jharms

I would like a fuel injected 350 to replace my tired 305 in my '86 Firechicken. Now Year one has a "Ram Jet 350 EFI" crate engine that makes 350 horsepower and 400 lb's torque. That's about what I want, but it's $4899. That includes the wirine harness, and engine-management computer. Is that a good deal, or would it be cheaper if I built one myself? Also, does anyone know whether this is a TPI engine or throttle body? I don't know. It's in the new Next Generation catalog for 3-gen. F-bodies on page 23 if anyone has that. Any advise would be appreciated!

firbird

http://www.paceparts.com/ram_jet_350_engine.htm
just like this one
it has a ramjet on it, it is designed kind of like the 4 gens fuel dilivery system.
it is always cheeper to build a engine of the same spec than buying a complete engine. for the same price you could build a much better one, not to mention that the ramjet is a 2 bolt

DualCarb

if you got a lot of Car knowledge build your own thats what I did, if you don't buy a crate.

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1986 Iroc z28
4bbl 350 V8 430 hp
300 shot NOS
6 spd Manual
20" Iroc replica Rims
2, 12" Alpine Subs
4.11 gear ratio
1/4 mile - 10.52s and 10.86s

90Iroc-Zee

build it yourself, if i had a good 10k to spend i would...

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1990 G92 5spd LB9 - 3.42 80,000 miles

Accel Ignition/Wires (8.8mm), Advanced Timing, TB Bypass, Ported and Gasket Matched Plenum, Synthetic Motor Oil, 160 Thermo, TPIS Airfoil, K&N Air Filters, Centerforce I Pressure Plate and Clutch, Edelbrock TES Headers, Dual Cats, Edelbrock RPM Series Catback, Homemade Ram Air, Bosch +4 Platinum Plugs

14.4 @ 94mph w/2.0622 60ft (w/o headers and catback)

14.426 @ 96.19mph w/2.167 60ft(w/headers and catback)

Also newly modded w/o track times:

Holley AFPR, Underdrive Pulleys, KYB Shocks and Struts, Crane Ignition

88IROCs

I'd agree that building it yourself will be cheaper, but you may want to consider why a crate costs more.

1. Someone who has engine building experience assembled it. That someone has to be paid by the hour for their work. That someone is not likely to miss an oil galley plug, or score a bearing during installation. Which brings us to the next point,...
2. Most crates come with some form of warranty. The company offering the warranty has to believe the engine-builder would build the engine to a repeatable level of quality.
3. A crate motor requires very little extra to get it to a running installation. Add fluids, spark and fuel and you're there. Building it yourself could take anywhere from several weeks to several months, depending on your finances, experience, commitment and the tools and equipment you have access to.

This isn't meant to scare you away from building the engine yourself. And I guarantee if you do build it yourself: nothing matches the pride you will feel the first time you start-up your masterpiece. But all things considered a crate or partial-crate is a much more practical way for the average Joe to get what they want.

I'd say $5000 is not a lot to pay for a "plug and play" motor. One thing though: try to get some dimensions, before you plunk down cash for the Ram-Jet. I'm not positive, but I believe this motor may be a bit tall for a stock hood(sounds like a good excuse to get a cowl-induction hood ).

[This message has been edited by 88IROCs (edited August 07, 2001).]

El Guapo

I second 88IROCs says. Building one isnt that hard. However, with crate engine you get several advantages.

1) Immediately, vs weeks.
2) Price. By the time you build an engine like you want, it will be way over the crate price
3) WARRANTY, WARRANTY, WARRANTY!

It is really easy to accidentally forget any of 100 different things on a build up. Especially if you dont do it for a living.

Well thats my opinion.

Clayton

jharms

Honestly I have ZERO experience in building engines. But some friends would help me who do have experience but it would take a while... Also, I already have a cowl hood. I planned a head as far as that is concerned. The problem with that is now my car looks fast, and it's not, so everyone keeps wanting to race me. And I keep losing... :^( The warranty is also a nice thing to consider. I just want to be able to beat these new Z28's we have running around my town that these parents bought for there kids.

