Note: thread name should be NEWBIE QUESTIONS. typo

Hello Everyone. looking forward to being a frequent poster here. possibly buying a white 86` f-body. 3.8L v6 5 speed t top. for 2, 500$ it has 110k mile original, plus 10k more on a new engine. i am told there is no major body work needed ( will see on sat).

Baisically i am looking for experinced people (all of you) to tell me what problems to look for, why not to buy ect... please help me... i am so lost and afraid.....

 

First off find out why it has been changed from a stock '86 2.8 60* V6 motor to a 90* V6 3.8 motor and transmisson out of what kind of vehicle.

There was a limited and highly valueable Turbo T/A in '89 that had a 3.8- but they are rare and sell for about $12,000-20,000 based on condition.

You may have misprinted the 3.8 instead of 2.8. If so then disregard my post.

Dean

 

i'm sorry. typo/ fup. it is a 2.8L v6. stock engine, just a new one. sorry to sound like an idiot. i don't know a whole lot about firebirds. i just know that i have rarely seen a better looking car then a third gen fbody. oh-yeah....

 

No you don't sound like an idiot- just an innocent typo like you stated- Remember that everyone here at one point in there lives didn't know a thing about cars either- we have all learn from something or someone else to get what knowledge we have- I learn things daily.

Anyways, 2.8's are not rocketships and never will be- but they are fun reliable cars that are cheap on gas and insurance. Just make sure that the car idles at or below 900 rpm's smoothly and all of your sensors/computer stuff and emissions equipment is in tach and working fine. If the idle is turned up then there could be a problem with something and the are trying to smooth things out and disguise a potential problem.

Where abouts in Oregon- I once lived in Lake Osewgo (8miles south of Portland) back in '81-'82. Other than that I was born and raised in So. Calif.

 

Beaverton Oregon, Murry scholls area, sw beaverton. car is in lebbinon, about 1.5 hours away.

"fun reliable cars that are cheap on gas and insurance."
thats exactley what i was looking for. i love the way they look, but i don't want to pay for a supertuner, dragstrip ready, requires full time mechanic, race car. if i wanted a car that i needed to be a mechanic to own i would buy a ford. ::: crowd goes wild :::

thankyou for the advice on the idle thing. my cherokee has an idle problem, will take a 200 dollar part to fix. ( idle/throtle sensor motor) thing is the size of my thumb.

 

Just a FYI -

I paid $1400 cash for my 5 speed 2.8 '88 Camaro, with 84k miles on it.

Granted, the engine was NOT a fresh rebuild, and did need a tune up, but I'd think $2k (IF THEY CAN PROVE THE ENGINE IS FRESH - ASK FOR RECEIPTS OF MACHINE WORK!) would be fair, IF the interior were in good condition.

My only beef with my car, was the clutch going out, needing a tune up (I'd recommend one anyway, since you have no idea when that was changed on the car before) and the interior needed cleaning. I'd have my all redone interior in my car now, if that punk Proximo on these boards hadn't stolen my interior, and now forcing me to sue his sorry rear.

Just look it over with a fine toothed comb.

DO NOT LET THEM WARM UP THE CAR FIRST. When you crank it for the first time, prime the fuel pump (put in run - one before start - you should hear the pump whirr, then stop) then crank it. It should fire almost immediately.

Don't touch anything, and see if she idles smoothly - no rpms going up and down a bunch.

Then take it for a spin! If you like how it runs (smoothly, no backfires, no sputtering) then pick it up. If they want $2500 for it, offer $1800 in cash. No dice, then 'borrow' another $200 from your buddy (that you'll take with you).

$2k in hand is HARD to pass up.

Spend the other $500 on a Dynomax catback, and TomP's Major TuneUp. Then wash/wax the car, and enjoy!

one more thing - for $2k, there better not be a damn ding on that car!

 

thankyou for your advice. especially the price advie (rhyme). i will definately take my friend (dad, he knows cars) with me. i will follow you startup advice to the tee. thankyou again.

 

Not a problem. If you start teh car, and the check engine light comes on come back and let us know! We'll tell you how to find out what is setting the code

 

geez, already in the fourhours i have been a member of this forum i have had way more feedback then to other forums combined from two days. thankyou again for the help. i am sticking around this place, you guys are an invaluble resource.



by the way, if annybody ever has questions about a jeep charokee, i am there man. my current vehickle is an 88` jeep charokee with a 4.0L inline six. man, it's the best one around. i don't mean to get off the f-body topic, but dang. as much as i hate idriving a big combersome SUV, i love it. but, it must go. on to bigger and better things.

on a seperate issue, if i do get this 86` f- body. does anyone know where i could get a cowl induction hood. my v6 won't have cowl induction, but it just looks so sweet.

by the way, what is cowl induction? (this is why i called the thread newbie questions) and what does it do? iassume it is a type of intake?

also, popups, i genneraly am not a fan of pop up headlights. is there a kit to make them inset style fixed headlights? ifso how much.

more questions to come as i think of them, even more if i actually get the car. ( everyboy cross your fingers that it actually runs.)

