mexicanknight

Is it possible to remove the smog pump and egr from a 3.1 and not having a fault code?

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

Nope, you'll throw a code and the CEL will light up.

Stephen

iTrader: (12)

Why would a V6 be any different? Done it on V8s before & no codes, no CEL light.

A better question is WHY remove it? Doesn't cost you any measureable horsepower, so why remove it?

chevyracingrox

although it's not a big power gain they can get old and all that extra junk in the engine bay gets kinda annoying to work around. I removed both my smog pump and EGR valve with pretty good results, but my car wasn't running before I removed the components so I can't say it was a big gain or a gain at all. for the smog pump get an idler pulley off an another camaro, usually an automatic won't have a smog pump. the EGR valve will most likely throw a code, but a lot of people swear removing it can help the car run better. After all, more fresh air gets sucked in instead of dead exhaust air.

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

In my case, the car was wrecked and sat for 3 years before I got it. The smog pump bearings were shot and the pulley would barely turn. It was cheaper and easier to remove it than to replace it. Especially since I knew I was putting a 350 in the following winter.

Anything related to emissions control should throw a code and light the CEL if removed/nonfunctioning. I don't believe the smog pump is controlled by the computer, but the EGR is so you should get a code and CEL for that at least. I just pulled the bulb in my dash.

mexicanknight

well im plannig on replacing the 3.1 for a 3.4 in the next year, so why not and start removing crap from under the hood.

so if i remove the smog pump it wont be a problem, but is a remove the egr it ill throw a code?

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

You'll need a shorter belt or a delete pulley to remove the smog pump. The EGR should throw a code if removed. I don't believe the smog pump will, but I never checked for codes after removing mine. I don't recall seeing anything about it throwing a code if removed, but I never really looked into it that deeply either.

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

The EGR WILL throw a code 32 if removed and the code is not deleted from the MEMCAL, which can be a problem if you are in a pollution-controlled state. There is no code for the AIR system.

Depending on your location, if you delete the AIR pump, you will need one of 2 belts, compatible with the following Drive-Rite part numbers. With A/C: 915K6, without A/C: 815K6.

Stephen

iTrader: (12)

Really? Then please explain why my pump is gone, the EGR is just a "prop" now (hoses go nowhere or are plugged/not hooked up, yet it all LOOKS functional), stock MEMCAL.....and NO codes.

chevyracingrox

According to the EPA cars must have a warning light for malfunctioning emission components, it was that way when the cars were built. from the factory it will throw a code if anything acts up. why it doesn't work that way most of the time, I have no idea.

mexicanknight

i have no emissions here where i live so that wont be a problem i just want to know about the code.

drdave88

iTrader: (3)

The only way to get rid of the light for the EGR is to burn a new chip for the ECM. I removed the AIR pump from my car, didnt need a delete pulley or anything, just got a shorter belt and was good to go.

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

Do you still have the computer-controlled solenoid connected that activates the EGR? If so, that is the only part that the computer really recognizes, not the actual valve itself. That's probably why your not seeing a codeCEL/

Stephen

iTrader: (12)

Never looked around for it, nor even know where it would be. Never bothered to look for such a device on any car.

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

That's definitely why your not getting the code/CEL then. Should be mounted on a bracket on the left side of the intake manifold, near the EGR valve. Has a 2-wire plug and 2 vacuum lines connected to it IIRC.

Stephen

iTrader: (12)

I never said it wasn't there. Just that I haven't ever bothered to look.

Maybe it is gone, maybe not. But I'll look.

Left side....Driver's or Passenger side?

chevyracingrox

passenger side, IIRC.

Stephen

iTrader: (12)

I'm not seeing anything....You've got me curious now. Got a pic of one?

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

It should be mounted to a bracket underneath your ignition coil (assuming the L98). There is also a switch mounted to the valve itself.

Your solenoid is different from the one on the 2.8... It's a PWM system that regulates flow.
EGR is also affected by the neutral safety switch adjustment (as well as IAC and VSS operation).

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

Passenger's side. I was thinking left as in when your standing in front of the car. But then, I'm thinking of my old V6 too. I would assume it would be the same as on the 88-94 fullsize Chevy/GMC trucks since they use the same TBI setup, but I could be wrong on that. I'll check my Camaro's shop manual tonight and let you know.

drdave88

iTrader: (3)

[QUOTE=92RS_Ttop;4379215]Passenger's side. I was thinking left as in when your standing in front of the car. QUOTE]

Always think of it like youre sitting in the drivers seat.

Stephen

iTrader: (12)

To avoid different people's perception of what is left & was is right....I just always say Drivers Side or Passenger Side. That works for all but Australia & England!

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

The location I posted was from my 87 Firebird FSM...

Stephen

iTrader: (12)

I hadn't even thought about looking in my 87 FSM....

But looking at page 6E3-A2-40 & looking under the hood, it appears to be upright on the lower plenum, between the runners. Incorrect?

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

Yeah, I know left/right is normally from the perspective of sitting in the driver's seat. I have just never been able to get myself to think that way when standing in front of a vehicle leaning over the engine.

The shop manual for my 92 Camaro agrees with what's listed above. The solenoid is mounted on a bracket on the left(passenger's ) side of the engine, near the firewall.

RBob

iTrader: (1)

Look for an EGR diagnostic switch. IIRC it is a temperature operated switch that is located in the EGR passageway. This tells the ECM whether the EGR is actually active or not.

