here are all my ideas for my 2.8.
1.K@N air filter(already have)
2.ram air/cold air induction
3.flowmaster 40 series exhaust(being installed as i type)
4.power chip
5.power pulleys
6.casper electronics throttle response calibrator
7.flexalite fan
8.catco high flow cat
9.3.4 liter pacesetter headers
10.engine bore
11.compucam cam, rockers, ect.
12.3 angle valve job
13.port and polished plenum
14.fiero throttle body
15.hurst short throw
16.MSD ignition
17.3.1 liter crank and pistons
18.accel distributor
19.ac delco rapid fires and bosch wires (have em)
20.new magnum altenator
21.new GM PP fuel pump
22.3.23 or 4.11 gears(dont know, i have 3.73)
23.redline oils
24.fiero supercharger or a 75 shot of NOS

if there is anything else please let me know . i hope to run a mid 15 without the NOS and a high to mid 14 with the NOS. opinions and suggestions wanted.

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1987 pontaic firebird
2.8 liter v6,5 speed, hurst shifter,rapid fire plugs,borg warner wires,160 degree thermo,K&N,polished plenum,custom exhaust,modded air box,american racing wheels,3"tach,autogauge gauges,run with no spare tire,grant challenger steering wheel,firebird floor mats

pics at:http://www.gatherround.com/u114277a116822passs.invt
then click on guest view under pic #5.

 

sorry i forgot, i also add weight saving mods like: no spare or jack and plan on getting a fiberglass hood. so tell me what u think of my ideas and my desired times.

 

Sounds great, just one question! Where are u gonna get that kinda of money?

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91 RS Camaro
3.1L
Cat Back System, K&N filter,modified air box, Fastchip Stage 2, 160 thermo, Rapidfires and Bosch Wires 5 Air Horns

Kills: 89' 302 Thunderbird, 88' 305 Cutless Supreme, 90' 3.8 Bonneville

My Car

 

Let me know how you like the 40 series Garmer brings up a very good point.

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My only mod: Flowmaster 40 series

 

I know I might make someone mad with this, but with all that money your going to spend why not just build a 350 and put a nice exhaust on it? It would probably be cheaper, and faster. That fiero SC is not worth it on a Camaro in my opinion, It cost too much in My opinion. I can understand wanting something different and if thats you Idea then so be it. I would consider tearing it all apart and having the Engine bluepeinted and putting nothing but Highend parts in it. Also have it bores as big as possible and put a longer stroke crank in it. Do LOTS of head work and get a good cam for it. Then get a custom PROM. MAke your own custom cold air and get a good exhaust and I would think you would find 14s easy.

 

I think 14's would be a lot easier than you think... How many of us have fresh 2.8's? Most are well over 150,000 miles on it.. Imagine a rebuild, 30 over, shaved heads, ported heads, crane cam, some 4.10 rear gears, shift kit, headers, exhaust LCA's, torque arm...

 

I am sick of why not just build a 350.. A 350 is not all that. Why would you want to go through a conversion like that and just have a 350? Be creative, if you do the swap, make it unique, like a 327, 335, 355, 383, 400, 454, 502 then toss it behind a 6 speed...Lets be honest people think camaro and associate it with 350.... No uniqueness there..

 

Sigh, thats the sad thing Brian. People think a Camaro is a V8...Period. They never came with 4 cylinders or V6s. Every time someone gets in my car the first thing they ask is "Do you have a V8?". And it gets old. I dunno bout you guys but Im quite happy with a V6...Especially a turboed one (or SCed)

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1992 Camaro RS 3.1L
T5 Manual 5 speed
Cold/RAM air intake
Z-28 Exhaust
8.5mm MSD Ignition wires
TB Coolant bypass

Soon to be a 3.8L turbo RS

AIM screen name - Stopsign696

Kills:

95 (****) Probe GT,94 Mustang GT,91 CRX (dont ask me why he raced me),2nd Gen Z28 (350) haha to you V8 guys!,1992 RS 305 TBI (good race),First Gen Integra, Old Escort LX
More to come

 

Brian, not ALL of us are going for the 350.. some of us really do want to be unique in or own not-so-unique respects.. My plans after the 305/THM-350 swap are for a T-56 and (gods willing on the audacity of this insane idea) an LS-1 or LS-6 stroked and (possibly twin) turbo'd.. I don't know how the LS will take to being turned into a 383, but be damned if I'm not going to try this out-there idea I'm trying to run with... and of course that 3.73 rear to make that 6-spd's 1st gear useless outside of doing donuts.. ;P

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'86 Camaro SC, black /w silver racing stripes
2.8l MPFI/700r4
Preparing for 305 LG3/THM-350 swap
MSD coil, Accel 8mm wires, SplitFire plugs, Gabriel hijackers

 

Oh waaaah...you guys and your unique V6s. Theres a reason the rest of us dont use SC 2.8s for racing, its because theyre not worth it. Put an ugly cam in a 350 and use dual Quads if you want to be unique. The only thing that 2.8 will give you is a headache. And I tell you what, you can tell me your 350 is a 427 small block and I wont even argue with you.

