Bobby Suth

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I got the wireing hooked up. motor turns over.I have left the fuel lines disconected to drain fuel tank and refill with fresh fuel.Mostly I know nothing history wise about the 86 bird or the 3.1 we are installing. I tryed to run the fuel pump useing the G terminal under the dash with grounded battery to frame and hot wire to G . nothing happens. If I put the battery in and turn the key to bump the motor still no sign of fuel flow. other than a bad wire from front to tank or a bad fuel pump,is there anything else that could be bad? oh yes I did try the fuel pump relay off the 3.1 harness just for kicks.NO GO.Auto zone said they can't get the fuel pump relay for the 2.8.but have one for the 3.1.is there realy any diference.cause I still got the one off the 3.1 harness. Also the wireing diagram in the book said there should be a blk/wht,tan/wht,dr.gn/wht.,rd,and org.wire to and from the fp relay.I got blk/wht,dr.gn/wht.,tan/wht.,big org.,and little org. NO RED on that item.The only red I see is a big red on the heater/air relay.thanks for checking

Maverick H1L

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If AutoZone is telling you they can't sell you a 2.8 fuel pump relay, you need to find another store as they are you. GM used the same relay for the pump, the coolant fan, the MAF sensor, and possibly the A/C compressor clutch. And not just on our cars.

Another way to power the pump is to pull the connector off of the 2-wire oil pressure sender (if you're still using it) or the 3-wire connector off, and jump the orange wire to the gray wire. If the fuel pump won't run that way, either it's crapped out, or there is a bad connection between it and the engine bay.

And yes, there is a difference between the 2 relays unless you plan on rewiring the connectors... If you haven't already noticed, the 3.1 relay won't fit on the 2.8 harness. Some cars may have a red wire on the constant-connect side of the relay for the fuel pump switch that is used to power the pump for a test, but it's mostly on the later cars that don't have a connection to ALDL G.

Bobby Suth

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I did change the fittings over off of the 2.8's filter mount so the 3.1's would acsept the 2.8 wireing harness.If I remember right it's a tan/white wire insted of a gray on this 2.8 harness.I figured the small org. was the same as the small red on the other.I cut the harness and put connectors on both relayes so I could put the original back in place if I needed to. So it would be jump the tan/white wire and orange that should be going to the same connector that has 2 post coming up.The other has only a single post. OH and auto zone said that relay showed not available.but had the newer type in stock for 8.00 for the 3.1 type.I will let you know how it gose after the christmas actividies die down.thanks

Gumby

fuse in the right front of the nose, they are hidden in water tight connectors.

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

Check this ONLY if your SES light isn't coming on either... Inline Fuse #2 powers both the fuel pump and the constant 12V supply to the ECM.

You can also just jump the tan and orange wires on the relay. And swap the relay with one of the other 2 I mentioned (excluding the A/C relay). If nothing happens then, have someone get under the back and lightly hit on the fuel tank as the pump may be worn out and/or stuck, or get under there and unplug the yellow connector from its mate above the tail of the driveshaft and connect the wires up there (if you have a spare battery or other power supply).

Bobby Suth

iTrader: (2)

Maverick H1L when I use a battery grounded to the body and touch a wire to the G post on the under dash circet thing.I do get small sparks as the wire makes contact.that should mean there is a compleat circet,right?

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

What I generally do is positive wire of a battery to ALDL G and the negative to A (top right black, lower left orange/red, whatever). But, yes, the circuit is complete if you're getting sparks at the ALDL when you connect the battery. Sounds like you may need to open the gas filler cap and listen for the fuel pump as you connect up to the ALDL to make sure the pump is running and possibly jar the tank if it's not.

Gumby

Kept blowing my fuse in the nose when playing with mine, also found my bulkhead connector was flaky. Had good juice inside the car but once it ran through the tin on the back, it wasn't reliable.

enswrob

i don't know if this will apply since mine is newer i just swap out the coolant fan and fuel pump relays since they are next to each other for a test. ive started mine doing that test. turned out my pump was bad. also check the connection just in front of the rear wheels. thats the fuel pump ckt. should be a little tab keeping the connector from seperating.left mine out since ive had so many pump problems

Gumby

Yea once you have problems, ya do what ya gotta do.

I wound up rewiring mine so not to use the bulkhead, and I blew several more fuses figuring out the correct way to wire in a back up switch, [don't use a light up switch] so I can give the pump juice direct if need be.

Really sucks having to go back into it, even with an access hole.

Bobby Suth

iTrader: (2)

Is there an acsess hole under the back seat.Someone said there might be.I havent sean it talked about in any of the maintnence books.Plus everyone talks about pulling the tank to get to the pump.Sounds like alot of crawling.I have no lift and have the front jacked up right now putting the motor in.

Gumby

No access hole stock, you gotta make one, which some don't like as some just take a hatchet n chop the hole, then ducttape it closed.

