I was wondering if I can get a new L03 replacement engine from GM when it comes time to replace my current engine. I don't want to swap in a 350 because of the expense (new computer, wiring harnesses etc...) I looked in Jegs and Summit catalogs and saw the various 350 conversion kits which costs from $500 to $900 depending on if you want their new computer or just the wiring harness. Does any company offer a "High Output" L03 upgrade!? I posted this here because I wanted opinions from the tbi guys.
Thanks
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"91" RS, 305 tbi, 5spd, Slp Y-pipe, Random tech Cat, Flowmaster crossflow, Ultimate tbi mods, Edelbrock open element with Summit flat base with 3" K&N, Taylor Spiro Pro wires, Redline water wetter, 180* thermostat.

[This message has been edited by GKK (edited October 16, 2001).]

 

I don't see why you'd need a new computer and/or harness... Maybe bigger injectors and a 350cid PROM, but that's pretty cheap. Everyting else is the same... You could even "get by" with just a FP increase for a while, if you have to...

 

ya its called a L05. http://www.sdpc2000.com/cart.asp?act...id=128&pid=105

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-Tas
'89 Formula WS.6

Got Beach?

 

Above posts are right. The cheapest easiest 350 is the L05 for a Caprice and put knock sensor (which should be replaced with new motor anyway), 350 injectors and GM chip for a 89 Caprice 350 and you will pick up an instant 50hp and have a nice car that gets the same gas mileage your used to. $200 premium at best. 50hp for $200 isn't bad. Minimal other work and you could get that number to 100hp.

[This message has been edited by brharris27370 (edited October 16, 2001).]

 

If I put the 350 shortblock in, would I be able to use the stock intake manifold? Also, are the stock tb injectors able to provide enough fuel or will the computer compensate for that. I'm assuming everything I have now (emission tubes, alternator/ac brackets, sensors etc...) will be able to bolt right up to the 350 block and heads? Has anyone actually done this conversion so I could get an actual expectation of problems or conflicts? I don't want to bring my car in and find out something won't fit right or it won't pass emissions.

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"91" RS, 305 tbi, 5spd, Slp Y-pipe, Random tech Cat, Flowmaster crossflow, Ultimate tbi mods, Edelbrock open element with Summit flat base with 3" K&N, Taylor Spiro Pro wires, Redline water wetter, 180* thermostat.

[This message has been edited by GKK (edited October 16, 2001).]

 

Yes, if you installed a 350 shortblock, the stock heads and intake will bolt right up. All emissions related equipment should hook up fine and remain functional. You will have to change the knock sensor to a 350 knock sensor. Basically everything should fit. As far as needing a new computer or wiring harness, you won't need to worry with that.

However you'll need custom programming or a 350 chip to make things work. If you get the 350 chip, you'll need 350 injectors, as the chip is setup for the 350 injectors. If you get a custom chip, it can be set up to use whatever injectors you want.

As far as the injectors supplying enough fuel, that's not so hard to answer. If the engine has 45 lb injectors, that's good for about 180-200 horsepower. If it has 55 lb injectors, they're good for about 220-245 horsepower. These numbers are assuming you're not running a supercharger or turbocharger.

The only difference between small block displacements is the bore and stroke. 305s and 350s have the same stroke, so the 350 just has a bigger bore and bigger pistons. If you want more info on difference between Gen I blocks, just say so.

As far as emissions, I couldn't tell you. Since you live in California, I can't really help you. If you were doing the swap in Virginia, I would feel confident that you'd pass emissions, but I don't know how california operates.

I hope this helps, need any more info then just ask,

Jason

 

Jason, So if I get the 350 short block then all I would have to buy is a 350 Knock sensor, 350 computer chip and 350 #55 tb injectors to make everything work right? Also, will the stock 350 exhaust manifolds bolt up the same as my 305's? How much do you think it'll cost to have everything done (engine installed) just a ballpark figure. Thanks for the info.

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"91" RS, 305 tbi, 5spd, Slp Y-pipe, Random tech Cat, Flowmaster crossflow, Ultimate tbi mods, Edelbrock open element with Summit flat base with 3" K&N, Taylor Spiro Pro wires, Redline water wetter, 180* thermostat.

[This message has been edited by GKK (edited October 16, 2001).]

[This message has been edited by GKK (edited October 16, 2001).]

 

that Lo5 is a longblock. Shortblocks don't have the heads on em.

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-Tas
'89 Formula WS.6

Got Beach?

 

If I swap in a 350 long block, how much extra hp will my camaro have? Is it worth the trouble or should I just put in a new 305 long block with an Lt1 cam? I like the performance of the car now but, since I'm going to change engines just wanted to know what the best deal would be, long block 350 or long block 305 with an LT1 cam or 1.6 Lifters?

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"91" RS, 305 tbi, 5spd, Slp Y-pipe, Random tech Cat, Flowmaster crossflow, Ultimate tbi mods, Edelbrock open element with Summit flat base with 3" K&N, Taylor Spiro Pro wires, Redline water wetter, 180* thermostat.

[This message has been edited by GKK (edited October 16, 2001).]

[This message has been edited by GKK (edited October 16, 2001).]

 

L05 with LT1 cam

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-Tas
'89 Formula WS.6

Got Beach?