 

Since you're asking about pop-ups, I'm guessing it's a 'bird in question?

I don't know about kits... you need info on the 1st and 2nd gen birds (REAL pontiacs. Not Ponchos with Chevy engines ) then I'm the guy to talk to!

Cowl induction is generally the term used when you have a raised hood, next to your cowl - the part of the hood that's RIGHT in front of the windshield. As you are moving, air flow creates a high pressure area, and helps shove air into the engine.

On our fuel injected engines, tho, it's more looks than anything. Kind of hard to pull air from the back of the motor, instead of the front! Cowl induction is big with teh carb guys.

 

Xopher, welcome to the forum! Do a <a href="search.php?s="><img src="images/top_search.gif" alt="Search" border="0"></a> in the Body And Interior forum for the headlights; some guys have made their own kits. In my opinion though, every kit looks like crap- but I'm one of those guys that loves my flip-up headlights. 82-86 motors are a bit more durable then the 87-92 versions, although, rebuild kits are available for the 87-92 actuators. (82-86 used 3 wire motors aka actuators, 87-92 used 2-wire systems)

Besides the basics (no coolant in the oil, blue smoke not pouring out of the exhaust, etc), there's really not much to watch out for.

If you want a sneaky way to save some cash, look at the outer corners (near the outer sidewall) of the front tires. They'll probably be chewed up; it happens because of the design of the suspension of the camaros/firebirds. BUT, your seller probably won't know this. It's a good "Oh and look, I need an alignment and new front tires, that's about $200 right there" excuse.

 

i allready knew about that stuff, but that is a somthing EVERYONE should know, so thankyou.

sounds a bit underhanded, not my style. i am a firm believer that what goes around comes around. you pull that on somebody, next thing you know your new paintjob gets keyed.

Sidenote: i would like to rant about people keying cars, as not to be off subject i will do it under the apperence and detailing catagory.

 

Does annyone know the frame designation/code for a 3rd gen, i assume cameros and fire birds have same frame?

 

if there is not alot of miles on the motor and transsmission than most of any problems you will have will be minor stupied crap...good luck

ps..what dose your user name stand for?

 

i used to play online games. my handle was always Xopher. don't know where it came from. i must hav ripped it off from somwhere. no clue where. and tony is my first name. so that last part was natural.

 

What does a frame designation/code look like? I assume you don't mean f-body... And yes, they do have the same frame.

 

for example a first generation nissan 240 sx is an s13
the second gen of nissan 240sx is also an s13 becouse they use the same frame. the same with a nissan silvia. an s13 frame


s13 being the frame code.

 

UPDATE:: my proposed 86` firebird v6 has the original transmission and original cluch. the guy "thinks he might" know where the recipts for the new engine are. sounds kinda hokey. he says there are no visable scratches (car is white) and a few minor door dings. interior color is grey and black. he is asking $2,750 for it.

 

Check it out. Sit in it, take it for a spin. If he can't find the receipts, then just be honest - "Man, I got no proof this thing won't die on me a little while down the road. Which machine shop rebuilt it?" and go from there.

If he gives you the whole he did it himself, ask what parts he replaced, and report back here.

$2k for that with a fresh engine wouldn't be bad. Cherry exterior, and good interior, I could see $2300-2400.

Same body/interior, on an original engine/tranny, I'd not go a dime over $2k.

Like I said tho, if you got that $2k cash in hand when it comes down to the wire - Money talks, BS walks.

Oh, ask if the clutch is still original - if he says he replaced it, ask him how many splines it was! Should be 14.

 

It's an F-Body, 3rd generation. that's the 'frame code'

67-69 Fbody, 1st gen
70-81 Fbody 2nd gen
82-92 Fbody 3rd gen
93+ Fbody 4th gen

Now with stangs, the like... 79-93 is a FOX body, and 94+ is SN95

 

oohhhhh..... cool

 

the clutch is original and tranny are original. and the car was a project car of his friends, the engine is not rebuilt, it is supposedly all new engine.

 

I can not think of a SINGLE person or reason for a NEW engine, and NOT replace the clutch while you're at it.

I'd demand receipts. No receipts? I got $1800 right here, or I walk.

Provided the rest is good, of course

 

yea, no joke.

below is a backround i made of my current car, an 88 jeep charokee. i just posted this to see if it would work(never posted a pic before)<center></center>


i plan to do a similar work with my firebird, if i do indeed purchase it. also, what size are all those signature pics everyone has?

 

600 by 125. i saved one and looked, duh

 

lol, nice... Maybe I should get you to make one of mine... AFTER the turbo is done, tho!

 

i would be happy to. i love little projects like that.

 

Ok folks, its Friday and I see the car on Sunday. Crunch time. Here is the list of everything i am looking for. Please tell me if I have missed anything:

1) Look for body and frame rust or bent frame (if it’s bent bad enough for me to tell with the naked eye its BAD).

2) Make sure the body panels line up, and they all have EXACTLY the same paint. if they don’t, it has been wrecked, or someone just took them off for another reason.