TomP

At Autozone, they're not lying "exactly" because there's no specific listing for the fuel pump relay- like Maverick said the compressor relay is the same part number (but called a compressor relay in their computer). Have them do a cross reference search for the AC Delco part number, have them search for 14078915, or search that number yourself on autozone.com, or, I got my AC Delco one from rockauto. [edit: rockauto shows different ac delco part numbers for all those relays- might have something to do with the amperage the relay can handle, or the duty cycle?]

Yes terminal G will bypass the pump fuse and pump relay, it will send 12 volts directly to the pump, through the wire that runs from the firewall to the connector above the axle. That wire runs through the body, under the carpet, to between the back seats where it goes outside the car. So basically, if you gave terminal G 12 volts, and you didn't hear the fuel pump or see fuel pressure on your gauge, there's a break in that wire somewhere OR a bad pump. Don't use a test light to check for 12 volts at the rear body-to-pump connector, use a volt meter- the pump will run at lower voltage but not be enough to get correct fuel pressure.

Bobby Suth

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It looks like there are two or three fuses in the front.would it br the one with the red and orange wire running to it

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

Again, if your SES light is on when you turn the key on, don't worry about the fuse. But, you can check the orange wire at the relay to see if it has power. And yes, the fuse with the orange and red wires is the Inline #2 fuse. The other one is for the MAF.

Bobby Suth

iTrader: (2)

just was wondering.I thought it was.I aim almost certain the pump is not good.Going to start jacking the back up tomorrow.wish I had one of thoughs nice shops I see in some pics I see on here.Maybe some day.

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

Make sure to spray all of the rear suspension nuts and bolts quite well with some sort of penetrant, and possibly let the car sit for a few hours to let it soak in nicely. Clean them up really nice with a wire brush and then use anti-seize compound on them when you put them back together. Same for the tank bolts. More than likely, unless you got lucky with the pump, you'll probably have to do this again unless you sell the car (fuel pumps are notorious for going out at the worst times). You may want to drain the tank and then seal it as well.

Bobby Suth

iTrader: (2)

Thanks for the heads up about the penetrating oil.you said somthing about sealing the tank after I drain it.You must be talking about somthing to put in or on the tank,like paint or what?The book dosn't tell you how the filer neck shield is disconected for tank removal.It's been cold out so I've been reading up as much as I can.I've got to change the tranny out in the Iroc as soon as I get this bird back on it's feet.

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

The sealer is a stuff you pour into the empty tank and then slosh around inside until it covers all of the inner surfaces and seams. Read the can if/when you get it.

Not sure what you mean by the filler neck shield, but if it's the plastic part between the outer quarter panel and the inner structure, I just left mine in place when I yanked my tank as I wasn't sure how to remove it either. You may want another person to help you do this as that tank is heavy and bulky without fuel in it (about 20 lbs, I've heard, not counting gas).

Bobby Suth

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I tried to get fuel out or see if it had fuel in it about 2 months ago and didn't have any luck siphoning.Now the car may not have had any in it .the fuel lines were not hooked up sense the motor had been pulled,and had set for atleast a year before I got it.When we started trying to purge the system to make sure it had somthing in it to eliminate that question I put about 4 gal. in it.so I know its got that much for sure.What is the seal stuff called and will auto zone have it?

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

http://www.eastwood.com/ew-gas-tank-...-for-cars.html

You won't find a complete kit for cheaper... I searched. Unless you REALLY want the POR-15 system, which is $57 for the size required.

Oh, and definitely get another person to help you yank the tank... With 4 gallons in it (and however much on top of that), it weighs at least 52 pounds (which is why I spent 15 minutes running my fuel pump to drain it before I yanked it).

KrisW

iTrader: (5)

And don't be intimidated by the amount of work to get your tank out. Its not THAT bad of a job (I just did it in the two days before Christmas in stages) and it all goes pretty well if you take your time and soak everything in penetrating oil before you start.

I pulled the gas cap stuff by just pulling those little screws out and putting all the parts in a box. It comes apart and goes together in a very common sense way.

Jack up the back of the car, put the jackstands in front of the lower control arms. Take off the back wheels. Take loose the shocks and sway bar end links. Remove the driveshaft. Remove the muffler and exhaust pipe. Remove the heat shields. Loosen the brake line tee where it bolts to the rear end housing and loosen the clips for the brake lines on the axle tubes (but leave the brake lines hooked up. No need to bleed brakes) and open the clamps for the emergency brake cables so that they can slip out free.

Remove the panhard bar and support bracket. Lower the rear axle until you can get the springs out and it should come down quite a bit more. Now you can take the fuel lines loose and wiring loose. Then drop the straps and the tank comes out. You have to twist the tank and contort it a little (I had to spin mine a little to get the angle right for the neck to come free) and you can get it out.

