Christine's last e-test is officially history!! Let the games begin!!

Tracey:lala:

 

1. Ditch the cat
2. Ditch EGR and all other emissions. They don't really slow you down, but are a great potential source of vacuum leaks.
3. Bolt on that performer

 

I wanna go carb shopping so bad!!! I can hardly wait!!!

 

A properly tuned Q can feed your 305 all it will ever need.

 

It won't fit the new Perfomer RPM though unfortunately. At least that's my understanding. It needs a rebuild anyway so I have no issues with buying a new Edelbrock. carb...and some headers...and a cam...

Must..sell...snowtires...

 

Wooo hooo! Congrats ...I still got 2 more e-tests ( I think ) to go.

 

I swear, it was a big moment...kinda like my car just graduated from school. That Perfomer RPM is quite a bit taller than my stock intake...I'm hoping with an Edelbrock carb and that nice chrome drop base air cleaner, I'll have no hood clearance issues. Man, this is cool. I hope this warm weather holds out because I'm going to want to get cracking on this stuff and then I'm going to want to drive.

 

Congrats!!!
but I would buy a holley before an edelbrock anyday, alot easier to tune, no metering rod BS, but thats just my opinion!
Go out and have fun!

 

sweet........way to go. you are all set.

 

I have no preference one way or the other but I have been advised that there are fewer hood clearance issues with the Edelbrock. I am pretty darn tickled about the pass! Woohoo!!!

 

make sure you dont go any bigger than a 650 cfm for a 305.....that might even be a little larger, but if you ever go 350 it will do real nice. if you plan on keeping the 5-speed you can get mechanical secondaries

ps. get some good fel-pro gaskets for that intake. they have them at canadian tire. just ask for them at the parts counter, they come as a set with a distributor gasket as well

 

Thats awesome Tracey! I still got 4 or 5 more to go damn... To bad they wouldnt just let me take em all at once . Cant even get mine till I get a new catback (leaks in some spots, could weld, but my CB sucks and needs replacing anyway). I wish I thought about that 20 year thing when I bought the car. Would just done a front fascia implant and put a tpi or lt-1 motor in.
greg

 

Hye...if you have hood clearance problems, that makes for a good excuse to get a cowl induction hood!

 

Congrats on the etest Tracey! Now just get that intake on

If you need a hand installing it, let me know.

 

Oh yeah!!!

I can only dream of no more E tests.

My camaro and my wifes Bird (Sunbird that is) both had to go through the dreaded e-test this year. last year it was our Cavalier so I guess it will be coming up again soon.

Happy moding.

Ric

 

Congrats, Tracey. And , yes Irocker, we still have two tests to go I can only hope that I pass.

 

awsome...........i think i have 1 more.......its all anyways

 

Good to go. I have 1 maybe 2 more to go. I failed miserably, but whatever. The 383 likes it's fuel.

 

Dave did you pass on monday? I went Friday and they said I need to get leaks fixed so cat back here I come. I got a free complete 2nd gen exhaust from my uncle so I might just get an I pipe and use the 3 inch inlet flowmaster and see how it sounds. So if I get pulled over cause of my stickers, I am gonna be POed for sure
greg

 

Well, I got the conditional pass. But technically, i need $2920 worth of stuff to be "E-friendly". But thats never gonna happen. i just paid them $200 to do what i'd like and they give me a conditional. In two years i have to spend $450 to get a conditional. They said my cam was too big and I'd never pass, so in another 2 years,...I think I'll get a bigger cam and have them put it in.

 

You can only have one conditional pass..You have to get it fixed to fully pass..Also a cam change is not considered an emission expense

Daz

 

Yes it is. One reason they put down why i failed was the my cam was "too high performance" and that a cam change will qualify. The government doesn't have to know what kind of cam, but that I'm swapping to "hopefully" be more e-friendly.

And who told you that you can only get one conditional pass?

You can fail and get conditional passes for up to 5 years, if it doesn't pass after the 5th year then they take it off the road.
Even if I passed the sniffer test, i still don't have the necessary equipment to pass the visual. so I'll ride it out for 5 years, them I'm 20 yrs old, and I'm exempt.

