Actually Don, running the number gets respect. You sir are definately doing that at 150+, BUT fast is fast. On the bottle or not. Just because they don't have a BB with a roots blower doesn't mean they aren't making power, they are just doing it in a different way. Your sig reads "Chronologically challenged"; I would just say you are challenged by new technology. No disrespect, just maybe a younger prospective.

I really don't understand what the difference is between nitrous and any other mod you put on your car??? Nitrous bolts on just like everything else and I want someone to give a valid point as to why it's cheating...as long as someone isn't hiding it and telling you they don't have it. Besides that last time I checked you can't tell if a car has internal engine work or gears done to it by looking at it. Is that cheating??? Mine is not hidden at all and I'll tell anyone I have it if they ask. If I get beat in a race I don't sing the blues if the car had nitrous, I just admit I got beat, plain and simple. If anyone says when they get beat by a nitrous car that they were cheating they need to either build their car to handle a car with nitrous or buy one yourself. As far as Dyno Don saying that it's a crutch and when you're out your car'll fall on it's face, correct me if I'm wrong but my car runs 12.90's without nitrous which I figured was a fairly fast street car. If someone is afraid to grenade their motors running nitrous that's not my or anyone elses fault because we have the gut's to do it (correctly so you wont grenade your motor) so cry your cheating stories to someone else. Thank you for your cooperation in this matter

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2000 NHRA Edition T/A
Pewter Metallic
A4 3.23 Gear w/GSC's
Whisper lid, MAF Ends, Ram Air Kit, Exhaust C/O
Nitrous Express 150hp kit
Best NA Times
60ft:1.94
1/8th:8.381@86.03
1/4:12.963@108.44

1989 IROC-Z 5.7 Dual Cat
Auto w/3.27 gears
Jet Stage 2 chip
Modified Air Box&MAF
AFPR&Air Foil

In my opinion they can't be beat for easy hp if you don't want to ruin the everyday milage or dependability of your car. If you put it on a high compression 400 be very carefull as you'll probably blow head gaskets like crazy as 400's have very little space between the cylinders due to their 4.125" bore. An o-ringed block would be a good investment for those motors even w/o nitrous. I've built a few 400's in the past and unfortunatly know from experience about head gaskets on those motors. Good luck if you decide to get one.



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2000 NHRA Edition T/A
Pewter Metallic
A4 3.23 Gear w/GSC's
Whisper lid, MAF Ends, Ram Air Kit, Exhaust C/O
Nitrous Express 150hp kit
Best NA Times
60ft:1.94
1/8th:8.381@86.03
1/4:12.963@108.44

1989 IROC-Z 5.7 Dual Cat
Auto w/3.27 gears
Jet Stage 2 chip
Modified Air Box&MAF
AFPR&Air Foil

Intelligent ones that don't use it don't need to make excuses like the rest of you guys. Read the list you all have an excuse and you KNOW what they say about excuses.

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Chronologically challenged. But still kicking!
'92 CAMARO RS
305 TBI 5/spd (now TPI)
B4C Alt.
Cam change:TRW 198/210 ,450/.460 114 LSA
Stock TBI manifolds
'85 IROC Ex.
14.94-92.00 mph
SPDC base and "350" Vortec coming soon!
'69 camaro-BB/Lenco,1050 dominators, /Pump Gas/no drugs 8.97-150+/3200lbs.
SoCal Thirdgen F-Bodies

I believe it comes down to the fact that we all don't have the the kind of money to blow on a race car like you've got there...

Who's givin' excuses. I have no excuse for having it. I have a somewhat fast car and I want it faster. Where's the excuse??? Sounds to me like you're givin' excuses why you shouldn't have one. Plus the intelligent ones that don't have it get blown away
And the non intelligent ones that do smile



------------------
2000 NHRA Edition T/A
Pewter Metallic
A4 3.23 Gear w/GSC's
Whisper lid, MAF Ends, Ram Air Kit, Exhaust C/O
Nitrous Express 150hp kit
Best NA Times
60ft:1.94
1/8th:8.381@86.03
1/4:12.963@108.44

1989 IROC-Z 5.7 Dual Cat
Auto w/3.27 gears
Jet Stage 2 chip
Modified Air Box&MAF
AFPR&Air Foil

You know what else they say; "You can't teach an old dog new tricks." I don't understand how you can have an 8 second car and can't understand the appeal and streetability of nitrous. I guess you never will. You should go to the World Street Finals with that attitude and we will see who is making excuses . There is always that guy there who makes a big deal about not running nitrous. They usually are running a 600+cid and lose to a nitrous fed small block .

You can go fast over the side of a cliff which could be fun to watch but would get no respect.
If you push the button you will ultimately become a LOSER and buy a motor and then you will spend the big bucks, so like the man said you can pay me now or you can pay me later.