Mine had gas so old in it that it was turpentine. I spent a good amount of time cleaning out the inside of the tank and cleaning the sending unit before putting it all back together. I think that is the secret to not having to change the pump again for another 20 years, but I could be wrong.

I installed a vortec pump (like the 89TTA used) so that it would deliver for my stock engine AND the higher HP levels that I want in the future.

Good luck man!!

Bobby Suth

iTrader: (2)

sounds like fun! Now can you send me some warmer temps without rain.Thanks Bobby

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

At least the stuff falling from the sky where you are isn't frozen... I just pulled my trans, bellhousing, and flywheel/clutch in snow... Funny how I put it in when it was snowing back in 06 and now I've yanked it in the same...

Anyways, as for the fuel pump, the Corvette fuel pump is known to be of better stuff (supposedly, anyways, I don't really understand why, but...) and it already flows for a V8, so pretty much anything you do to your V6 should be covered.

Bobby Suth

iTrader: (2)

spoke to soon,snow is on the way.I was raised in the north and live in the south.the cars live longer down here.

Bobby Suth

iTrader: (2)

ok,back at it again,jacked the little bird up and got it on some blocks.about how high do I need it to get the tank out?Which of the three wires do I put 12volts to in order to see if the pump will work from back here at the tank? I've been reading some of the other post about relays and pumps.If my car has not been run enuff to bring up any oil presure,Should my fule pump send fuel anyhow,Or will the ecm hold the pump from working untill there is oil presure?Ive only turn the motor over a little to make sure we had that part hooked up right

Bobby Suth

iTrader: (2)

finaly got it up,weather ok.Fuel pump not ok.Put 12v to the gray hot black ground.Got a small spark at the battery.now this is at the pigtail where I disconected coming out of the body.Didn't cut any wires.Just put a male conector with a small hole in it.pluged right onto the end of the pin.Now comes the fun.dropping the tank!!!

//<86TA>\\

iTrader: (14)

when you drop the tank, make sure you have the car jacked up as high as you can safely get it. If you dont get it high enough, it will be much harder to pull the tank.

unbolt the brake line bracket at the body just before the flex line to the axle. If will let you drop the rear a bit further without damaging the lines.

and extra set of hands is helpful when guiding the tank and filler neck out of the car.

Maverick H1L

iTrader: (8)

Put the car up on the stands with the stands at max height on the frame just towards the nose of where the LCA's connect to the body. You'll have plenty of room. Remove the wheels if needed to get the rear lower. You'll also need to drop the track bar and brace and the exhaust off the hangers.

True.

Definitely... Had my tank supported by both hands pretty much empty and it took about 10 minutes of wiggling to get it out. I just hope the filler neck isn't bent .

copyfixr

iTrader: (3)

I need to do this to my son's car. Lots of good info here. As far as the pump is concerned, it sounds like I can use a v8 pump instead of the v6 pump. Is that correct? v8 pumps seem to be cheaper anyway. Can anyone recommend a good pump? Sorry if I hijacked the thread.

Bobby Suth

iTrader: (2)

now that was tuff!I had the stands in place and as I got the tracking bar off,started to lower the rearend with the springs still in and stabelizer bar hooked up,shocks unhooked and the rearend started to rollover on.The springs both put pressure on the back side with nothing to keep it upright.Had to throw anothere bottle jack under the tracking barmount on drivers side and ease two down together.I didn't have the car up high enuff and didn't disconect the stablizer bar.that is probly why I fought for 2 hours to get the tank out. I think I may have bent the filler neck some. The last 2 inches was where I had my trouble.There is a 1 inch lip on the body that the filler neck would hang up on.with the tank out I will grind that bad boy down a fuzz.I didn't think to release the e-cable,there are a few things I probly could have done to get the rear down further.It's out now.The big thing I learned is take the pressure off the springs before disconecting the shocks or tracking bar or somthing like that. Don't think I did major damage to the filler neck. I think I can fix that as I istall it. I hope!

Gumby

Now let just hope ya do everything right and don't have to take it all back apart again

Bobby Suth

iTrader: (2)

Don't laugh Gumby,I been sort of busy with work and just got back to checking out the fuel pump I put in the 86 bird.I thought I could hear it run when I put the 12v to the terminals under the dash..Hot top right and ground bottom left.I got no fuel flow.Put 5 gal fresh fuel in it before I tryed.So I took the battery back to the rear of the car and disconected the harness again and put 12v back there.hot to gray and ground to blk.not a peep!no fuel anywhere.I still got the lines disconected in the motor bay.Yes the battery has fire.Why do people replace the whole sending unit?I'm sure I hooked the new pump up right.from the enterys I read over top right is ground and bottom left is hot.Could I have messed my new pump up doing it the other way around?

Gumby

Well just drop the tank again, its so much easier then an access hole