wildjyoung

iTrader: (6)

Okay, I think I am going to be sick. I completely installed my torque converter/transmission improperly. I mounted the torque converter to the fly wheel and then wiggled and jiggled the transmission around until it would would get on the pins and until I could get bolts in. I then proceeded to bolt the bellhousing to the engine and pull it the rest of the way onto the engine. While tightening up the bolts, I heard 2 pops, which I thought we just the splines popping into place. However, after researching the correct installation, I know think it could be worse.

1. What is my worst case scenario? What damage could I have caused.
2. What can I do to check and see if everything is fine?
3. What may I have to replace to get this thing running?

Thanks in advance for your help!

Josh

chevymec

iTrader: (5)

Pull the tranny back out. Replace the front pump and have the T/C checked for damage. Always install the T/C in the tranny first and listen for 3 bumps when slidding the T/C in.

wildjyoung

iTrader: (6)

Sounds like I royally screwed it up. How would the pump be damaged?

Thanks for the help!

customblackbird

iTrader: (15)

the part that the tq converter slides into on the tranny is the INPUT shaft and stator. the input shaft has a Oring on the end with checkball for locking converters. you rip that oring and your converter wont lock up. the stator is wat the converter rides on and fixes the one side of the converter so its still. the input shaft is wat spins the pump and attaches the clutches and everything else to make the trans work. the stator is only bolted down to the front pump with 3 small torx bit bolts... the are by no means strong. you could have easily broken them and destroyed the pump etc. i dont just mean the pump and veins i mean the actual soft aluminum body (the entire front part that u see bolted inside the bell housing. (they can be expensive unless u find a cheap parts guy or buy another cheap trans for parts.

you could have messed up the converter as well. but you def caused some carnage. you could have quite a bill on ur hands. sry man. best bet is to take it apart and look for stuff u broke. but ull have to send the converter out to be checked.

wildjyoung

iTrader: (6)

I guess the only thing to do is to pull it back out and check. I will provide an update tomorrow. Is there any chance i may get lucky and things will be fine? Do I just need to send the TC to the tranny shop to get checked and then look at the stator and input shaft for damage? If the stator and input shaft look fine am I okay to install the TC and put on the engine?

Thanks Again!

Zwrench

If you didn't run the engine the TC should be O.K. But, I have to agree with the others, your front pump is probably damaged.

Sorry man. Been there, done that.

wildjyoung

iTrader: (6)

Yeah, I pretty much feel like a retard! I spent so much time making sure I did everything exactly correct on the engine and made a stupid mistake like this one. Oh well, at least I caught it before I fired the engine for the first time.

Thank you for all of your help. Wish me luck tomorrow!

Josh

wildjyoung

iTrader: (6)

Well, I pulled the tranny today. The splines look fine as well as the converter. However, the tabs behind the seal are both broken. Obviously, the converter was not connected to the pump correctly and the pressure of bolting the bellhousing broke the pump tabs. It really sucks and I feel like a retard.


1) Anyway, where is the best place to buy a new pump?
2) Is the pump something that can be replaced with basic mechanical skills?
3) How freely should the converter spin with it is mounted to the transmission?


Everyone makes the automatic transmission out to be like something engineered alongside a nuclear reactor. So, I just want to see if I should have a shop replace the pump or attempt it myself.

Thanks for your help!

customblackbird

iTrader: (15)

i did mine bc i had to replace my stator (put it back together and it was worn, didnt notice till after) it only took me about 2hrs maybe.

depends on the tools u have and if you have a manual etc. your biggest issue is gona be aligning the pump. they sell an align tool... basically its a huge cooling hose clamp lol but the backyard way is to put it reverse back into the trans and use the trans to align it. This is explained in the transmission rebuild manuals. i got a haynes and a ASTG(or something like that) each one has things the other one doesnt. I also never rebuilt a trans before mine and it works good for 8miles on it

you will need a tq wrench, and basic tools. like i said getting the pump out and aligned is the biggest issue. if your going with the route of putting the pump in backwards to align it in the trans, u will have to remove the entire center section and the 2-4 band. this will be annoying and time consuming since you will have to put this back in and get everything seated again. simplest thing to do is get the new parts and GET THE PUMP ALIGNMENT TOOL... cant be that much money and its well worth it bc of the hassle. and you can do it yourself with the trans manual in prob a day.

get the pump parts from someone you trust. you want a 10vein pump (complete with new tabs etc) and depending on the power of the car... u might want to upgrade the boost valves,springs, and get hardened pump rings etc. i would DEF do the boost valves, they will increase line pressure for better shifts. (u want mega valve and low reverse boost valve) and do the corvette servo. trans will feel much better.

i got my 10vein from dana at probuilt, with transgo shift kit etc.

https://www.700r4l60e.com/store/prod...&cat=52&page=1
and ask him for a complete 10vein pump etc and he will hook u up. hes the man around here and knows his stuff

customblackbird

iTrader: (15)

the tq conveter will turn but not too easily. the trans will be hard to turn by hand if u put it together correctly. but the converter will make it turn easier since your turning it with more leverage

Zwrench

Don't be so hard on yourself! Stuff happens!