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91 RS W/carbed 350, Vortec heads, performer rpm, Comp cams Xtreme energy 226/230 duration and .477/.480 lift. BFG Drag radials. 3.42 posi,Corvette servoed 700r4, ****ty stock converter.
13.24@104

 

tip...take ur trash to some other board..we dont want it here.

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89 Firebird (AKA "Money")
2.8 V6 w/ t5 tranny (383 tpi t56 12/01)
Flowmaster 80 series, 3" Intermediate, SS Tips, Random Tech Cat, Msd Coil, MSD 6a, Accel 8.8 wires, Cold Air Intake w/ K&N, Lakewood LCA's, Brushed aluminum Hood pins ETC...
Next:
Spohn Torque Arm, Lakewood Panhard bar, BMR Fabrication Sub Frame connectors...
-------------------------
My Site:
www.geocities.com/firebird89white

" I'd rather run last in a full out race, than to NOT run at all ".

 

I have nothing against a fast V6. but honestly, why spend so much money on 2.8 that only runs 14's.....at least use a GN setup and join the 13's stock. Im not pickin a fight with anyone....just trying to show you that youre paying way too much for what youre getting out of it.

 

I dont think vortc is really flaming us, just pointing out it takes a lot of cash to hit 14's in our V6's, when we could buy a cheap pos and go 14's stock.

Now as far as being unique I think its great. It will be more expensive , but cool to see a 60/V6 in the 14's. As far as the 350 being boring, yes it is, but its dirt cheap to.I would prefer a 383 or something bigger, anything but a 350, but when your poor you have to take what you can get

 

This could go around and around, why don't import guys toss 6's in, why don't we toss an 8 in? Who cares, if you want to go 14's in a 2.8 I would look into NOS, Forged pistons, gears, suspension work and boom you are there.. Heck I am at 16 flat with no cam or any real special mods so I would bet 100HP of NOS would move me to alteast 15 Flat then if I built it right 14's would be there..I bet for under 2000

 

yeah but for 2Gs I went from mid 16s to near twelves without the use of juice.....just food for thought.

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91 RS W/carbed 350, Vortec heads, performer rpm, Comp cams Xtreme energy 226/230 duration and .477/.480 lift. BFG Drag radials. 3.42 posi,Corvette servoed 700r4, ****ty stock converter.
13.24@104

 

thats great, but you lost your fuel injection.

 

Whats so bad about losing fuel injection? YOu know a big problem with modifying the TPIs is because the dam intake set up is so expensive. All that Fuel injectio does is choke a modified motor. If I had carb stock I could go to any parts store and buy a great cam intake and carb combo from Eldelbrock and not have all the guess work. I dont see many NHRA or Nascar teams bitching because they dont use fuel injection, and I dont think any of them are having trouble making power.
I don't think a 350 is boring, and to the guy that said instead build a 355, what the hell do you think a 355 is? It is a .030" over 350, usually a rebuilt 350 will get this treatment. Look a 350 is cheap and its all in how you make it. Sure a stock 350 is boring, but thats just because it been in so many cars and had so many different applications. If you look under the Hood of my car you dont see "just another 350" you see a sweet *** looking polished TPI setup on top of a V8. For all you know it could be a 327, 350, 305(ya right), 383, 400, 0r a 427 small block. YOu cant tell from just looking.
Like I said I understand wanting to do something different. I said that in my original post, but I also just made the comment that it would be much easier with a carbed 350. You could hit 14's for under $1000 bucks. Maybe even High 13's if you buy the right 350 with some performance heads on it, like something from the early 70's late 60's or a TPI Corvette. Just buy a Holly or Eldelbrock packge for it and they almost hit 300hp.
I also wonder why import guys don't put 6's in theirs. If you could build up one of their V6's you start out with like 240hp. Like the Acura(really a Honda) MDX V6 makes 240hp and has low emissions rating, so if you take some of that damn emissions crap off and put a normal Cat on it I would say you could get like 260 out of it easy, or dare I talk about the Vtec V6 in the NSX?
You know I think building a Turbo 6 isnt all that great either in our cars. Ever since 89 I have seen these setups posting unbelievable times to the point that I am no longer impressed unless it is in the 11's because so many of them do it now.
So here is something to consider and what I always live by. It aint my car, it aint my money so do what you want. You asked me a question so you got my opinion. If you dont like it dont do it. 'Cause I ain't got to drive it.
So if you really want to put your money into getting a 2.8 into the 14's go for it, but there is easier ways to get you car into the 14's.
So anyways good luck in whatever you decid to do. I hope you reach your performance goals.

