Kingtal0n

Heres whats on the top of the compressor housing:
79-04000

on the bottom (outlet port) it has
Mitsubishi
15253

What is it? I have two of them. well, if they are big enough I will have them, right now im barrowing them to see what they are (owner has no idea)

Kingtal0n

another

bad_turbo

look like the old Syclone turbo.

83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

looks like a 17C... could be any of the medium/large mitsu turbos used on cars...

Kingtal0n

one guy said it looked like a 13G turbo with an upgraded compressor wheel, and a changed exhaust housing..


another guy said no way thats not a 13g from any eclipse hes ever seen, it must be a 20g or 16g turbo or something.

another guy said its a factory but rebuilt turbo from a non-eclipse mitsubishi

the original owner of these that had them rebuilt was planning on putting them both onto a 383 cubic inch mopar motor. i have the stainless mopar headers with them, too. I still cant find an absolute answer on what they are though...

TurboedTPI

Looks just like the turbo on my friends typhoon. I think its a 20g, but not sure.

Kingtal0n

Check this out:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...sPageName=WDVW

looks just like mine... I wonder if thats what they are? But one question, these say Mitsubishi, do syclone turbos also say mitsubishi?

KiLLJ0Y

i had a typhoon.. and i know its not that, the typhoon/Syclone turbo's were wet turbo's meaning they had oil and coolant running in them, also the mounting on that turbo is different. the previous owner could have swapped a part or 2 on that, but if i had to guess i would say it was from a pre 93 eclipse.

Kingtal0n

The gentle man at PSI racing identified it today as a Syclone Turbo, as well as at Force Fuel Injection. They DO have water and oil capacity. I picked them both up for $300 they are already rebuilt

breakthelawinaz

yeah it definately is a td06 20G just like the i have, one of those will not be enough for a stock l98 will they, i got one from a friend that owed me money and its almost like new, and i wondered if i could make it work on my car with low boost like 4-5 lbs until i can afford the 60-1? i cant think that it would be too small if i didnt push it really hard they also came on the mitu fuso trucks...

*eric*

breakthelawinaz

did anyone else notice this but dosent that turbo look like it was welded on the compressor housing elbow or what ever you call that, i guess it could also could be called the compressor outlet... but anyway did anyone else notice that? sorry justy being obsertivitive...

*eric*

breakthelawinaz

sorry double post... moderators delete if you feel necessary...

*eric*

83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

Um, you guys know that the 17C is the stock sy/ty turbo, I don't know what a 20G is stock on, I would guess some heavy equipment or a medium duty truck?

Kingtal0n

Yes the previous owner had an elbow welded to both of these turbos to aim them at the intake.

I have two of them, and two of them, acording to PSI racing who has used these turbos before should be good for up to 800 horsepower considering each of them puts out 6XX CFM

I will beginning the Twin turbo project on my car in about a week, im using cast L98 manifolds to mount them to (copying someone elses idea) removing my A/C and using steel bends to run the intake system, and a stainless downpipe followed by steel exhaust back on both sides. im leaving right now to pick up gas for the mig and the proper sized wire to get this thing going. the flange will also be stainless to prevent warping / cracking.

83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

I'm not sure who PSI racing is or what they've run them on, but in a relatively low boost setup they will not flow enough air to make 800 hp. The efficient range of their maps doesn't get that broad till well over a PR of 2.0 or 2.5.

Right size wire – like I said before, depends on your welder… you still haven't told me what you have
Right wire – depends… for most mild steel to stainless that's probably 309. I use 308 (not as good but it's usually hard to find 309), mild to mild, ER70S6. Welding to the casting... well, I haven't actually tried to weld to 3rd gen manifolds, but I've welded a few other castings... _usually_ you can get away with the mild steel wire, but not always. Generally, the safe answer is something like 309, or any high nickel wire, the stuff sold specifically for welding cast pieces is very similar to inconel wire/rod.
Right gas – C25 is usually the best compromise, if you're welding mostly stainless then I'd consider a bottle of tri-mix.

I'm hoping that you're not taking the advice of the shop that originally gave you info, since where you started after you talked to them was way off…

WRT to the flange, stainless will be harder to cut and will be more likely to warp. Look around, you'll notice that most stainless headers actually use mild steel flanges for that reason.