------------------
Chronologically challenged. But still kicking!
'92 CAMARO RS
305 TBI 5/spd (now TPI)
B4C Alt.
Cam change:TRW 198/210 ,450/.460 114 LSA
Stock TBI manifolds
'85 IROC Ex.
14.94-92.00 mph
SPDC base and "350" Vortec coming soon!
'69 camaro-BB/Lenco,1050 dominators, /Pump Gas/no drugs 8.97-150+/3200lbs.
SoCal Thirdgen F-Bodies

There should only be preferences here, there is no way that nitrous can be considered "cheating". People say "Oh, without the nitrous your car is slow"...that's like telling my friend who has a 2001 Mustang GT with a Paxton on it that his car is slow without the Paxton supercharger - he runs 11's with the car. That's a load of crap. Whatever makes horsepower makes horsepower, whether you like it or not. Having forced induction to make mega horsepower is no different than a chemical causing the car to make mega horsepower. People just whine because you can turn it on and off. It's a load of garbage.

And I just want to comment on Nic, whose signature said this:

"1992 Mustang LX 5.0 Convertible
14.23 @ 95.something - 100% bone stock motor - it's been a while since I've ran this one"

There is NO WAY in HELL that you got a bone stock 5.0 to run a 14.2. I don't believe you.

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1992 Camaro RS (Auto) 5.0L TBI
-
Performance mods
NOS (125 HP shot), Dynomax cat-back exhaust, Hedman headers, no cat, custom high beam delete ram air w/ K&N, MSD 6A ignition, MSD 8.5mm plug wires, LT1 camshaft
Soon to be installed:
Edelbrock Perfomer TBI intake, B & M 2200 RPM stall torque converter, Trans Go shift kit, World Products Torquer heads, Ed Wright Fast Chip

Audio
Sony Xplod CDX-M610 head unit, Pioneer 2-way 4x6 front speakers, Pioneer 3-way 6x9 rear speakers, 12 inch Pioneer VCCS PRO subwoofer, QLogic sealed box, Kicker ZR360 amplifier, Lightning Audio 1 farad capacitor

Other
Macewen White Faced Gauges/Shift overlay, A-pillar gauges (Phantom oil pressure, Air/Fuel), 180* thermostat, Window Tint, chrome valve covers, xenon headlights

Eat my @ss jerkoff. Running an all motor car must make you the expert on nitrous I think that also means you have a bigger **** than the rest of us too.

What a fu(king a$$hole.

edit: stupid thing wouldn't let me say ****


[This message has been edited by Violate 3.8 (edited October 23, 2001).]

I agree...I thought they ran 14.8-15.1?
correct me if i'm wrong nic...
I have alot of friends who have mustangs, and i actually like them....Just curious if you have the 302 HO or something


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1998 Ford Ranger 3.0 Cold air intake and flowmaster exhaust.
FOR SALE: 1995 Red T-Top Camaro...Got a ticket, now my insurance is too high...
1989 5.0 RS

Bone Stock usually means "Bone Stock" motor. And if thats a bone stock motor than it is more than true. My dads goal is to hit 12s without touching the motor (besides pulleys) in his 1991 5.0 LX. It's gone 13.7 with pulleys, gears, and a K&N.

Truth hurts huh?

It's a desired path of travel. Some people like it n/a some people like turbos some blowers some juice... and some a combination of these two or even three.
How is it cheating? If you can do it it's legal. I hate it when someone says... oh i didnt know he was running a shot... Thats lame, why do people race? TO WIN. Most of all to win under any circumstances (we all know im not talking running the other guy off the road here... mechanically) if i shave my doorhandles and cut my weightdown by 300 lbs how is that different then adding a cam? I mean... It's all the same in the end it all equals horsepower and torque ultimately we hope it equals a tenth. Whomever says "nitrous ruins engines" is ill-informed, furthermore anyone who has ideas that juice is cheating is ill-informed about drag racing.
For the books, im not running a shot.

But i must admit i think it's funny when i ask a ***** to race and he says let me pull over so i turn on my "naws" like it's pronounced in the fast and the furious

You evidently don't know a whole lot about the competition. Never in a million years have I said it was bone stock, just that the motor was bone stock...big difference there. There's a bunch of guys with 5-speed stangs running 12's on bone stock motors, let alone 14.20's. That car has had a ton of work done to it:

gears, converter, 90/10's, 50/50's, drag launch springs, o/r x, flowmaster catback, SSM lift bars, weight removal (race weight w/driver was 3360 lbs), 6 pt cage, drag radials, skinnies up front w/165's, removed front swaybar.

Anyway, if you've still got issues with what my car has ran take that up elsewhere rather than in the middle of a non-related thread. Back to the topic at hand...as I said earlier...unless there's a predetermind set of rules that you can't run n2o then it's by no means cheating.