 

even though those ricers seem to have money flowing out of their a$$, i doubt they could afford to swap for any honda V6 except maybe the one they put in the accord which isn't great......actually i take that back. if ricers are stupid enough to pay over $200 for a crappy cold air intake,then they are stupid enough to pay around $5-6,000 for a jap V6(that's just for the motor...add labor, misc. parts....)

 

On the subject of carbs NASCAR has to much invested to toss it away and it is a shame cause it is a dead horse. Carbs have their place, but the future of the combustion engine is in Fuel Injection no Carbs... I know a 355 is a 30 over 350, but it is more uniqe than just a 350. And for 2000 you would get all the suspension goodies that would make the 6 out handle the 8 on a winding road...

 

So after you put as much money into a 2.8 to get it to run as fast as a stock 350TPI you think your going to put another $2000 into the suspension to out handle a V8 car. Man thats alot of money to play catch up. I would hope if you put $2000 into the suspension you would be able to handle as well as a new Vette.

 

First of all, if carbs are better than fuel inj. why are they old news? EVERY car manufacturer once used carburation, NOW they use fuel inj, because its more reliable and gets beter gas mileage and better emissions. Now as far as your NHRA stuff.........the carb can make as much power as a fuel inj, but these NHRA guys dont have to worry about emissions,gas mileage,reliability(they rebuild and retune after every run). Does it really matter that you yanked your carb off to gain .3 in the 1/4? So what? Your paying out your *** for gas now, and you have to mess with the stupid choke, and you cant just jump in and go you have to let it heat up on a cold morning. If you use your car for a toy, not daily driving,or its a full race car then go with a carb, but for daily driving I'll take the benefits of a fulie.

 

Thats not my point. I know fuel injection is better for an everyday driver, but if you look at the new carbs, they are a lot better than the old ones.
Emissions, and other controlls are the reason for fuel injection, not to make more HP. ANyways my main point is that it is cheaper to deal with a carb. I dont want to start a fight about the pros and cons of Carbs and FI. I love my TPI, I just wish it wasnt so dam expensive to buy an Intake manifold.

 

Kyle is right, building a high HP FI car is expensive, especiall TPI, because every part of the system is restrictive and needs to be replaced.

Damn cheap to make a carb engine faster. But, if you also want a reliable daily driver that runs smoothly and MUST meet emissions, you really don't have a choice.

As for NASCAR...those are the rules. Remember, the 57 Fuelie Chevies (Black Widows) were band by NASCAR because they blew everyone away. A carb makes it easy to install a restrictor plate and ensure a level playing field. NASCAR really should drop the words "stock car" from their name. I still like the old days when the manufacturers had to actually produce the car that was racing. But this just brought one "cheater" cars. Ford never produced a 429 Talledega or Mercury Cyclone for sale. The only car they ever offered the Boss 429 was in the Mustang, and Talledegas (which you never saw in a showroom) only had CJ 428s.

 

:: Golf Clap :: sorry it was good


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Dont Race Cops apparently you cant do that! -Dellz

 

Sounds like a good plan, Kernel!

For the fuel pump though, you might want to look into a TPI fuel pump. Altho both the MPFI and TPI fuel pumps hold the same max pressure, the stock GM TPI fuel pump flows more. Edelbrock also makes a hi-po TPI pump, which might flow more than the GM stock one! I don't know how this would affect a motor that didn't -need- it, though.

Also consider sending your injectors out to Rich Jensen at http://www.cruzinperformance.com - he's a great guy to talk with, and very helpful. I sent him my spare set of 2.8 injectors for a cleaning & flow-testing, and noticed one helluva difference when I installed them! Rich took the time to clean them up so they flowed within 2% of each other.

Did you think about a http://www.centerforce.com clutch?

There shouldn't be a reason for the flexalite fan; the stock one is good for our v6's. You could rig up a fan switch for cheap.


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-Tom P (Hot rodded 1986 Firebird 2.8l) from http://www.f-body.net/mailbag/3rd/3rd_mailbag.html message boards
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