Kingtal0n

Ok thats good info; im talking to a welding supply shop, im going to be renting an argon/Co2 mix from them for $20 for 3 months, and using a .030 solid Mig wire to do the entire system of both exhaust and intake.

For the flange to Manifold it will be heated with a torch, then welded. the flange is mild steel like you said, the manifolds i assume are cast iron or a low grade steel like you said.

for the downpipe to the exhaust, i will probably use a stainless collector, to minimize the warping and rusting, good idea?? or aluminized steel, not sure which yet. what do you recommend? after that collectors it will all be aluminized steel (regular exaust)

For the intake side, im going to fab it all from the same steel as the exhaust. the stuff is cheap enough, and i can get any mandrel bend i want for like $4-$12 / foot from this local shop (miami muffler)

I need to find an intercooler, and soon, if im going to plumb it up right. ah, i need to find a BOV also really soon. i was gonna plumb it right before the intake, but if i cant get one big enough then maybe 2 small ones from who knows where?

Kingtal0n

Update on the intercooler and BOV scenario;

Im probably going to use 2X eclipse DSM intercooler, they have the right inlet and outlet and appear to hold 300~ horsepower each (20+ psi of boost) so they should work i assume... suggestions? they are under $50 a piece which is what im looking for.

for the BOV's probably 1stgen DSM eclipse, they are $15/each used and hold 18PSI max, i will be running 12 through these intercoolers so no biggy. they probably flow a little less than I will need but i have an auto which should help loads, and worst comes to worst i just run 2 of these per side

anyways, i think that solves THOSE problems.

83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

so in 6 months you'll pay about the same as you would to refill an 80 bottle… you'll probably use an 80 for 2-3 years unless you have it leak out by mistake…

.030" is usually the preferred size for medium size welders (sorta the top end of what you'd find in a small shop/home). .023/.024/.025" is what most of the 110V welders are happiest with. Really, in most cases I prefer the smaller wire, but the 308 that I use is .030 or .035 since that was all I could find at the time. Works well but you have to go REALLY fast on exhaust parts.

I'm not sure what you mean by a stainless collector after the turbo… do you mean a collector flange? After the turbo it doesn't really matter much what the stuff is made of, since it doesn't see as much heat. I'd go stainless if you want it to last forever and mild steel if you don't care that much (real world, mild steel will last just about forever in a lot of areas. Here in the DC metro area I've got a set of headman headers that were put on a car in '92, uncoated… that have a nice layer of rust but they're still solid, no rust through… DC doesn't see as much salt on the streets as someplace in the rustbelt, but it's worst them most other places with similar temps since it's basically a swamp on the ocean).

BTW, you tried to PM me… I cleaned out my inbox, or just email me.

breakthelawinaz

my TD06 20G was off of a mitsubishi fuso, its a big ugly truck...

*eric*

Kingtal0n

What do you mean about the tank? I dont have a bottle, they want like $180 here for a bottle. If i had one i would just get it filled. I only want to rent one for 3-4 months, and $6/mo isnt that bad is it?


I PMed you about the material of the manifolds. Im just going to assume they are cast iron, when i get them ill clean em up real good.

Kingtal0n

Crossfire, Its interesting you mention that because both times these turbos were identified, I was told they are 20g turbos. Now both people ALSO said they were syclone turbos. syclone came with the TD06-17C turbo like you said, not a 20G.
These have obviouselly been rebuilt, they were never run. Is it possible the compressor turbine had been upgraded to a 20g? I cant even find the part number on the turbos from syty.org, so im just in the dark about what these things REALLY are.

theres still a cookie up for grabs!

bad_turbo

you just take off the comp cover and measure the wheel. the only way to know for sure.

Kingtal0n

Let me ask a stupid question; if the turbo was (or even could be) upgraded from 17C to 20G turbo, could that be done with the same compressor housing? Assuming it can, i thought you could only fit a certain size wheel into the housing? which means if it was upgraded then it would be the same size? I know im wrong, but where?

bad_turbo

Not real sure about upgrading a 17c to a 20g. I know at T-netics they used to upgrade 17g to 20g's all the time. You just have to carve the housing a little bigger. Not hard for a shop to do. Most guys I know that had Syclones, would just get rid of their stock turbo altogether and replace it with a hybrid or even bigger. I've seen several 60-70mm turbos on Syclones. I even helped put a twin ball bearing 80mm turbo on one, that was a street car. Anything is possible with enough $$$.