 

That worked out pretty good then. You should try and work some slicks in there for next years cond. pass lol. I might have to take the conditional if mine fails. I will probly blow it on 2 new cats. Not that mine are shot, but with a catback they will definately be the restriction.
Dave have you tried hot rod status? Some places say you need a different block casting but Ive heard of people getting it with a stroker... You just need to get a letter from a shop, then a dealer, then send it to drive clean from what I understand.
greg

 

hey wait a second... Anyone know if they would give me a conditional when I pick up a catback? They said they wouldnt give me a test cause mine leaks... thanks
greg

 

I bought the engine from THEM and THEY said I would get hotrod status. Then, I got THEM to test it with all documentation from GM and their original receipts and they said they couldn't do it cause it was still a 350 block. Oh, well they'll hook me up with performance parts, and say they're emmissions parts instead, i just have to pay for it. And slicks won't do.
Unless you go 327 or 400 block, I doubt you'll get hotrod either.

 

I think it can be done from what Ive read (which probly doesnt matter). Didnt someone say awhile ago that their DC shop gave them hot rod for an intake and headers? It seems to me like its kinda up in the air. If I were you I would just get a letter from the shop saying its a displacement you could never buy with your car and not mention a thing about the block then try doing it yourself. Somewhere along the line you might get lucky and find someone who says ok. I wonder what displacement a 400 block would be with a 283 crank... probly a bad combo eh? BTW what shop are you reffering to? Think they would give me the same kind of deal? Thanks again...
greg

 

My understanding of the Hot Rod status is that the car has to have an engine which was never available to that particular vehicle as an option from the dealer when it was new. I erad about the guy with the headers and what not that got the status, but as I recall even he didn't think that was right, but like most of us, he wasn't about to argue the fact either. he just counted his lukcy stars and took the pass graciously..smart fellow. That's just my 2 cents.
Tracey

P.S. This is form the Ontario Drive Clean FAQ page:

What happens if I change(d) the motor in my Light-Duty vehicle?

If the vehicle is included in the program (appropriate age, registered in the program area), it will be considered a hot rod if the motor differs from the type that was originally offered by the manufacturer for that particular model year. All hot rods registered as the model year 1999 or earlier will continue to be tested according to 1980 emission standards. Vehicles registered as model year 2000 and later will be tested according to emission standards for their model year. Vehicles built to non-Canadian standards but imported into Canada will be tested similarly. Other specialty vehicles will be tested according to 1980 emission standards for an indefinite period, except for vehicles that have "kit" marked on the vehicle licence. Kit cars are exempt from the Drive Clean program.

 

I heard about the guy who got hotrod status too, and from what I know about it, from the "I" code to the "R" code, is that all the sniffer test limits are exactly the same. Except NOppm is slightly higher on the "R" code. That's all.
The major difference is in the visual inspection.
In the inspection for hotrod status the only thing that needed to pass was the "gas cap pressure test". None of the other tests or inspections applied or weren't done at least.
But, a car still needs to pass the sniffer, to pass inspection, reguardless.
Habibb.
( the names have been changed to protect the innocent )

 

Don't want to burst anyone's bubble but, if you just passed your last emmisions test this by no means makes it a good idea to rip off all your emissions equipment. They now have emissions "police" that are (right now) targeting vehicles that are exempt from drive clean (20 years and older) and doing roadside checks for emissions equipment ie. cats etc.. I know a guy that just got nailed in his truck, it was a $475.00 fine. Even though that truck was 27 years old and did not need to pass the ODC testing, MTO requires all emissions equipment originally installed by the manufacturer to be present on the vehicle - regardless of age. Just as a note, this legislation has always been, just not enforced on the general driving public (mostly big trucks owned by businesses) Now it seems, we ARE being targeted, which worries me because my 20 year old stang has SFA for emissions equipment left...

On a positive note, you can still make 1000 hp and pollute like a paper mill, just make sure all your emissions stuff is still intact.

 

Actually I think anything over 500 HP is technically not street legal.... but until they get their protable dyno invented we should be okay.

 

500 hp, that's it?? are you serious?? what about those new 550hp Vipers Is this written somewhere? (just curious)

 

I'm not sure... someone told me that once.

They were saying that if you wanted to import a lambo it had to be detuned before you could plate it in Canada. Now that I think about it... sounds like BS.

 

I hope so (not that they would ever know without the mobile dyno) because I will certainly exceed that with the TT project looming ever closer I've got the twins in the garage, and they have already been proven at over 600 FWHP

 

hahaha portable dyno... I would try and get pulled over. They would be,
ham: ok 380 rwhp your ok.
me: Thats it?!?!?! here just lemme tune the fuel pressure a bit pigger...
me: Whats that? oink oink? make some sense damnit!
greg

 

Um, not that I'm saying you're incorrect or anything, but who exactly are "they"??