3) Make sure belts and hoses are in good shape (if not I could replace them, but when buying a car the more things I make known that I don’t like the better i go for price)

3) Tire wear, should be even, alignment is spendy.

4) Suspension, if any components are bent, trouble.

5) Engine should fire right away and idle smooth. no jumpy or high idle. Should not choke or cough. Should run hard loose and clean.

6) Oil should be fairly clean, engine only has 10k (according to seller)

7) No fluid should be leaking from anywhere, ANYWHERE. Engine is brad new.

8) Wheels, no dents or bends, cars that have been curbed at 45mph do not have straight frames.

9) Exhaust should not be to thick or have a bluish tint.

10) Interior should show NO signs of water damage. Especially pay attention to area around t-tops. I know those leak on allot of f bodys. (Did they make a t-top camero?)

11) All dash electronics need to function properly, test everything. Heat, a/c, power windows and door locks, all switches gauge ect. Make sure the seat moves everywhere it is supposed to.

12) Make sure seats have no tears or rips, if they do, make sure he knows i know.

13) Missing parts, I know there are cargo covers for the rear deck. Did all years come with these? t-top bags, did all years come with these? How much are these specific items new from factory, (so I can tell him how much I will have to spend to replace them) and how much can aftermarket ones/junkyard be purchased for?

14) Do the back seats on fbodys fold down, most hatchbacks do?

If there is anything I have left out, fill me in. if there are anymore specific interior issues I need to worry about, let me know,

 

Here's the deal.
That's a pretty penny for a car over 10 years old with original "drivetrain"
YET up north, ya got roads to roam, so clutch & such can still be in good shape.
The engine is aged.
All stuff is aged.
That'll cost effort & time to bring back.
WHAT will go first or is gone already?
These cars hold up well.
Basic cars like the Jeep.
BUT the price is a pretty penny.
These cars are still common cars, this better be one exceptional vehicle.
PS the tops will leak. IF tops leak interior is aged & unless it snows alot there, also check for rust.

I paid $20 for a F Body T-Top bag as it's PERFECT for my 1974 Corvette T Tops!
Good2.8, take note of that, if ya didn't know already

These cars are all over LA including wrecking yards.
That ride in a V8 w/same options would justify the cost.

 

Not all f-bodies came with the cargo cover. All came with fold-down rear seats, but only some came with the split rear fold-down. Kinda hard to believe he wouldn't have receipts for anything... but hey, who knows. Should be no puff of blue smoke on startup which would signifiy leaking valve seals; kinda hard to rebuild an engine and not drop $10 for new valve seals, but I guess anything's possible

 

Yep... also, if he's rebuilt the engine, and not changed the oil in 10k miles, something's wrong. Another thing you can check, is pull the dipstick (oil) and look at it at an angle in bright light. if you see ANY shiny looky stuff in it, it's probably bearing material - and the engine is on its way out.

I'd really go over it with a fine tooth comb, if he's claiming the engine was rebuilt under 10k miles ago. The compression test should point that out, and the valve seals/rings (burning oil on startup) like TomP said. Of course, he'll probably give you the old 'Well, they all do that' excuse.

 

he is claiming the engine is NEW. not rebuilt. NEW. never before used. NEW

 

Oops, my bad. If it's a new motor, that suckers gotta pull nicely... wow.

 

yea, its gona bee sweeet

 

if it's a new motor (they cost a pretty penny) find out who the manufacturer was, many times they'll come with warrenties, and especially depending on when it was put in, the warranty might benifit you to some extent. When i ad my new engine put in from Jasper came with a 3 year 75,000 mile warranty, prob is it's developed an oil leak from either the pan, or rear main, and i'm thinkin that lil' distributor o-ring shoulda been changed along with the block, so it'll be getting fixed by them soon too......thank *** i've still got like 5 months left on that 3 year warranty (praying toget another new engine ) but i know that's probably not gonna happen.

Neway, new engines are expensive, and have warranties, so reciepts and or some type of documentation shouldn't be hard for him to produce if he actually had it installed at a shop etc. Also, be sure to look over the rear seats for those water issues also, my t-tops leak in the corners where the t-top meets the window seals and also along hte front edge at the same location, so water gets on the carpet and back seats often, (got on the back seat enough that it rotted my old seat away alil' caused a tear in the seam after people sat on it for long periods of time). Also check for mold on the carpet under the front seats, these are places that would normally be overlooked. Might not be a bad idea to ask to prop on of the t-tops up too, because the t-bar rails tend to rust on some cars that get excessive water in the "valley" area of the t-tops on the center bar...you'll see it if its there, right in the middle of the t-rail where the top slides into on the top side of the car, but you'll have to remove the tops to see it if its there. There's also a chance he's covered itwith silicon to cover it up (quick fix) either way, could help you lower your price cause nothing's worse on a white car but a big thing of rust colored metal once you have the tops off and are attempting to look cool w/ the lady

 

thanks man, i will look for that.

 

There's something called a
RECEIPT
that was obtained when he purchased the motor.
make him find it.
NEW MOTORS are easy to make
with a spray can and a "few choice parts"

 

wood laquer also works well i hear.