I can't tell you where to get a new front pump but, when you find one you will be able to replace it yourself. Just 11-12 bolts to pull out and a couple of bolts to screw back in ( to 'press' the pump out). Just keep everything clean and you'll do fine.

wildjyoung

iTrader: (6)

Thanks everyone!

I have been trying to get in touch with Dana but have been unable to thus far to order the new pump. Hopefully I can get one in this week and get it done!

I am going to be breaking in a new engine and tranny at the same time. This should be fun and nerve racking!

antoine

http://www.makcotransmissionparts.co...700R4pump.html

wildjyoung

iTrader: (6)

Thank you very much for the help! Is one kit preferable over another for a mostly street but some strip car with around 400 HP?

wildjyoung

iTrader: (6)

Just out of curiosity, which part did I break using the attached illustration?

antoine

on the picture number 103 the pump rotor

wildjyoung

iTrader: (6)

Transmission is fixed! I took it to a local transmission shop and the guy rebuilt the pump and all seals. He let me watch him do it, so I got to learn quite a bit. He did everything for $100. Now its time to install in the car and get this thing going. I hope to start and drive it for the first time on Sunday.

Anyhow, thanks to everyone for your help!!!

Josh

Project 3.4 Camaro

Lol, your name is same as mine and we both did same thing, must be some kinda funky curse or somthing, anyway can one of you chime in here-can I should be able to just replace the vanes/rotor right?

customblackbird

iTrader: (15)

more than likely u might have ruined the stator and that will have to be replaced. and perhaps u snapped the 3 small bolts that hold the stator to the pump. no way to tell until u pull it apart

Valencia1

I put new seals on the pump because it was leaking and now it hard to turn is this normal or did i do something wrong?? I also didnt put it in all the way and tried to install back to the motor and it wont turn so i dropped it back down and it hard to turn ... Did i damage the pump or is this normal??!!??!!?

IROCZ1989

iTrader: (1)

Fully seat the convertor. Hey yif your screwed up no big deal. Good thing you caught it before you started it. Now when you get it back together make sure when and before you bolt the convertor to the flexplate you check the clearance. Anymore than 1/4 you will need spacers. Its not uncommon. But just don't pull the convertor to the flexplate face and call it a day. The clearance has to be right or you will be pulling everything out again real soon.

customblackbird

iTrader: (15)

Pump needs to be fully seated in the trans before trying to install. 3 clicks.

Some times if you dont have it in all the way you try to bolt the trans up to the motor and you hear a pop... thats the converter busting out the back of the stator in the pump. NOT GOOD! basically need to rebuild the pump. Not sure if thats what you had going on or not. Coverter should spin freely when installed fully in the trans... like butter. Make sure you put trans lube in the converter before as well as all over the hub that slips into the pump (inside and outside) so it glides into the pump and is pre lubricated and helps on first startup.

Now you need to pull it all out again and pull the pump, verify nothing is broken/seals are good as well as the bearings/converter hub.

It happens all the time which is why I always install the converter fully into the trans so I know its 3 clicks in. Then verify the depth the converter mounting flange is in comparison to the bellhousing mounting surface. This is somthing like 1 5/8" or something (google it). Once I hear 3 clicks I measure the distance to verify. Sometimes I pull the converter and do it again just to be sure.

Distance from the converter to the flexplate should be around 1/8" pull out. 1/4" is wayy to high. Once you get it all mounted you measure the distance between the converter mounting and the flexplate should be 1/8"-3/16". If its more then you need to add equal height spacers to get about 1/8" pullout before they meet. Less than 1/8" can cause binding/damage when stuff starts to flex or the converter balloons. Any more than 1/8" to 3/16" can cause pump issues as the hub might not be fully engaged as it all depends on how much its pulled out. If you have a high end converter like a billet one (which I have) you can have much less clearance (i think i was around .060-.090") which is fine as the billet one is so strong it won't balloon. Thus any movement will be from the flexplate.

Hope you figure it out.

Valencia1

So its normal if its hard to turn?? Cuz i didnt start it up or anything... Im just concerned that its hard to turn???

customblackbird

iTrader: (15)

Please see my comment above. No its not suppose to to be hard to turn. Make sure your trans is in Neutral.

IROCZ1989

iTrader: (1)

Good catch I miss spoke on the clearance. You can check the clearance by sticking drill bits in between the plate and convertor. 1/4 is too much.

Valencia1

So it should smoothen out when in neurtal?

Valencia1

Okay so smooth like butter when in netural if not pump its messed up

IROCZ1989

iTrader: (1)

When convertor is fully seated put a straight edge across trans bell housing and measure. GM 700R4, 4L60E, 200-4R = 1.125” from bellhousing to converter pads. Then you know its fully seated