"They now have emissions "police" that are (right now) targeting vehicles that are exempt from drive clean (20 years and older) and doing roadside checks for emissions equipment ie. cats etc.. I know a guy that just got nailed in his truck, it was a $475.00 fine"

 

"They" are the performance shop that I bought the engine from. The owner (the father) runs the performance part, and his son runs the service/emmissions part of the shop. The Father made up the engine kit and said it would get Hotrod status, so we got it. the I took it in for testing and the son said his father didn't know how things worked. I was a little ticked.

As the the roadside checks, they can kiss my ***.

 

That doesn't sound like it refers to what I was getting at. I meant who has "emissions police"? I don't plan on doing anything retardedly obvious like taking the cat off. But I was curious as to who the emissions police were. That's all. And I don't suspect the work out of a performance shop...although that would make it more of a challenge. That would just be evil.

 

I've heard rumors that your a police officer Tracy. If so, what do you think of all of this new emmission laws and such?

 

Sorry, man. I'm not biting on that one again. I have my own opinion, let's leave it at that.:nono:

 

I understand. But, the way i see it it's acceptable the way it is now, by those who, enjoy a car the way it was built without modifications.
But, for those who, buy a car for the sole purpose of modifying it to bring it passed what it was originally designed to be, the laws should be changed to accept these people who perform large modifications.

That's my opinion.

 

I agree dave... Only probly is that its hard to go and tell a performance guy he can take his egr off cause he mods his car and then go tell a guy with a battle axe with carbon plugged egr he has to replace it. Same with cats and air pump... I just think they should set some general hot rod status rules across ontario and stick to em. Its pretty crapy that one guy cant get hot rod status with a 383 stroker and then another guy can get it for an intake and headers (well, not crap for him, but you get the point). I dont know what the hell they teach them in driveclean courses cause they dont seem to know much about the program itself, and the course is pretty big.
As for simple mods like bolt ons and stuff I think people should still have to pass like everyone else. Or else some guy with a poor running 300k km car could just go slap a used hundred dollar intake and some other cheap stuff and get away. For guys that rip into internals and go with aftermarket stuff, it gets to be a huge PITA when building a performance engine bottom up and still have emmissions in mind from what I understand. Thats just my whole take on it
greg

 

http://www.driveclean.com/

Check the site out. It lays it all out for you.

 

No Tracy, even DriveClean can't make up their minds. On their site they say Hotrod status will go to a vehicle that does not have an engine that original came or was offered in that year of vehicle. Then, they start telling the techs, that, now we're not gonna base that on cubic inches, but a block code. The block code is just a number. Do they know how many difference variations of engines that can be made with a 350 block. I just wish the gov't would use their heads for once before jumping the gun and passing a bill. They never research enough.

 

My neighbour is a mechanic at Canadian Tire and I was asking him about the e-test. He told me that they have "trained" apprentices and part-timers on how to test vehicles. You could tell them you have a 355 and actually have a 305. They would never be able to tell the difference. He also told me that most CT's are getting lax in there visual inspections. They look to see if the exhaust is leaking or not and then they run the test. If you fail, you will need to pay the waivers.I assume they will make money if you fail.

 

Yup but if you get a legitimate signed and whatever letter from a shop, attach receits from parts and labour and get them to say what vin, model, make, year (detailed) etc. you can take it to a dealer and try and get them to say your engine was not offered for that year... Then goto a DC technician or whoever you please and try for hotrod status. I know this method works because ARE does it with the LS-1s they re-sleeve and stroke and the owners can get hot rod. And it cant be because of a block style obviously cause theres only one LS-1 casting. Of course it only works on the pre-2000s but it can be done.
greg

 

I would think perhaps a recognized automobile appraiser might be able to do this as well. Getting an appraisal's a good idea anyway...why not kill two birds with one stone?

Getting back to my original topic here, anyone wanna stick their neck out to which one would be a better match for my present engine/tranny combo between the Edelbrock (model #1406) 600cfi and the Holley Street Avenger 570 cfi? I think I have it narrowed down to these two.