At the same time a re-located MAT sensor will disable the EGR. Along with the EGR diagnostic routine. Looking at the diag routine it also appears that an engine coolant temperature of less then 194F will disable the diagnostic routine. So a lower then stock thermostat may also disable the EGR diag routine along with code 33 that it could set.

Note about the '90-'92 V6 3.1L cars. The EGR diagnostic routine is different then the '87 TPI routine. In this case, during light decel at speed the ECM will open a single pintle (digital EGR valve) at a time and look for the proper change in manifold pressure.

RBob.

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

Did you mean 6E3-C7-4? That's where the diagram is in my book. Also, according to 6E3-A2-2, it's outside the runners over cylinders 6 and 8, closer to 8.

Project 3.4 Camaro

Heh, one look at my intake manifold will answer that :P There's more gunk than metal... And as someone after me stated its more crap to work around, and it uglifies the engine bay, the less useless crap in there the better imo

Stephen

iTrader: (12)

Your talking about visual stuff. I'm talking about mechanical/electrical reasons to remove it.

GeneralLC

I've seen someone remove the power steering just to save some power. When your young and don't have any money you'll do stupid things to try to get more power.

jensen73110

iTrader: (4)

^Wouldn't that be more likely to shave weight...?

Project 3.4 Camaro

Half an inch of carbon sediment on the inside of your intake manifold is more than visual......

cjhooker92

Ok,maybe I missed it,but did we determine if there would be problems with running if smog & egr are removed? Or is it just dash lights? We have no emissions testing where I live and I wont be relocating anytime soon.If possible I will be shortening my belt this weekend.Thanks

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

I ran mine without the smog pump for only 1 summer(about 3k miles) and didn't notice any ill effects. Engine ran fine without it.

cjhooker92

What about the egr valve? I have heard of people having to replace them.But is that for emisssions reasons? Where I was at the time EVERYTHING had to be stock and functional.

chevyracingrox

in a 92 the 'digital' egr valve may cause the engine to run different, but i'm about 80% sure it wouldn't have a negative effect if it was gone. try unplugging it and just running around without it and see what happens. the smog pump is a waste of space and can be removed for any reason you can think of.

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

I never removed the EGR on my V6 before I swapped the engine out for the 350. The only reason I removed the smog pump is because it was frozen up from the car sitting in my friend's barn for 3 years. Otherwise I would have just left things go since I was only planning on leaving the V6 in for a year till I could get the 350 built.

chevyracingrox

so you're pretty much saying you don't have any useful info for this thread?

cjhooker92

Oh it has been unplugged for a long time Im guessing.Considering the plug is torn to pieces. Somehow in my random thoughts I was thinking maybe it was stuck open or closed and helping my car run like a bag of Sh@t. Either way,thank you all for your advice.Im trying hard to believe I can make fuel injection work for me.I will update a post here once I run with EGR removed/blocked off and smog pump delete.Im not worried about SES lights it has plenty already and I constantly check everything so I should be good there.Thanks again.

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

Have you bothered to actually read any of my posts??


Here's the summary for you:

Yes, I removed the smog pump from my V6

Yes, it ran fine for the 3k miles I put on the car that summer.

You can delete the smog pump without a special pulley, you just need a shorter belt.

You will need to plug the AIR port on the cat. I used a vacuum cap and a hose clamp.

The EGR won't throw a CEL if the computer-controlled solenoid is still connected.

The EGR valve on a 3.1L V6 is located on the passenger's side of the engine, bolted to the head.

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

Actually, on a MAP engine, the ECM will still throw a code if the EGR is unplugged in any way. The ECM will use the MAP to determine if the EGR has opened or not, and if it doesn't sense the difference in intake pressure, it will throw the light (my 93 GP ran for 2 years with a faulty EGR system, with the digital EGR, and it would throw the light after about ten miles, yes, with the solenoid unit connected).

It's bolted to both the intake plenum and the passenger's side exhaust manifold...

cjhooker92

Well I finally got tired of the RS stalling when I get off the interstate everyday,so today I removed my EGR valve.I had stated before that the plug was wrecked before I even bought the car so it wasnt working anyway. I pulled it off,copied the shape onto a piece of steel and drilled/milled it.Once bolted on I started the motor I INSTANTLY lost a quarter tank of gas and it threw the SES light on. :O OH KNOOOOOOWS!!!!


In all seriousness. It tripped the SES light which has been on since and I am sure will stay on until I remove the bulb(which will be soon cause my airbag light will never go off).Im not concerned about a light or a loss of 1-2 MPG. I am concerned with the fact that since I removed it the cars RUNS and IDLES fines.Doesnt stall when I go to stop and it didnt cost me w/e a new EGR costs.

I can see peoples points of view in wanting to keep everything emissions safe and stock,but Im not going foot the bill on a part that is ideally just shooting B/S into my engine and making it run like a bag of $hit. I dont live in an area where I need to worry about inspections so I am gonna ride the cheap and free way(without stalling).

Will be removing the smog pump as soon as I have the extra moolah for a shorter belt.Thanks to everyone for the info and I hope maybe this helps answer the posters question. Cheers

91camarolover

iTrader: (1)

Whats the length of that belt?

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

91.5 inches long with 6 ribs... 915K6

Meca84

what size belt would i use if ive take the smog pump and a/c compressor off?

Meca84

would yuo know whats size or a way to find out the size? and belt routing?

Meca84

without A/c ?

Meca84

without A/c ?

Meca84

without A/C?