Has anyone ever stuffed one of these 4.3 V6's into a bird or camaro as a project? The engine bay definately has enough room for it, but ive searched for someone that has done it and come up with nothing. The reason i ask is because we have an 87 astro van with 274K that is still very very peppy for a stock motor with one rebuild, and i have a thing for odd engine setups. It defenately does have power and potential (there are some very avid Astro van enthusiasts out there that can find aftermarket parts just the same as the 2.8's and other V6's that came with these cars stock-but they have enough power to drift a big Astro on dry roads-trust me ive done it. I don't know if anyone knows about them or what or if its just not a good setup for thirdgens, but id be very interested in hearing about a 4.3 V6 swap into a thirdgen.

 

For the price, you can have a V8 in there - it's the exact same amount of work

 

but his price is **FREE** pretty much the same thing as a vee-ate swap, but see about motor mount brackets.

Odd setups, been there, done that. Will do it again

 

my auto shop teacher did it....

he went carb tho cuz he didnt have all the wiring and computer...but he dosent know anything abot carbs so now hes gonna go tbi

he said he just used the 2.8 engine mounts...with some modifying

his car was auto, i dont no if the matters...he also said hood clearence is an issue...he made a special intake out of his wifes cookie trays cuz he dosent like cowl hoods

as for anything else i dont no what he did...he wasent really happy with it, so now it just sits in his garage...its kinda a waste...cuz that car in *mint* never seen winter, hardly seen rain he dorve to skool once a month and that was it

 

Honestly, there are plenty of really cheap 305s and 350s out there. For the labor and the money you're going to spend, you're better off just swapping in a V8.

A Free 4.3 V6, does not mean the job will be free... all the hoses, brackets, and tune-up items will add up.

 

i posted before but i guess it didnt go through

i have a V8 that has the same cubic inchage as the 4.3 V6(262) with proof(cuz noone has ever believed me) just no way of getting it on the net. Its out of a 75 Nova if anyone cares. i know the cost of a swap cuz i had a 2.8 that was dead since 2001. the car was free too. But i believe that the 4.3 uses the SBC motor mounts. Either way a swap isnt really expensive just labor intensive, unless you dont want to fabricate some things you need. but i believe the block for the 4.3 is almost like a 350 with two cylinders lobbed off. I was just wondering if anyone here had done it, i have no intentions of doing it myself.

 

I believe you. I had a '79 Olds Cutlass that had the 262ci V8 in it.

 

4.2l I believe it is right?

off on this note for a second but I seen the comment that an auto tech techer doesn't know carbs? need to fire that bum. and any auto tech teacher that drives an import.

 

The SMALL "262" V8 is a very late 70's/early 80's V8 that came & went very quickly. It's wasn't a very good engine power "design" and the 305 was a better "torque engine". 262 V8 "designed" for quick emission/gas penalty requirements.
That one ya found in the 1975 Nova was "placed there by previous owner".
That said
Spend the time selling everything & finding a 3rd Gen V8 swap engineering by a GM assembly line team.
Free engine parts also equals max profit upon selling said free engine parts....

 

it could have very well been placed there but it had the belt routings sticker on it as well as all the other stickers youd find on a car under the hood-this one happens to be on the fan shroud.

but anyway this isnt my project car its a car to get me from point a to point b, these boards were very helpful for wiring and dropping the gas tank and such so i joined cuz i do like these cars ive just had another project car thats not a third gen

im just really surprised no one here has stuffed in a big V6-granted they arent that good on gas but somebody has to love quarky things like this

 

the 262 WAS a factory installed engine in a '75 nova...

btw, bru333, if your cutlass had the original motor in it, it would be the 260 ci motor built by olds... just fyi

 

The 262 was also put into the Monzas.

The 4.3 is basicly a 350 with 2 cylinders cut off.

The 305 was the worst V8 motor Chevy ever produced, and thats not opinion, thats fact.

 

A FREE 305 > than a 2.8 V6

 

No
I can't agree on the 262 into a 1975 Nova.
We had one. I was 18 at the time
Base engine was the 350, 2 bbl. & the 250 six. Optional was the 350 4 bbl.
You'd have to supply me with something.
My Helm factory manual book is for 1974. And I've got a 1977 Helms, too
I just checked that 1974 one.
NOT INCLUDING VEGAS which was a 2300cc 140 cid
250, 350, 400, 454 sized engines.
Help me be eating my words.
I do know the "H" series cars were introduced in late 70's w/262. I think it was 1978 first year.
Hot set up was slipping in a 350 or 400 SBC in place of the 262. Incidentially, the rear axle we have on our 3rd Gens...are derivatives of that Vega rear axle.
Help prove me wrong cause I'm real curious.

