/4 - 16.261
MPH - 83.72
engine temp 225, i ran with it at 180 and it turned a 16.36 and as it heated up the better it ran down the track
sure its still slow but i took my buddies 3.8 firebird by about 3 lengths in the 1/4

 

your buddy can't drive his 3.8 worth a damn then or just has a sick car

 

that is what i was going to say but i am sure you guys a tired of me beating it in to your heads that 3.8 5 speed f-body's are low 15 second cars

 

Long Tube headers (1 1/2" X 3" X around 30" non equal tube), dual 3" exhaust, X-Pipe, 2 high flow cats, dual flowmaster 3" in/3" out mufflers with dual 3" tail pipes was worth 26 RWHP/19 RWTQ on my otherwise essentially stock carbed 305 (tweaked Q-jet, stock cast iron Q-Jet intake, stock 929 cam, stock 601 heads, recurved distributer). That was up to a total of 191 RWHP @ 4,500 and 273 RWTQ @ 3,400. It maintained almost those same power numbers when it was swapped to TBI. A 204/214 @ .050 "RV" cam was worth another 15 RWHP/ 7RWTQ without signifigantly raising the peak tq/ peak HP rpms.

That was over the stock Van exhaust that is much better flowing than the L03 F-body junk (2 1/4" exit manifolds, 3" Y, 3" cat, 3" single in/ Dual 2 1/4" out muffler.

A stock truck 305 was rated at 175 FWHP/265 FWTQ.

 

Im not doubting your story or that it could be possible, but I would like to see that for myself.

 

Well update since last time, the kid told me he put an air lid on which I didnt even know that 3.8s had and I just put my pulleys on. As soon as he stops being gay about gas in his car and all that, we will line up.

 

Check him out, he's on camaroz28.com.


Edit:

http://www.cardomain.com/ride/514505

His name on cz28 is MustangEater82

 

My 86 Trans Am LG4 (less power than L03) vs my brothers 96 Camaro 3.8 5 speed.
http://www.transamws6.com/video/manny_vs_lino.wmv

 

90camarotbi, have you raced him yet?