83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

You'd have to put the compressor housing on a lathe and machine it to fit the shape of the larger wheel. As long as the major diameter of the compressor wheel will fit entirely inside the diffuser assembly it should work.

The reason that most of the sy/ty guys just change to a different turbo rather then upgrading is the simple fact that the T3 and T04 turbos have pretty much been the standard in the performance world for years and that you can often find a T whatever for cheaper and make everything else fit then you could upgrade the mitsu turbo. Parts are available to make some killer mitsu hybrids, but I don't know of anyplace that you can get them new for what I would consider a reasonable price.

bad_turbo

Yes, you have to carve the housing to match the contour of the larger wheel. Its kind of tricky, but most "good" turbo shops can do it. Some even have their CNC machines programmed with the different wheels to do the hard work. It is possible to put a wheel in a compressor housing that the diffuser is smaller than the inducer on the wheel, but it requires the diffuser to be machined off and a larger piece of aluminum welded on and carved to fit the larger wheel. Had to do this a few times . Not easy or cheap.

BadBowtie88

You must love your job...

bad_turbo

Not really. I'm a truck driver in southern california traffic!

BadBowtie88

Ouch! I can't even imagine what that's like.

Omega

iTrader: (1)

The elbow has been added so that it will be a direct fit for a 2G DSM. It isn't a T25,16G,20G.. the compressor fins are different.

Kingtal0n

Actually the guy from StTy.Org indicates that they ARE 20G turbos, not 17C turbos, and that they ARE from syclone..

The elbows were added to point the outlets towards the front of the V8 motor, not for a 2G DSM or whatever. the previous owner was putting these on his 383 mopar motor.

Omega

iTrader: (1)

The 2G DSM's need the outlet to face that way, that is all I am saying. I have also not seen that style compressor wheel in very many turbo's.. I believe that is an older style. It doesn't mean that I am not wrong, just my experience.

Kingtal0n

Oh no, im not even saying your wrong, im just getting information from 999 other people that this is this and that is that... Just adding information that i was given. for all I know the outlet was done that way to promote heat buildup or somethin dumb. (why would you want that? I dont know but it fits what some people are telling me...)

In other news im probably going to try to find a set of T3's in a smaller package or just throw these on for now, according to the compressor maps (supplied by crossfire! thanks crossfire!) these are efficient in the 1.7-1.9 PR (like he said to begin with...) so im not sure if I want to run 10PSI of boost right off the bat with this thing..

Omega

iTrader: (1)

Never heard of the outlet being changes for heat issues. I know the DSM guys like that type because it saves them from buying a j-pipe and some stupid hoses and stuff. I beleive it is purely an installation mod.. although It does look to make the air have to do a weird bend really quick.

Kingtal0n

I mapped out my motor on boost with the compressor map using a formula from http://cybrina.mine.nu/MR2_Docs/comp..._flow_maps.htm

this is what i came up with:

Kingtal0n

I've got some progress pics... Ill probably start a new post for this though. So far on the turbos the concess is that they are 17C or 20G turbos. I suppose Ill never REALLY know, but hey who cares at this point! So no one gets a cookie... And I'd eat it but its stale now...

If anyone cares the L98 manifolds turned out to be cast STEEL, not IRON. using a Cast/Nickel Rod for the Arc weld turned out the be the best/strongest solution. no pre-heat, air cool down. no peening. came out nice, heres a pic of the blocked off factory outlet.

Kingtal0n

UPDATE:

Pulled off the comressor housing and measured the wheel inside. It is 2.98" Wide at the widest lowest point. Does that tell anyone anything?

ThePr0

Here's my 19c mitsu for comparison... wheel seems similar

http://66.68.37.214/web/img/quest_pr...l_like_new.jpg

Kingtal0n

Yes they look identical actually, do you have any measurements of the exducer or do you have a compressor map for it?

ThePr0

exducer size 2.680

i dont have a compressor map but i know it makes 550cfm at 15psi and ive been told its good for 380hp