 

ok, '74 wouldn't have had a 262 yet. if you look at engine availability on autozone.com and advanceautoparts.com they list a 250 ci L6, 2bbl 262, 2bbl 350, and 4bbl 350 for the nova. i'll look for other, more widely accepted sources now.

btw, i'm not trying to make you eat your words, i'd like to think that we are all among friends here...

 

http://www.novaresource.org/history.htm

http://www.novaresource.org/v75.htm

http://www.nastyz28.com/sbchevy/sblock.html

http://people.smu.edu/acambre/nova/e...tatistics.html

 

We had a 6 cylinder LN Nova.
I'll be damned, that lousy 262 V8 engine was also available.
Thanks for proving me wrong!
I knew it was a V8 short lived until later on in the 70's.

 

i have a 1980 Monza Spyder...and im pretty sure the axles r diff cuz the rear end in my firebird is about 5 inches longer then my Monza...plus the Monza is a 4 bolt wheel

and they dont have 262's...they have 267's...262 was a one year wonder for 1974...

iv u want to more...100 years of small block chevs

 

Incidentially, the rear axle we have on our 3rd Gens...are derivatives of that Vega rear axle.

A derivative is a variation on something.
The Pumpkin/Gear size on the Vega (H body) is the same in the 3rd gen F Body.
Yes tubes, attachment points, axles are different.

No not 1974, it seems 1975 was this "262" one year hit.
The "267" is in the 90's. Correct?
The "265" was first modern V8 Chevy size back in 1955 & 1956 year vehicles.
"283" was first in 1957 vehicles.

 

I think the 301 is worst, 305 2nd worst

 

chebby built a 301? are you sure you're not thinking of the crap turd pontiac 301????

anyway, my 95 blazer w/the no aftermarket cpi 4.3 can get up and go given the weight of the 4wd beast. I think a swap into the f-body couldn't hurt.

 

oh. i am thinking of the pontiac 301.

edit: If you can put the 4.3 in for a cheap price, then go for it.

 

Just so you know, the Pontiac 301 put out more torque and horsepower than the 305 all through the years that the 301 and the 305 were built in tandem.


That said, I do have a 350 4-bolt small block chevy in my 81 TransAm.

The 305 isn't a bad motor per se, it's not it's displacement, just the cyl heads and camshaft are crap. You can build a very decent 327 stroker from a 305 if you want to. But you have to buy new cyl heads and whatnot.

There isn't much you can do with a 301 for the simple reason that they didn't bother to produce much if any aftermarket parts for it.

 

A 262 is pretty much a 350 less 2 cylinders. Itll basically be like a SBC V8 swap. What form of FI do you plan to use? The flakey CPI with the vortec heads would be the best out of them all. Edel also makes a manifold for the vortec heads so you could use a 500 CFM holley carb or something, which would probably be better then the CPI. Other option is to use a CPI ecm and do some tweakage for use with TBI. From 93-95 the PCMs support both. This last one would require you do do prom burning, though.

 

(LT1guy)

The 4.3 actually would be a good swap, though like many have said it would be on the same difficulty/cost level as swapping a non-stock V8. Because they have been raced (Busch series and others), there are lots of good factory parts available, incl aluminum Bowtie heads and intakes, and plenty of good cam designs. Some creative shopping with Muscle Motors or a similar used circle track parts place could probably come up with some neat stuff, for a fairly reasonable price. I have seen a nice MGB at some of the Super Chevy shows with a Bowtie-equipped 4.3, and he had dyno sheets that showed over 350hp out of it, and it wasn't built that radically. Car Craft got over 500hp out of one with a Vortech blower and a carb (the front of the motor is the same as an SBS, so all the accessories, including blowers, bolt up). It may not be the most practical swap, but how much of car crafting is really "practical" anyway?

 

Figure the cost for a dead, rusted MGB and there is justification for stuffing in a 4.3 V6!
Figure the cost for that motor from the car craft article (I've read the issue) and find a decent condition V8 3rd Gen and make more money and have more fun.

 

I just installed a 4.3 Turbo out of a Syclone, It really was'nt as hard as i thought it would be. just a few minor things to change.
the hardest part was the wiring. Still have a few kinks but it scares the hell out me when punch it.