RW91B4C

If your wanting to beat-up on new Z-28s, its going to take more then a 350hp crate engine, they are putting out atleast 350-375hp (I've seen as much as 310rwhp stock)to start with, and run high 12s on tires. That means you will need atleast a 400hp engine and run some mid 12s or some 110mph trap times to beat them - if they have no or very little mods. I say build your own engine, that way you get exactly what you want. Get some good heads(AFRs), port them, the right cam and intake, and you should make a good 400+hp, without paying for parts you dont need like in a crate motor

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91 B4C 305 TPI - SOON TO BE 383
TREMEC 5-SP, STOCK 1-BOLT REAREAND w/342 GEARS, K&N, AIRFOIL
EDELBROCK HEADERS, DUAL CAT TO HOMEMADE Y-PIPE & 3.5" SINGLE PIPE W/ FLOWMASTER, CRANK PULLEY, MSD, FUEL PRESS REG, COWL HOOD, WELD WHEELS
14.1@ 98MPH
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OTHER RIDE
67 CAMARO - STREET CAR, BIG BLOCK, PUMP GAS
350TH w/ATI 10", 12-BOLT w/373 GEARS
10.94@124.13 ON MOTOR - ET-STREETs w/MUFFLERS

85transamtpi

A new Z-28 is rated at 300hp (SS at 320hp) and close to 350 ft/lbs. The new Vette Z06 is only rated at 385hp. Ive NEVER heard of 310rwhp on a stock z-28, and they run 13's with the 6 speed. That crate motor should tear them up, depending on gear and trans. If you can get that power to the ground resonably you will like the results.
peace


[This message has been edited by 85transamtpi (edited August 07, 2001).]

RW91B4C

I'm saying some make 310rwhp. Most make 290 to 300. So lets take 300rwhp, that = 350 flywheel hp with a 15% drivetrain loss. That means LS1s are making atleast 350hp. And yes here in Houston there are a bunch of bone stock LS1s that are going 12.90s just with M/T ET streets. I've seen a few do it with only drag radials. Most of them are going 13.20s with the stock radial tires. My point is you will meed to run atleast high 12s to run with them. But more importantly they are pulling 107-108 mph stock, which is good enought mph to run mid 12s in a well set up car! My buddys '99 SS ran a 13.18@108 bone stock - no tires Its going to take atleast 375hp engine to pull that kind of mph. And you better hope they dont have much mods.

------------------
91 B4C 305 TPI - SOON TO BE 383
TREMEC 5-SP, STOCK 1-BOLT REAREAND w/342 GEARS, K&N, AIRFOIL
EDELBROCK HEADERS, DUAL CAT TO HOMEMADE Y-PIPE & 3.5" SINGLE PIPE W/ FLOWMASTER, CRANK PULLEY, MSD, FUEL PRESS REG, COWL HOOD, WELD WHEELS
14.1@ 98MPH
-------------
OTHER RIDE
67 CAMARO - STREET CAR, BIG BLOCK, PUMP GAS
350TH w/ATI 10", 12-BOLT w/373 GEARS
10.94@124.13 ON MOTOR - ET-STREETs w/MUFFLERS

PETE

iTrader: (1)

you cant beat a zz partial engien it gives you a forged crank lt4pm rods hyper pistons 10to1 with 58cc heads 4bolt mains with windage tray.that way you know quality people assembled it you get what you need and still get to choose your cam and head combo.IMO it's the best option if gm can wring 345hp with those stock l98 heads afr's or a set of fastburns and an lt4 hot cam will get you 435hp keep in mind if you go tpi you can't use the fastburn heads unless you get the miniram3 ever think of a zz4 and a procharger(450hp possible) those ls1's won't have a chance.good luck

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87 trans am,gm crate 350(4 bolt mains 10to1),L98 aluminum heads,LT4 hot cam,slp runners,slp 1 5/8 headers,3in.y-pipe,edelbrock base,hi flo cat,air foil,afpr,as&m ported plenum,gutted airbox,t-5 tranny w/centerforce clutch and a 3.27 9bolt(11.9in. brakes),ed wright's fastchip,relocated iat sensor,160 fan switch&t-stat,tb bypass,accel supercoil,cap& rotor,hollowed maf,slp 3in. catbcak.

FOR SALE!FOR SALE!FOR SALE!FOR SALE!FOR SALE!

EVRYTHING IS FOR SALE WITH MY CAR (EXTRA ENGINE,TPI INTAKES,RUNNNERS,PLENUMS,ECM W/CHIP,new springs,aluminum driveshaft.

GETTING OUT OF THE 3RD GEN MARKET BEST OFFERS
CONSIDERED!!!!!!!!!!!
anyonne from new jersey interested??????

DualCarb

I agree with 'RW91B4C' I built my own and got 430 hp, and it did not cost much.

------------------
1986 Iroc z28
4bbl 350 V8 430 hp
300 shot NOS
6 spd Manual
20" Iroc replica Rims
2, 12" Alpine Subs
4.11 gear ratio
1/4 mile - 10.52s and 10.86s

Drkhrse89

iTrader: (1)

I am going to buy a crate engine since I dont have the space to build one myself. I am looking at getting the Ram Jet 350 but I am trying to figure out what I am going to have to do to get that pre 73 block up to a T-56. I am not competely literate when it comes to cars and I am trying to learn so I am planing ahead with a parts list. That thing is depressing though. $7,000 and growing everyday not to mention all of the money I already have in the car. Oh yea from what I have read there will be no clearence problems with the Ram Jet but it would be a good idea to be safe.

