Skantow

Hay this is my first post in here, so hello. I've been off and on here for about a week now reading the posts. I just got my first Camaro. It's a '91 RS w/ 3.1L and a 700R4 tranny. It has been sitting for just over a year (because of that the price was excellent). I've done the normal ... oil change/flush, coolent change/flush, and tranny was ok. She runs really good and strong. I've put just over 250 miles on her now, babied her at first and just recently got her up to 90 mph ... like I said she runs good and strong so no problems there.

The Problem ... I do however have one problem I can not identify easily. She has cut out on me 4x now. I've noticed it happens usually after a lot of stop and go traffic and only as I slow down and am turning. The little quirks it has right now.... Speedomoter is sticking (works most times), Tech doesn't work, have an indicator light (INFL REST) don't know what it means, NO service engine light comes on, idles a little rough (loops from high revs to low), and an odd oder coming from under the car but not at the tail pipes. My guess is this is an MAF (had one go bad in my '86 Impulse) or Cat problem, but I'm unsure. I'm going to change the O2 sensor today to see if there are any changes (probably needs doing anyway), but if any one can give me a suggestion or knows what the problem is that would be great.

It does have a cat back exhaust, so far as any other mods I don't know.

Thankx in advance for any help.
S.K.

MDv6man

Welcome to the boards...

Your car is a 1991. It will be equipped with a 3.1 v6 and does not have a MAF sensor. From 1990-1992, GM used speed density systems to monitor air flow.

First thing that should be done with any newly purchased used car is a major tuneup. Search the V6 forum for "major tuneup" by "TomP". This will take care of any maintenance that may have been neglected by the previous owner.

Skantow

Found it ... seems like pretty basic stuff. I haven't done the plugs, wires, and cap yet ... won't be able to get to that till next week. But, it'll be in the works (every once in awhile things slip the mind .. should have known to do that).

Anyone have an idea what this indicator light is?

INFL REST

MDv6man

That light is for the air bag. There may be a problem with the circuit or airbag system.

Skantow

Cool ... I know why its on now then (and whats causing it). Thanks ... oh, and thanks for letting me know it doesn't have a MAF. I was sure it did and those things are costly (my Impulse's was $600). One less thing to worry about both now and in the future.

S.K.

RBob

iTrader: (1)

Also do the idle learn procedure (search this board). Your stalling and 'looping' idle problems are an exact symptom of a non-learned idle. Which is going to occur after the battery went dead and the car needed a jump. . .

RBob.

Nixon1

If the idle learn doesn't work... (Mine had issues similar to yours and I had a 91 and never had to do an idle learn...)

Check your fuel filter and your IAC valve. A clogged fuel filter will cause stalls during decelerations and turns and such. A sticking IAC valve will cause stalls primary on decelerations. Fuel filter can be replaced without TOO much trouble I believe..and the IAC valve can be easily cleaned with carb cleaner.

Even if it isn't the problem, a cleaned IAC valve will help the car to idle smoother and generally 'feel better'. Just undo the connector, remove the two Torx screws, and slide it out. It's the little connection and piece on the passenger side of the throttle body..the connector faces down. Clean the assembly with carb cleaner, as well as the passages it sits in. Be careful to remove ALL of the carb cleaner from the parts before re-installing them....as you probably know, carb cleaner is bad news for EFI.

89cmrodriver

how do u do the idle learn?

Skantow

Thanks for the help guys. I did the Learn Idiol Procedure, cleaned out the TB with some cleaner (TB cleaner that is), however did not remove the IAC and clean it, or replace the O2 sensor (after careful consideration I figured if it needed replacing I'd get a check engine light). She seemed to idiol pretty good, I'll know more when I take her "out on the town" so to speak. I did figure out the odd smell though ... I have a small oil leak at the rear of the passanger valve cover (nothing major there, just to replace it). I'll keep ya posted ......... thanx again.

PS: you can find the Learn Idiol Procedure by doing a search on this message board (its at the bottom on the right when you go back a page).

S.K.

MDv6man

Not necessarily....

Sometimes the sensors (especially the O2) get gunked up. that gunk confuses the sensor. the sensor sends the wrong info to the computer and the car runs like ***.

Many times the sensor is gunked up and needs to be replaced but no check engine light shows up.

Dale

iTrader: (12)

I have a 91 also, it sat for about 9 months before I got it. Mine started cutting out and it was either the coil, or the ICM. It only did it when the engine was hot also. Also, my tach started acting up at the same time. I replaced both parts and the tach started working properly.

Your speedo is electronicaly driven. So either the VSS in the tranny is going out, or the cluster itself is going bad. That could also be why the tach is not working.

Skantow

Well, she's running smoothly, no rough idiol and not a hint of cutting out on me. I thought this had a speedo cable, hum. Either way it's in the schedule to be replaced. I don't think the O2 is a problem right now, nor anything else other than the speedo and tach (the rest of the cluster is working good). The tach I'm not worried about unless it also effects the running of the car like the speedo does.

S.K.