 

I imagine it is considering it has 2x the power of the 88 305

 

Going with the 4.3L wouldnt be a bad choice. We had the 4.3L vortec in our 94 astro. That things had 230000 miles on it and we beat the sh*t out of it. Every weekend we used it up north as a work horse, pulling stumps, I used it as a street racing van. It had some pretty good pickup especially when it was new, and that was in a van! That would be slick! plus something very few people in the world have

 

WHERE IS IT FACT??? What you say about the 305 goes for the 350 as well!! By your ignorant statement, why did GM make the 350 it is junk the 400 is better. The 1/4 bore difference effects the engine very little a 350 in the same car, with the same transmission, gears, converter, etc. won't do much if any better. It also tends to suck up the gas more. As you can tell I VERY STRONGLY DISAGREE with the comment on the 305. If you think about it the newer LS1 and 5.3 is designed the same way. Less bore and more stroke. You get your torque and your fuel mileage. The 305 makes a much better engine for a driver than say a 302 with the same cam, heads, etc. The shorter stroke means less torque. Just open up the heads with some port work and go with a mild cam. My L69 cammed 305 can get 23 mpg on the highway in a 5,000 lbs brick doing 75 @ 1,800 rpm and still have plenty more left. Stock they are a little anemic up top, but that is easily fixed. The cylinder block is very hard and earlier 305 blocks are thicker than the 350 of the same time.

My bone stock 170 HP @4,400 rpm, 250 ft/lb @ 2,000 LE9 carbed 305 (basically a L69) G20 Fullsize Conversion Van with a 3.08 gear ran a 17.5 @ 72 completely with stock pellet style cat, the restrictive 1983 van air cleaner, stock timing curves, etc. Recurved the distributer and added a later model TBI air intake setup which gave a 17.1 @ 74. I opened up the exhaust by eliminating the cat, adding 2 1/4 pipes from the manifolds back, and used glass packs. I also tweaked the Q-Jet at the same time, that gave a 16.7 @ 79. I then changed the governor springs and weights to get upshifts @ 4,800 instead of 4,200. My times then went to 16.3 @ 85. My closest guess to power was about 240-250 HP@4,800 at the crank and about 310 ft/lbs @ 2,500

 

You can't compare the smaller bore/longer stroke of the LSx motors and say they're designed with the same thought as the 305. You're talking 15 degree valve angles on the LSx's, vs. 23 on the SBC 305s. The LSx's do not have valve shrouding issues which is the main pitfall of the 305, and precluded you from running a big cam in it. You're way off, the 1/4" difference in the bore effects the motor in a huge way because of that! Can't run a big cam when you're smaking the piston walls because of the narrower bores. Thats precisely why they'll always be anemic up top, and why the fastest 305 on record is what, bottom 11's IIRC. Thats just getting warmed up for a 350 or 302 Ford.

And there is no way in heck you'll get anyone to agree with you that a 305 is a better engine than a Ford (or the rare Chevy) 302. There's nary a difference in torque between a 302 and a 305, and the more oversquare 302 can actually rev, and has a better rod/stroke ratio.

The 305 was another smog era by product, designed in the late 70s for economy/emissions. The 302 was designed as a race motor for Trans Am racing back in the heyday of muslce cars in the late 60s.

 

I agree.

It will be different, it won't weigh as much as a v8, and it should get close to 305 performance with better economy. So long as the swap doesn't involve any substantial cost, then it's fine. If the cost were substantial, then it would make some sense to use a v8 instead of the v6.... IF you had to have the performance of the v8.

The upside for the v6 is less drivetrain friction than a v8, so at part throttle cruise the fuel economy will be 5% to 10% better than a v8. So that's a very good reason to try it. It will also be unique, and you can use TBI.

HRM did a 4.3 v6 build and got 301 fwhp from it after putting in a cam and porting the heads. I don't suggest you use the same cam that they did but I do strongly suggest porting the heads and either keeping the stock cam + 1.6 stamped rockers (greater lift, more flow, small cost) OR use a warmer-than-stock aftermkt cam. See the head flow comparison here approx 2/3rd into the thread for swirl port heads porting, that includes the v6 vs v8 and others.

 

I have seen a 305 race engine on balanced stock rotating parts (L69 Spec), stock heads(stock 1422601 castings), stock lift hydraulic tappet cam rule, make over 430 HP at the crank at 6,500 rpm with a 500 holley 2 bbl. Elaborating more, it was a claimer engine meaning, NOT high $$$.

What precluded me from running a big cam in my 312 is not the valve-bore clearance. It was the fact that I have 5,000+ of non aerodynamic brick, cutting through the wind @ 75 mph (more if their is a headwind), bucking hills, with 3.08 gears, a .7 overdrive, all while running 1,800 RPM. My Malibu is not limited to this, T-56 with 3.73 gears, all of 2,800 lbs.

How much cam do you want to run in a 305. With stock sized 1.84" valves in the intake you can run well over .500" of lift. I ran a LT4 hot cam with 1.6:1 rockers(.525" of lift) on a angle milled L31 vortec head (machined for added lift) on a .030" over 305 block. No collision resulted even at 6,300 rpm shifts.

