I found this on Iroc zone. As they say a picture is worth a thousand words. Man, this really got the point across to me. I've read many posts from people saying that you shouldn't do anything to a 3rd gen until you put in SFC's, but I really didn't listen until now.

I'm calling Alston on Monday and putting the headers, cam, and ANYTHING else on hold except putting gas in the tank until I get SFC's in my car.

Edit:

Ok, can't seem to make the link take you to the tech article page on IROC zone, so here are the pics I "stole" from them.

If you want to read what the guy says about the SFC's, use the link and then go to the tech articles.

http://www.iroczone.com/techartsfcs.html

 

Hmm my car will do the same, has the alstons.

 

yea ive seen pictures like that before awhile ago, the sfc are on my list on things still to get just need the time and money.

 

Ditto...seen those b4, but I sure wish I had installed SFCs sooner than a few of my other mods...but being able to stop IS important.

Ed

 

it is so true, i actualy have just PARKED my car on uneven surfaces, and had 1 tire off the gound. they really do stiffen things up, and the diffrence in driving the car before and after is like night and day.

 

LoL, wish my car looked like that when I got it on jack stands! The frame shure can twist! No matter what I did I couldn't get the left and right sides to get level. Musta been the uneven ground there. Oh well.

*makes sure that SFC's are the first mod he ever does.

 

Well I just ordered my alston SFC's. $189 plus $13 for UPS gound. They are in stock and will ship today. I also had a nice chat with the guy also. Sounds like it was the owner. He asked me where I found out about his SFC's and I told him TGO. We also talked about the design of the SFC's. I told him I own a machine shop and could probably make these myself since I know companies that have CNC benders, but the time to get the first set right would be prohibitive. He told me he went through 12 different revisions on these to get them to fit like he wanted. Anyway, just some tivial info for all of you about SFC's and the work that goes into designing them.

I think I will bolt them in first, make a few extra parts to tie the rocker panels to the connectors, and possibly install some tabs for a crossmember to use as a driveshaft safety loop, or in the future a mount for a different torque arm. I'm sure if I do put a crossmember in it will help tie the car together that much more. Anyway, now I have to find someone to weld them in for me.

On the subject of chassis stiffness, I have a freind that's an engineer and is a "hired gun" for aircraft companies and race car teams. He tells me that a roll cage in a full on tube frame car is not primarily designed to be a roll cage. It's primary function is to make the car chassis as rigid as possible. The secondary function is that of a roll cage. You can't predict flex in a chassis to a fine enough point, so you the theory is to make the chassis in a car as stiff as possible, then use the suspension to make the car handle. He tells me that the one exception to this rule is a top fuel dragster. They design flex into the chassis on purpose, but this is a special application.

 

i seen those pics!!

 

that's my car in those pics from around 2 years ago. The originally copy of that article is on my site at www.poorformance.net. I let Allan from iroczone put up the article too.

the sfc's are definitely some of the best money i've spent on my car to date. I wouldn't want to live without them on a hardtop, and i think people are nuts to not have them on t top cars and convertibles.

btw, empire motorsports, who i bought my sfc's from is out of business. I've seen a few spohn installs though, and I highly recommend the stuff vs anything else i've seen to date.

 

Subframe connectors should be installed on most any third-gen. However:
" This "torture test" would have bent a normal framed Third Gen into a pretzel and completely destroyed the car, but mine's 100% (and then some). Go buy some SFC's!"
is a little bit far fetched. Many times I've seen and jacked up a third-gen and had an extra wheel come off the ground--it was always the ones with the fat sway bars. Example, third-gen car comes in with a flat on the left front. Jack up the left front with a floor jack and the left rear also comes off the ground. All without subframe connectors. This 'torture test' is no more harmful that driving up into a steep driveway at an angle, which puts my 82 on 2 wheels--opposite corners--everytime(even before the subframe connectors were installed).

 

Thewraith-

Considering there is so much talk about SFC's on TGO, I'd love to see your article posted here as a tech article fro easy access. Weeks or months from now it will be hard to find this thread and the link to your site. So since you are the "owner" of the article, would you be willing to ask TGO to put it up as a tech article? I've got space on my server to host it if you like.

Anyway I did want to thank you for the pics and article. You are the one that finally made me decide to get SFC's. Only problem is that SFC's put me into C-Mod in SCCA solo II. That's a big jump from F-stock!! Oh well, that's ok. I'm just out for the fun of it this time.


Thanks-Dan

 

Yes, even thought I do plan subframe connectors in the near future, I have jacked up my car and had 3 wheels come off of the ground without them although the t-top cars seem to be a different story.

Ben

 

you guys are right about the exaggeration of the whole pretzel bit, it's not like they're made of rubber before, but it does flex, and over time it will start cracking the frame as well...i wouldn't jack up a car without sfc's the way i did in that picture, because it will take it's toll over time.

you want a good test? jack up the car on one side mid-way between the front and rear wheel with a jacking point as far outward toward your side of the car as possible. ok, got it? now open up the drivers door. having a little trouble? i don't :lala:

and as for hosting the article here, i'd only allow that if it was hosted on my site poorformance.net, or if it linked to my site at the very least. You'll notice iroczone does link to me. If i'm gonna write tech articles that a lot of people are going to use, i'm gonna at least get some free advertising out of it.

FYI, there are something like 9 tech articles on my site overall, and they are generally pretty useful information that i had to learn the hard way.

 

Actually my car door opens fine like that suprisingly. My friend with t-tops however is a different story. I want to get sfcs on mine soon because mine doesnt have big cracks at the top corner of the doors like so many I see, but if you look real close they are trying to start at least on one side. I want to prevent those from growing.

Ben

 

Was it 89 or 189? On their site it shows $89 for weld in subframe connectors for 82-92.

Ben

 

The $89 weld in bars are completely different I'm told. From what I read, it seems like everone recomends getting the $189 bolt in bars and then welding them in. From the pics that were posted of the Alston's SFC's done that way, it sold me on the recomendation. They look great installed.

My SFC's were shipped from Alston last week. Now I've just got to find someone to weld them in for me.

By the way, the shipping on the Alston SFC's was $13 for ground.

 

I couldnt find the ones you got on their site. What do their weld in ones look like do you know? I also noticed that they have a setup that is supposed to go from front to back and tie into a cage, but it was a lot more expensive than that. Does anone know if they will work along with the ssm subframe connectors?

Ben

 

Here is a link to the Alson web page where the SFC's are listed.

http://www.alstonracing.com:8080/catalog.agent

After you get there click on "bolt on products". It's under the GM listing. Part#102411.

 

The only subframe connectors I find there are the 89 dollar ones and the 280 dollar subframe kits which arent really connectors but run from front to back.

Ben

 

Oh, I found them. Does anyone know where/how the weld ins that they sell mount. Do they mount like others instead of how their weld ins do?

Ben