Attn: Vader, GGA, zroc etc.
03-16-2002, 10:57 AM
#1
Attn: Vader, GGA, zroc etc.
Hey guys,
As suggested by Vader I'm starting a new thread on the saga of the stubborn Iroc.
The first thread was located here: https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...threadid=80231
And the previous one was located here: https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...414#post569414
Here is a brief run down of what has been going on, for new readers/participants:
* Last fall a bunch of mods were added to the stock 305TPI. The mods are all in the sig, and included: heads, cam, runners, headers, cat-back and some other minor mods.
* When the car was started in late November it ran decently, but not as strong as expected.
* The car was very difficult to start when cold and would not idle at all. However, once it warmed up to normal operating temperature, it ran "fine".
* While going over all the plugs to clean them, it was found that the rear pass. side plug was physically faulty in that it would not seat right, thus was leaking.
* The car ran better and stronger once the plug was replaced and thus sealed right.
* The car ran better, but still would not idle, even though it seemed to start somewhat easier.
* It was not possible to set the idle speed at this time, as it just would not run at a steady RPM, almost no matter how high it was - it HAD to be constantly varied in order for it to run.
* Got error codes for low voltage on ign module on a regular basis.
* Replaced the ign module - but no difference.
* The TPS could NOT be adjusted within specs. It was impossible to get it over 4V at WOT
* The TPS was replaced but to no avail.
* The ECM was then changed and that fixed the voltage problem and the TPS problem - guesses are that the 5v regulator was bad, or that possibly the old one was okay but needed to be re-seated.
* It was suggested to start looking for vaccuum leaks, and sure enough - there was one on the rear drivers side intake/runner gasket.
* The gasket was replaced, the timing was bumped from the 9°'s that it had been at all along to 15°'s - and the car started and ran stronger than it had EVER done.
* At this point everything was fine, except the idle was a bit too high, and it would take a very long time for it to slow down from about 1600 rpm to eventually 1100rpms at warm idle.
* As it was difficult to get the idle set correct, it was suggested to clean the IAC and the IAC passages. So, the throttlebody was removed and the IAC taken out for cleaning. It was very dirty, as were the passages and the inside of the TB. It was all cleaned thoroughly with carb cleaner.
* Everything was reassembled and the the timing set down to the stock setting of 6°s. The car now ran as total crap, and kept popping and shooting in the exhaust. I tried to bump the timing up again but no luck. The car got gradually worse, and I was getting worried driving with it like that, and eventually it simply did not start at all.
* The last things I did last weekend was to use a different set of plug wires (didn't help), Cleaned out the plugs as they were wet from trying to start (didn't help), Replaced the ign. module with the previous one that obviously was okay (didn't help), tried a different coil (didn't help). Then finally I replaced the cap/rotor and it would start and run on a maximum of 4-5 cylinders (VERY irradic). I then proceeded to turn the distributor until the point where it ran the best (have no idea what the specs are) and got the car moved to my in-laws garage where it is sitting now. Then left on vacation!!!
So, basically this is where it is at now.
I have not tried to start it since I came back last night - but will go over there and see what happens.
Vader,
Do you have any specifics (like wire colors etc.) for how to do the testing of the pickup coil? Also, do I need to take the distributor out in order for me to get to the testing points?
Yes, there is a capacitor in the base of the distributor. I should test the resistance in it?? That sure enough should give some funny readings, but I'll let you know!!
zroc,
I have not double checked for further vaccuum leaks - but actually had thought of that too, and think it would be a good idea now that she runs somewhat again. And, since this basically started right after having the TB off, I will pay close attention to the tb/plenum gasket. I actually have a new one on the way that may come today. I figured since it is still the original gasket and that the TB has been off numerous times, it probably should be replaced either way??
I have not checked the fuel pressure with the vaccuum off, but will do that today. With vaccuum on it is at ~46 psi.
BTW, congrats on the "new" car - and I hope you'll have less trouble than me
Oh and to both of you - thanks for the welcome back, and yes! I had an awesome time in Florida. Wayyy cool!!
Ken
As suggested by Vader I'm starting a new thread on the saga of the stubborn Iroc.
The first thread was located here: https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...threadid=80231
And the previous one was located here: https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...414#post569414
Here is a brief run down of what has been going on, for new readers/participants:
* Last fall a bunch of mods were added to the stock 305TPI. The mods are all in the sig, and included: heads, cam, runners, headers, cat-back and some other minor mods.