Aftermarket 18 degree heads will fit on a 305 if you really want to get technical about it. The valves are shifted farther away from the bore.

Obviously you've never had both in the same vehicle. I pulled a L31 Vortec headed 305 out of a malibu, then put in a L31 vortec headed 302 (.030 over 350 one piece rear seal block with a L99 265 caprice crank and rods). Same heads, cam, same compression ratio, etc. Just the short block was different. The 302 will wind out a little more (1,000 RPM more 7,200 vs. 6,200), but the 305 made alot more torque off-idle and around town(atleast 20-30 ft/lbs). It also got 3-5 MPG better. Highway speed downshifts are more fun on the 302. Just nailing the gas on the 305 without downshifting, pulls better than the 302. The 305 runs better stoplight to stoplight. Stroke effects torque alot, bore not as much. You still have the same # of cubic inches displacement. True you have a little less area, but the difference in area is not as great as the missing leverage from the 1/2" stroke difference.

 

I forgot to mention, Call Rodney at Redman Racing in Las Colinas, Texas. He could probably provide you with a build sheet and dyno numbers from a supercharged 305 he built. It made over 700 RWHP and a whole bunch of torque. Its an engine, it can be made to breathe. Head ports no matter how crummy stock, can be made to breathe. Valve clearence issues can be addressed, etc.

 

i dont no...there r alot of ppl on this site that do alot of 305 bashing

i dont c what the big deal is...yes the 305 is no power house...but then agian...it wasent meant to be...it was like said..a smogger engine....sure it got off 2 a rought start with thoses wooden cams...but once that prob was taken care of..

i dont no...maybe growing up with 4banger hondas...maybe i just have more respect for a v8

but the 4 (in running cars) that i own all work like a clock...dont burn oil...and will do what ever i ask of them...lol...maybe i just got lucky and got the only 4 good ones?

just my 2 cents

 

The Fact is you have to know what your doing to make a 305 fast. most of these people who say there slow and you cant make them fast have never tried. they only go by what they have hear " only 170 hp from the factory" oh you cant mod them at all they only had 170 hp from the factory. Its not like there a small block chevy or anything. if people say you cant make them fast because of displacement then they do not know what they are talking about. look at these guys building the hondas and mitsubishi motors. they have a very small bore and hell there a 4 cyl inline motor horrible for torque . but how come they are running up with everyones prized 350`s and big blocks. its because of knowledge they know what to do to make the power im sure people said oh you cant make them fast . well when there running low 10s in a civic i think they proved that bore size had nothing to do with that. If you have time knowledge and money you can make your 305 eat up 350s. i mean hell i have a 94 vortec 4 bolt main 350 sitting on the floor at my house being used as a toolbox holder . i have a 305 bored and all pretty sitting on my engine stand waiting for its new turbo and intercooler. the reason i chose 305 over the 350 first is cyl wall thickness, with the 305 i can produce more boost and keep it cooler better than i could if i used the 350 bored 30 over, 2nd i can rev the 305 faster and higher than i can with my 350 which all you turbo guys know out there is way more important than off the line torque. 3rd reason was to show all the old vette guys in my town with there 350`s and big blocks that "a little 305" can tear up some asphalt.

 

just curious...why do you say you can rev the 305 faster and higher than the 350?

 

Cute theory on the LSX engines however a 3.905 bore is a LOT further from a 3.736 bore (LS1 and LS6) and the 4.0" bore being the same as the typical 350, along with the now LS1 replacing LS2, the truck LQ4 and LQ9, sure the lower end motors of the group (4.8 and 5.3) have a smaller bore, but the performance engines have a large bore, go figure

 

AM91Camaro_RS answer to your question. If you were to build the 2 motors evenly with the same internals (from same manufactors) the 305 will rev faster and higher. less roatating mass. thats saying you used like 4340 forged rods and forged pistons. Dont get me wrong i love the 350 motor myself but i also like the 305 motors. 350is a great engine but so is the 305 if you can build it right. the 350 is easier to make power with because of displacement but you can make power from a 305 its just a little harder. and might cost a little more.

 

Which is exactly everyones point, your shorting yourself cubic inches, head selection, valve shrouding, to say you have a "305"

 

GOOD Bare 350 blocks go for around $500.00 here. You already have the 305 block or a complete engine.

 

Well heck i've got 3 of em, line up some customers, specially being that a BRAND NEW gm 350 block is only a hair more than $500, I'm going to have to write your comments off as coming from a retard.

 

i can get 350 Engines for around 200 a pop or so

 

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