------------------

"I'm not dumb, I just have an amazing command of thoroughly useless
information."
Bill Waterson creator of Calvin & Hobbes.

86 IROC

iTrader: (3)

I had a motor built, actuallt two for my car. If I ever had to do it again, I'd buy a crate motor. If I had all of the nesecary tools I'd more than likely do it myself. But, for the most part - it's hard to beat a crate motor for the value. Both of the motors that I had built for my car were assembled by so called "professionals", the 355 I had built self-destructed after only 400 miles. I had to go to court to get copmensated. That was a lenghty PITA of an ordeal. My 383 was improperly assembled the first time. Luckily, I watched other's motors blow up and tore mine down before I ever ran it. I found numerous mistakes in it. I ended up taking a job part-time at a race car shop so that I could redo my 383 myself. I feel that it is completely sound now. I shouldn't ahve any problems with it, but it was an expensive nightmare.

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"I know why you want to hate me, cause hate is all the world can seem to see lately....." L.B.

Pat Hall

iTrader: (31)

Personally, I prefer building my own like I'm doing right now, but like the other guys said, this might not be a good idea if you're not knowledgeable enough. I will tell you one thing though. That next generation catalog is the last place I would buy a crate motor. They oughta be jailed for piracy with their prices! Christ, they want 3 times as much as any local parts store for a lousy brake rotor! If you're considering a crate motor, check with Scoggin-Dickey Chevrolet in TX, or Pace Parts. They're both authorized GMPP dealers, and they both have online websites. I wouldn't give next generation a plugged nickel for their overinflated prices!

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89RS w/350 TPI; 69RS/SS w/450 HP 350/Muncie 4-Speed "Too weird to live, too rare to die."

bergman86z28

ok guys don't mean to jack here but i need help. I have a 355 cast crank rods 882 heads not much more than stock. What i want to know is whats the best way to get about 400 hp reliable power out of this with out braking the budget. I am considering a scat 383 crank with a decent set of h beams and flat top pistons. As far as heads dart iron eagle with a good matching cam. I want to stay at about 10:1 and run pump gas also need a good intake will be running carb. Will this get me to my goal? my uncles chevelle is 383 13:1 race gas and he is over 600 but their is alot more money in it than i Want to spend. Any info would be awsome!

Kennerz

Did you see the date on this thread? Major blast from the past. THings have changed over the past decade plus. Now the newer pony cars have 375 at the wheels..and more. To answer you question, you want 400 flywheel or rear wheel HP? getting the additional 60~75 HP out of these motors takes a lot of work.

Not sure if those heads will make the power your expecting, you will need full exhaust to get where you want to go. With a carb you have a lot better chance of making good power than us TPI, FI guys. There is no simple answer. On a budget a 383, with vortec heads and a properly matched cam with all the bolt ons will get you there. If you don't run smog, really you can do whatever you want. But take into consideration what you have (trans, gearing, etc.) and where you want your car to be. There is no magic HP number, you will get used to whatever level you build it to.

whtltng89

You can get a Ramjet 350 from any chevy dlr for about the same price. The last 350 I built I had over 6k in it and two years later it blew both head gaskets with just normal driving.

Kennerz

The GM crate stuff as far as I know, is pretty much OEM quality. I have seen many experienced hobby engine builders have engines that just did not live very long. I talking about guys who have considerable knowledge and experience who know what they are doing.

Either they don't perform like they expect (happens a lot) or they don't last. likewise there are some who build great stuff. Depends on how smart you are, your attention to detail, overall mechanical skills, access to the right tools and cashflow. wether you build it or buy it. AND you can end up spending just as much doing it yourself. Also if it blows and you do it twice you didn't save a thing.

I bought a crate long block, after a bad experience with a custom engine builder, got burnt. The custom engine was nothing but problems, non stop, and the builder didn't fess up that the crank was machined wrong and the bad tolerance caused an oiling issue (oil presure bleed at high rpm)and the motor eventually had a bad rod knock, didn't get 9months out of it and it showed promise but never ran all the way right. due to a combination of expert assembly and bad outsourced machining, and not knowing what tolerences a stout hydraulic roller motor should be by my "expert biulder" cutting corners..

Did a crate long block, 9 yrs and 10K mi later, it rips. just my story.

To do it again, I would buy a performance crate short block and top it with the heads/valve train I wan't. and find the best local guy I could to degree the cam and set the vave spring hieghts/shim, etc. then do all the rest myself, then find the best tuner available.

Fred SS

iTrader: (3)

I agree with Kennerz, buy a performance crate short block and build the rest yourself. A gm mechanic told me the same thing a few years ago. I wish I had listened to him.