* When the car was started in late November it ran decently, but not as strong as expected.
* The car was very difficult to start when cold and would not idle at all. However, once it warmed up to normal operating temperature, it ran "fine".
* While going over all the plugs to clean them, it was found that the rear pass. side plug was physically faulty in that it would not seat right, thus was leaking.
* The car ran better and stronger once the plug was replaced and thus sealed right.
* The car ran better, but still would not idle, even though it seemed to start somewhat easier.
* It was not possible to set the idle speed at this time, as it just would not run at a steady RPM, almost no matter how high it was - it HAD to be constantly varied in order for it to run.
* Got error codes for low voltage on ign module on a regular basis.
* Replaced the ign module - but no difference.
* The TPS could NOT be adjusted within specs. It was impossible to get it over 4V at WOT
* The TPS was replaced but to no avail.
* The ECM was then changed and that fixed the voltage problem and the TPS problem - guesses are that the 5v regulator was bad, or that possibly the old one was okay but needed to be re-seated.
* It was suggested to start looking for vaccuum leaks, and sure enough - there was one on the rear drivers side intake/runner gasket.
* The gasket was replaced, the timing was bumped from the 9°'s that it had been at all along to 15°'s - and the car started and ran stronger than it had EVER done.
* At this point everything was fine, except the idle was a bit too high, and it would take a very long time for it to slow down from about 1600 rpm to eventually 1100rpms at warm idle.
* As it was difficult to get the idle set correct, it was suggested to clean the IAC and the IAC passages. So, the throttlebody was removed and the IAC taken out for cleaning. It was very dirty, as were the passages and the inside of the TB. It was all cleaned thoroughly with carb cleaner.
* Everything was reassembled and the the timing set down to the stock setting of 6°s. The car now ran as total crap, and kept popping and shooting in the exhaust. I tried to bump the timing up again but no luck. The car got gradually worse, and I was getting worried driving with it like that, and eventually it simply did not start at all.
* The last things I did last weekend was to use a different set of plug wires (didn't help), Cleaned out the plugs as they were wet from trying to start (didn't help), Replaced the ign. module with the previous one that obviously was okay (didn't help), tried a different coil (didn't help). Then finally I replaced the cap/rotor and it would start and run on a maximum of 4-5 cylinders (VERY irradic). I then proceeded to turn the distributor until the point where it ran the best (have no idea what the specs are) and got the car moved to my in-laws garage where it is sitting now. Then left on vacation!!!
So, basically this is where it is at now.
I have not tried to start it since I came back last night - but will go over there and see what happens.
Vader,
Do you have any specifics (like wire colors etc.) for how to do the testing of the pickup coil? Also, do I need to take the distributor out in order for me to get to the testing points?
Yes, there is a capacitor in the base of the distributor. I should test the resistance in it?? That sure enough should give some funny readings, but I'll let you know!!
zroc,
I have not double checked for further vaccuum leaks - but actually had thought of that too, and think it would be a good idea now that she runs somewhat again. And, since this basically started right after having the TB off, I will pay close attention to the tb/plenum gasket. I actually have a new one on the way that may come today. I figured since it is still the original gasket and that the TB has been off numerous times, it probably should be replaced either way??
I have not checked the fuel pressure with the vaccuum off, but will do that today. With vaccuum on it is at ~46 psi.
BTW, congrats on the "new" car - and I hope you'll have less trouble than me
Oh and to both of you - thanks for the welcome back, and yes! I had an awesome time in Florida. Wayyy cool!!
Ken
03-16-2002, 03:28 PM
#2
Senior Member
hi everybody- im gonna pick up the pieces here and get helpin out again soon. my good dog nikki died right there in my arms as i held her thursday morning. i got her when she was 2or 3 months old and she was 13 1/2 years old when she died. she was the best friend i ever had and actually oulasted my marrige even though the ex had visitation rights. im pretty far down in the dumps and am trying to get it together. she was a good dog and a good shop dog too. im a dog person and probably only dog people will understand how this feels. she was a wiemaraner and i miss her. 
03-16-2002, 07:54 PM
#3
Hey GGA,
Im real sorry to hear about your dog. I know just how attached one can get to pets and how hard it is to lose one, so I feel your pain.