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1989 Mustang LX 5.0 Coupe
13.34@106.7 - needs more gear and converter

1992 Mustang LX 5.0 Convertible
14.23 @ 95.something - 100% bone stock motor - it's been a while since I've ran this one

1993 LX 2.3L Hatchback - "The Ride to VCU"

Moderator Stangtec.com, SN95.com
Amelia and Nic's Twin Terrors

Do you realize that most nitrous systems use the TPS to actuate the spray, not a push button. Once again, stop talking about something that you know nothing about.

if nitrous is cheating, then a supercharger or turbocharger is cheating. all three just introduce more oxygen into the combustion chambers. nitrous isnt a fuel, it doesnt burn. the people who say it is cheating are more than likely just scared of "horror stories" they have heard about NOS, like the "bottle blowing up in the car"

Damn, I wish I had a picture of that one, took out the side of his garage too!!!

Certainly I know what ativates it, what do you think is on the end of that TPS a string or something, Hello it's a BUTTON!
As far as being legal, well, NHRA sets the standard in this game and if you don't believe that just ask Darryl Alterman(about getting caught with your hand in the cookie jar).

here is my take:

imho, NOS is fine to make a fast car faster, but not a slow car moderate. Just my two pennies

i think my 4th gen is slow, but i may still put nitrous on it to make it faster...so in that sense, i'm makin a slow car faster
It's all about HP to me...however you obtain it, works for me.

and btw Nic, i wasn't flamin ya, i was wondering about stock speeds of those cars. cause my friend just got one, and the track is closed...i told him about your car though...he said that is awesome on a stock motor...i'm the only one outta of my car group of friends who doesn't have a mustang.
but i like them alot

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1998 Ford Ranger 3.0 Cold air intake and flowmaster exhaust.
FOR SALE: 1995 Red T-Top Camaro...Got a ticket, now my insurance is too high...
1989 5.0 RS

What is this NOS you speak of? Are you talking about a specific brand (nitrous oxide systems) or about N20 in general. This seems to be a heated argument, but I guess I will put my 2 cents in also. I agree with most people above saying that in a set-up no nitrous race, spraying is most definately cheating. But in the underground (at least where I live) anything goes. As far as all of the people saying it isn't REAL hp, anything that drops an et or shows improvement on the dyno is obviously real. It also makes it a lot easier to drive on a daily basis. I have taken too many people's money to say anything bad about nitrous, and most have been dying to install it since.
-Brad

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*daily driver* '88 Firebird
-TPI 350, cat-back, cold air, 125 shot, 13.64@102
*sleeper* '70 Nova
-Motown 427 (race prepped by Bill Mitchell), mini ram, 2 stage N2O, 3100lbs, runs 8.40's all day, street legal (to a cops untrained eye).

From what I've read and heard over time NOS is hard on a motor if you don't know what your doing. I saw in a magazine a tpi car that was running a direct port system for NOS instead of a plate. He had it all tweaked out even switched to a differect computer chip when it was enabled for more fuel and different spark advance. He said he's hasn't had problems with it for like 2 years ever since he put it on. But on the other hand you get people with little experience like me who start to think wooo 150-175 hp bolt-on on a stock motor! Try to enable the NOS to early or they don't do anything with the fuel injectors or spark so the pistons get hot spots from it then they burn a piston or just screw the motor all up. It's not one of the spur of the moment deals, you have the plan out the motor if you plan on running a big shot. Thats just my opinion of since I've never ran it. So don't flame me.

My friends one time pinned a wastegate open on a four banger with a turbo and made 800hp for 4 seconds on the dyno but then it blew out rods everywhere. Was it a good idea probably not.

One guy I know has an 89 RS camaro 305tpi/ 5 spd. He's done a few mods on it and put a 75 shot on it. It runs consistent 15.1s. He just put it on to play until he gets everything together for his LS1/ T56 swap. He tried blowing his 305 up at the track so he could convince his wife he needed a 350 in the meantime but couldn't. He put the biggest nitrous jets he had on it. I think they were 175 horse jets, maybe 200. Then, he went and ran it. About halfway down the track, fuel would shut off, and he'd just coast through the finish line. He was able to bring his car down to 14.9s with it shutting off. We wee laughing so hard. He made 6 more passes like that and the engine never graoned once, so he gave up trying to kill it and went home. The engine is still running through some act of G o d.

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The Sumbitch is Broken
82 Camaro:350, Erson cam, ported heads,Comp Cams 1.6:1 rocker arms, Edelbrock Performer RPM intake, Holley 600cfm,
TH350 tranny with 2500 stall, Eibach Pro Kit, SLP 1 3/4" headers with 3" Flowmaster exhaust

Oh, you mean the act of G<x>od? I don't see why you people can't say it right? Gawsh!

NOS? I prefer Nitrous Works.

-Todd-