 

I agree L05 with LT1 Cam. Put the 350 in long block in now. You will have more options later when you want to do mods. You can get the whole 350 TBI unit on ebay for less than the cost of one 350 injector at the autoparts store. Not much demand for stock 350 TBI. Everybody is looking for the 454 TBI's. Your intake will be OK. No performance added there but will work just fine. Not sure on the cost of the knock sensor but I don't think its an expensive sensor. The 350 Caprice cop car chip is like $35 from the dealer. Paceparts.com or Scoggin Dickey should be able to get that chip for you too. Sometimes the local GM service dept isn't too helpful. If you run headers and high flow cat and catback system that L05 will run very well in your car without eating your wallet up too bad. Not any more than the L03. New L03 isn't any cheaper than new L05 and is harder to get since no one goes that route.

 

If you put the Lt1 cam in the L05 while your at it. You should have a VERY nice running little 350 for low $$.

 

I wonder what stock horsepower that engine gets? With an lt1 cam and the works, would it make 300 hp?

How do they ship an engine to your house? Aren't they heavy?

Tas, you rule. that's what I've been looking for as a replacement that doesn't need much custom work. But tell me again how taking that little metal piece out of the Formula hood makes it functional. Even with an open element, I just don't think that forces much air nto the intake.

 

Its not going to force air in the hood like a frontal ram air or a cowl hood would, but it lets the underhood heat escape, and the open element is right next to the opening so it can breathe some nice cold air.

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-Tas
'89 Formula WS.6

Got Beach?

 

Why get a regular L05, when you can get a High Output L05?

http://www.sdpc2000.com/cart.asp?act...d=689&pid=1061

I also had them swap in a hotter cam and 1.6 RR's. Should make 300-325 horsepower. Cost was $3100 with above, delivered. It is as straight forward a swap as you'll find.

[This message has been edited by RED92 (edited October 17, 2001).]

[This message has been edited by RED92 (edited October 17, 2001).]

 

GKK,

First I couldn't tell you whether the 350 exhaust manifolds would bolt right up, I see no problem with using your 305 manifolds, or just going ahead and put emissions legal headers on if your budget allows.

If you buy a short block, you'll be able to reuse your intake, but probably not your 305 heads. The 305 heads have small combustion chambers and will increase compression ratio considerably on most 350 short blocks you'll find. You could probably find a short block to work with the 305 heads if you really wanted to, but it'd be easier just to buy the long block.

With the long block you'll get a short block, plus a cam, lifters, pushrods, and most importantly, heads that will work the pistons.

I'd say buy a long block if you can, throw a 350 knock sensor in there along with a computer chip designed for that engine (ie get a 350 Caprice replacement engine and then find a 350 Caprice chip), get some bigger injectors to work with that program and everything should be set.

The only other thing I'd be concerned about is that the computer chip you find will have the same emissions system written in to it. For example your car uses EGR and AIR injection, make sure the chip you get comes from a car that had these systems on it. If you can't find a chip to work, there's always the possibility of a custom chip. To my knowledge, most places will do a custom chip for $300.

Basically find a long block, find a chip for that long block, make sure the chip has provisions for your emissions systems, if it doesn't than get a custom chip, put your stock 305 intake on, 305 exhaust manifolds or headers, put on the 350 injectors, put on the 350 knock sensor, and you should be set.

If anybody sees anything I missed, please point it out.

Jason

 

Bone stock L05 is 210hp. I doubt you will see any more than 240hp with lt1 cam. Replace the intake, headers and full exhaust probably 275hp max. But that is a solid 100hp more than a stock L03 Camaro. Reasonable cost for that 100hp too.
$1435 engine
$200 edelbrock TBI intake
$35 Caprice 350 chip
$350 headers
$100 Cat
$200 cat back
$50 LT1 Cam
$50 for Ebay 350 TBI unit with injectors
$50 350 Knock sensor
$100 misc

Total so far $2370

shipping and unexpected $300
Brings total to $2670 not bad for a BRAND new engine capable of running another 100+K trouble free miles and producing far more horsepower than the stock TBI Camaro did.

Have to look at everything not just the bare cost of the motor. No matter what engine you buy you are going to need most of those add ons.

They ship that engine on a pallet through a trucking company. Usually costs around $100 - $150 to ship.

 

Thanx Harris,

I have $3000 on my visa that I just paid off specifically for a new engine. The A/C compressor on my lo3 is new, I'm hoping I can use it.

 

You should just order the 350 Crate
motor from GM performance parts.. thats
just a drop in replacement motor for
the L03 305 385HP motor.. comes with all kinds of goodies on it..

 

Sounds expensive. Also, will it still be smog legal?

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"91" RS, 305 tbi, 5spd, Slp Y-pipe, Random tech Cat, Flowmaster crossflow, Ultimate tbi mods, Edelbrock open element with Summit flat base with 3" K&N, Taylor Spiro Pro wires, Redline water wetter, 180* thermostat.

 

Really, so the LO5 seems like a good value replacement. I'd like to go that direction also, but want to know about the LT-1 cam. Is it really that easy to find? Do you guys know of anywhere to get one besides the local wrecking yard? Also what are the specs on the cam, wouldn't a good comp cam of equal specs work also? (albeit more expensive)And it pretty much a straight up replacement? Can use the stock wiring harness from the 305, just new chip, injectors and knock? Sounds too good to be true! Thanks guys.

 

I have two of the LT1 cams laying around. So they are easy to find. I have one in the classified section. Bought 3 cams in a bundle and going to use 2. The AC will work just fine on the 350. The accessory brackets bolt on just the same. Smog crap too if you want. Nice emission legal. No one could tell the difference looking at the 2 in the car. Just at the stop light when that TBI starts whoopin up on some stangs.

Another possibility for those guys who don't mind boltin on some heads.

L98 Corvette 350 shortblock from Scoggin Dickey is $1185
with a set of World class SR torquer 350 heads +$800
Same everything else and should give you right around 300hp for just a $400 premium.