Nixon1

MD's very right, the O2 sensors FREQUENTLY fail or act up and don't throw a check engine light BECAUSE they values they throw when they goof up are still valid readings... A bad O2 sensor will almost always make the car run rich rather than lean. I had no check engine lights, my idle was fairly normal..everything seemed fine...and then I replaced the O2 sensor and it idled smoother, accelerated better, and gained around 4 miles per gallon. I was surprised...

89cmrodriver

skantow what part of VA are u in?

Skantow

P-Town (Portsmouth) ... just around the corner from ya near "The New" Victory Crossing (formerly Tower Mall).

I don't doubt that MD has a valid point about the O2 sensor, but I don't think it is a problem right now with my car. She's running great (I mean really great) since cleaning out the TB and doing the Idol learn thing. As time goes on I'll be doing other things and the O2 will be part of it all. It'll get done soon (after all I already have the thing). I'm pretty good with maintenance stuff and usually more on top of it than most people I know. Thanks for the concern and info, it's been greatly appreciated and helpful.

You guys are great and I'll definitely be around more and help out with anything I can.

S.K.

89' RS/blue

Skantow, how many miles does your car have on it. Because a bunch of books say the O2 sensor should be replaced every 30,000 miles, and i'm guessing its overdue. You say you've already got it so just do it. It is simple as can be, its on the right side exhaust manifold underneath the passenger door. If you do it now you'll be glad later.

Skantow

Just over 165,000. Previous owner was an ASE Master Tech. He took very good care of it and from what I understand (if I did correctly) pumped in about $2700 into her. I know it has a cat back but don't know about anything else ... all I really know at this point is it seems to run much stronger than any V6 I've ever been in, even with this cars extreme weight. My dads torqy '95 S-10 (V6, 5-speed) held that position before coming across this car (he could squeal the tires in almost any gear). I'm going to do the O2, calm down people, lol.


Here, a list of things needed and wanted........
(will be done within the month, give or take a couple of weeks)

O2 sensor (see, it's first)
Rear shocks
Speedo sensor
Valve cover gaskets
(next are in no particular order)
Both front ball joints (they are starting to go but still ok)
Front brake lines (same as the B-joints)
Brass rotor button & cap
8mm wires
higher volt coil
Better plugs (Splitfire/Rapidfire/Platinum ??? don-no yet)
Pull Intake and see if any obstructions can be gotten rid of (spurs and burrs sort of thing, plus a thorough cleaning).

And I'm going to try fabbing up the Ram-Air system Nixon1 had on here, (the second of his drawings). I figure it can be done by bringing it down in front of the radiator ... actually, hum, come to think of it, the most direct route and shortest route is best. Given that fact maybe just removing all that plastic right in front will open up a usable hole and won't block the radiator, just have to check it. I prefabbed one in my Impulse that worked very well and never had ANY problems with but should have used PVC to make it cold air. Only thing is, and I haven't heard anyone mention this, if you are trying to switch over to a Ram-Air you need to check all of your seals and vacuum hoses really good. If done right the system will cause there to be extra pressure, if you have a leak starting this will make that "almost a leak" a real one. OEM hoses should still be strong enough though. So those will have to be checked and done first. Anyhow, this will be after all the other stuff so it's down the road and gives me more time to check out materials and lay-out.

There whole case (man I hope I didn't open up any can of worms this time, )

S.K.

Nixon1

PLEASE send photos if you do it! I want to see if that system will work good! That's been my theoretical "dream ram air" system for some time now, but I never had the resources to construct it. The idea was to use as smooth bends as possible, and bring the tube from the throttle body straight down...3 inches will suffice, but I had also thought about putting a 3 in. to 4 in. pipe adapter on the throttle body and running the larger diameter intake pipe. The tricky part is filter placement. My idea was to somehow smoothly convert the pipe piece into a box to house a screen-style air filter, sitting horizontally, as the intake extends back into a tube a little bit further down, then does the turn...so the ram air, seeing as it's so low to the ground and the inlet will be large, its placement will keep it from picking up large large amounts of rain and water vapor. Then rob an air dam off of a junkyard Camaro and cut a slot out of it, and attach a sheet metal box into that that fits in with the piping...

I figured I'd give you all the details on my plan since the drawing might be a little lacking.

Sounds like a good list to me.
Suggestions:

*Brass cap and rotor: Discount Auto Parts, Blue Streak set....it's
$20 and it's all brass and better quality plastic, works great

*Coil: Hypertech (this seems to be the general consensus from what I've heard, although Karl (KED) would gloriously defend his Accel coil to the death

*Plugs: Rapidfires. Splitfires are a waste of cash, and half of the people here running Platinums have had problems..the other half said none. Mine began to foul out within a week's time. Idle got persistently rougher. If you DO go with platinums, don't waste your money on the +2's or +4's. Doesn't help.

*8mm wires: Recommendations here are all across the board..depends on how much you're looking to spend. I picked up a set of brand new Taylor 8mm SpiroPro wires for only about $60 from the local speed shop, so they can probably be had for the same price or slightly cheaper at Summit.

Good luck with the car! When properly running these things can be beasts huh? My camaro always had a rough idle and didn't run the best, but when I got on that pedal...well, let's just say I got frequently asked 'damn, that tiny little engine did THAT?'

Mathius

Sorry, this is a mispost.

Mathius