Hope you will be okay soon, and that you can maybe find a puppy that can get all the care that your previous dog recieved.
Talk to you when you are back on track again!!
Just an update on todays findings.
I didn't get a whole lot done as the wife took off with all my keys..LOL. Anyways, I started the car, and I think it enjoyed the week off without seeing my aggrevated face - because it started right up and ran pretty smooth.
I checked the timing to see where it was at, and it was way up at around 17°!!! So, I set it down to 10° and slowed down the idle some and reset the TPS.
My guess would be that the cap/rotor etc. fixed it last weekend, but that it was so soaked that it wouldn't run right, and that a week of "sobering up" took care of some problems.
Now, as always there is a NEW problem added to the mix. Actually, I've had a feeling of this one coming, so I think it is just about to max out. It is the transmission! It has leaked some lately, and it has gotten worse and worse. This week after sitting still for 5 days, it was a substantial puddle under the car, and when giving the engine some not very hard revs, there are some unbelivably nasty sounds underneat (scraping kinda sounds). Im not sure what it could be, but at this point Im *hoping* it is the transmission, and combined with the increased leakage that would be my guess. BTW, the main leak is not from the pan (i.e. bad gasket), but from the plastic cover around the TC. Oh, and yes, I have added fluid so it hasn't been dry or too low (or too high for that matter)!
I know this is a outside the intentions of this forum, but how does a TC that goes bad, behave??
Ken
Im real sorry to hear about your dog. I know just how attached one can get to pets and how hard it is to lose one, so I feel your pain.
Hope you will be okay soon, and that you can maybe find a puppy that can get all the care that your previous dog recieved.
Talk to you when you are back on track again!!
Just an update on todays findings.
I didn't get a whole lot done as the wife took off with all my keys..LOL. Anyways, I started the car, and I think it enjoyed the week off without seeing my aggrevated face - because it started right up and ran pretty smooth.
I checked the timing to see where it was at, and it was way up at around 17°!!! So, I set it down to 10° and slowed down the idle some and reset the TPS.
My guess would be that the cap/rotor etc. fixed it last weekend, but that it was so soaked that it wouldn't run right, and that a week of "sobering up" took care of some problems.
Now, as always there is a NEW problem added to the mix. Actually, I've had a feeling of this one coming, so I think it is just about to max out. It is the transmission! It has leaked some lately, and it has gotten worse and worse. This week after sitting still for 5 days, it was a substantial puddle under the car, and when giving the engine some not very hard revs, there are some unbelivably nasty sounds underneat (scraping kinda sounds). Im not sure what it could be, but at this point Im *hoping* it is the transmission, and combined with the increased leakage that would be my guess. BTW, the main leak is not from the pan (i.e. bad gasket), but from the plastic cover around the TC. Oh, and yes, I have added fluid so it hasn't been dry or too low (or too high for that matter)!
I know this is a outside the intentions of this forum, but how does a TC that goes bad, behave??
Ken
03-16-2002, 09:37 PM
#4
Ken,
You're just having ALL the luck. At least it started and ran well, but you'll know with more certainty when you get it on the road.
As for the torque converter, a TC that has "gone bad" may do the following:
1. Sneak out at night and hold up convenience stores nfor all the Dexron they have on hand;
2. Sleep with your neighbor's TC;
3. Try to vote more than once for it's favorite TC for governor;
4. Not claim "additional fluid" on its tax return;
5. Conspire with Mustang TCs behind your back;
6. Whine and kick and complain that they aren't well enough to go to school, then act perfectly normal when they visit the transmission doctor;
7. Worst of all - not even trying to hold it until they get to the drain pan.
Aside from that, the leak at the front inspection cover may be the TC seal or pump shaft/front seal of the trans itself. I'm not any kind of experienced auto trans person, but there are more possibilities than just the converter.
You're just having ALL the luck. At least it started and ran well, but you'll know with more certainty when you get it on the road.
As for the torque converter, a TC that has "gone bad" may do the following:
1. Sneak out at night and hold up convenience stores nfor all the Dexron they have on hand;
2. Sleep with your neighbor's TC;
3. Try to vote more than once for it's favorite TC for governor;
4. Not claim "additional fluid" on its tax return;
5. Conspire with Mustang TCs behind your back;
6. Whine and kick and complain that they aren't well enough to go to school, then act perfectly normal when they visit the transmission doctor;
7. Worst of all - not even trying to hold it until they get to the drain pan.
Aside from that, the leak at the front inspection cover may be the TC seal or pump shaft/front seal of the trans itself. I'm not any kind of experienced auto trans person, but there are more possibilities than just the converter.