Also, anyone else run into RPO codes that don't exactly match up? I have codes that are printed on my option sheet that don't match up to anything in the Camaro White Book. I also have an IROC badge on the dash...which was explained by GM in the following manner: Because my car was built in July of 1984, they were getting ready to switch over to the 1985 model production and were running out of 1984 parts, so they used some 1985 parts to finish my particualr car. It sounds bizarre, but I can see it happening. Your thoughts???

 

Tracey, I would go with the Holley. Just personal choice I guess. They're easy to set up and have been around forever.


As for the other topic, again. When mine was tested, I asked the guy what gives hotrod status. He said," even if the orginal engine is bored, that cubic inch was never offered from the factory, regardless of what the numbers say". Then on the other hand, "there is no way for them to tell whether it has been bored out or not".
What I get from that is, a 355, 383 or whatever, was never a factory engine size. It should be under the R code, according to the government.
Proving it may be another story. Machine shop papers might do it.
So all in all, it does prove, that size does matter

 

I would go street avenger. Some pretty nifty carbs. As long as you get the right cfm you will see an increase in mileage and power with lots of flexibility. 570 would be great but are you ever planning on getting a 350? That would probly choke it somewhat... A 600 would be alright for a 305 and 350 if you thinking bout a swap someday. The appraiser idea sounds good too as long as they are willing to look at receits and whatnot and state that the engine is a different than stock CI. They could make a nice respectable looking letter probly which is what you would need to have a chance of getting hr status for a different displacement.
greg

 

I was considering the 600 cfm as well for that very reason. I just dont' wanna overdo it for my 305 either. They just don't make a 600 cfm Street Avenger. They go from 570 to 670...which would be too much.

Also, further to the whole appraiser thing, I get mine appraised each fall (It's cheaper if you do it annually plus, mine got broken into last December, so a lot of the equipment that was on the old appraisal will be different now). I go to a guy in Petersburg, Ontario (near Waterloo). He pulls literature prior to the appointment and then goes around the car with a digital camera taking photos. In the end, you get 2 copies of a booklet with numerous photos and comments about your car. It's pretty cool. You keep one and the other goes to your insurance company. I haven't changed the engine in my car, nor have I had it bored or otherwise modified, so I'm not looking at hot rod status myself. I'm done with emissions testing (unless they change the age sometime down the road and I have to start going through testing again). I just figured it might be one avenue for someone looking to get "status".

My car was appraised at $2000 higher than what I paid for it back in 1993...which was neat. It also gives me some peace of mind since I live in Kitchener where car theft is rampant to say the least. I'd hate like Hell for it to go, but if anything were to happen, at least I'd get the cash to start looking for another one.

 

Probably the MTO or whomever is responsible for upholding the Highway Traffic Leg. (I think, it doesn't matter to me really WHO they are, this guy was not lying to me about getting a fine ).

Re: Engine Mods...

I've modded a 305 before (in my old S-10) and had "good" results with the following:

2 pc style Holley 650 cfm square bore, dbl pump, mech. secondarys, mech. choke (awesome carb, excellent response, have the exact same one on my '82 GT right now)

Wieand stelth DP high rise, which is the same basic manifold as your RPM which I thought might have been a little big for a mild 305... but still worked well

Cam: 216 deg @.050" .460"(? can't remember for sure) lift 112 deg LSA single pattern - this was TOO SMALL!!! I would go with 220 @.050" and get as much lift as possible even maybe add 1.6 rockers, with 110 deg LSA (would be a little lumpy )

Heads: If memory serves 450 castings - stock

Compression: STOCK --- BAD.... engine probably had 8.5:1 should have had 9.5:1 would have made a big difference, compression needs to be higher when duration is lengthened, and/or LSA is tightened.

Engine ran mid 15's in 3600lb S-10 EXT Cab 3 spd auto street tires - engine was not rebuilt, mileage was unknown, parts were bolted on and thats it...

Changes I would have made:
Obviously, bigger cam, 9.5:1 compression (or even 10:1 with even tighter LSA) Headers of some sort 1.625" dia.

Right now, I have my '82 GT. It has a '87 roller 5.0L with 650 holley, torkerII, stock E7's (pure sh@t compared to even 305 heads) 1 5/8" shorties, 226@.050" roller cam 5 spd 3.55's - probably makes around 250-260 hp and runs 13.80's @102, the MPH indicates mid 13's with some slicks (have never run slicks) Just to compare... but my GT only weighs 2775 Lbs ...


How fast do you want to go?