03-16-2002, 11:58 PM
#6
*shrug*
Oh NO....not the Mustang???
I can handle the whining and the possible bail money from stick-ups, but conspiring with Mustang TC's, that is crossing the line.
I may have to consider a T-56 if these are the risks Im running!!!
Ken
Oh NO....not the Mustang???
I can handle the whining and the possible bail money from stick-ups, but conspiring with Mustang TC's, that is crossing the line.
I may have to consider a T-56 if these are the risks Im running!!!
Ken
03-17-2002, 08:27 AM
#7
Ken,
I'd hoped to get a little giggle out of you. I was feeling a little dopey after logging about 500 miles in a big "loop" yesterday, chasing the kids all over the region for competitions and such.
Have you tried starting and driving the car to get it warm? (Don't go much father that you feel like pushing it.) You may have to actually drive it to get a better feel for what's happening with the transmission.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
GGA,
Sorry to hear about your Wiemaraner. I had a similar bout with a 13-year old Lab about two years ago. She was more like another child than anything. Just remember how much better your life was with her around, and don't forget that the opposite was probably true. A dog can only hope to find a good master, and it sounds like you had one lucky dog.
In time you'll be looking for another one. Not a replacement, just a different companion. I find myself constantly comparing my "buddy" to my other dog, and he has a big set of paws to fill. He is his own dog, but in that way my other dog still lives in my memories.
Incidentally, my buddy sends his condolences, too.
I'd hoped to get a little giggle out of you. I was feeling a little dopey after logging about 500 miles in a big "loop" yesterday, chasing the kids all over the region for competitions and such.
Have you tried starting and driving the car to get it warm? (Don't go much father that you feel like pushing it.) You may have to actually drive it to get a better feel for what's happening with the transmission.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
GGA,
Sorry to hear about your Wiemaraner. I had a similar bout with a 13-year old Lab about two years ago. She was more like another child than anything. Just remember how much better your life was with her around, and don't forget that the opposite was probably true. A dog can only hope to find a good master, and it sounds like you had one lucky dog.
In time you'll be looking for another one. Not a replacement, just a different companion. I find myself constantly comparing my "buddy" to my other dog, and he has a big set of paws to fill. He is his own dog, but in that way my other dog still lives in my memories.
Incidentally, my buddy sends his condolences, too.
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03-17-2002, 09:19 AM
#8
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Join Date: Feb 2002
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Car: 91 firebird,mint
Engine: 305 tbi,lots of work done
Transmission: 700-r4 built by level 10 in nj
Axle/Gears: 3.73, auburn , precision
my condolences as well. i have a 6 year old yellow lab and think alot about the day that is sure to come.........damnit why cant dogs live 100 years like them damn tropical birds?
03-17-2002, 01:38 PM
#9
Vader,
Yeah, you definitely got a chuckle out of me
I guess my wording (and spelling!) sometimes reveales the fact that English ain't my native language, ehe?
Anyways,
No, I did not try to drive the car yesterday - simply because Im a bit worried about the scraping noise from underneat. I guess I could take it for a short trip to see what happens though. However, I did let it idle for about 20+ minutes yesterday, so it certainly reached operating temperature.
I finally got the quick videos shot of it yesterday. I apologize for the not so good sound quality, but it gives you the idea. Actually I don't think the idle sounds half bad right now.
Here are the videos:
Video 1 - taken at the rear end to hear the sound from the exhaust standpoint
Video 2 - taken in the engine compartment
BTW, I will try to take the car to a trans shop here in town tomorrow to let them listen to it and see what they think.
Ken
Yeah, you definitely got a chuckle out of me
I guess my wording (and spelling!) sometimes reveales the fact that English ain't my native language, ehe?
Anyways,
No, I did not try to drive the car yesterday - simply because Im a bit worried about the scraping noise from underneat. I guess I could take it for a short trip to see what happens though. However, I did let it idle for about 20+ minutes yesterday, so it certainly reached operating temperature.
I finally got the quick videos shot of it yesterday. I apologize for the not so good sound quality, but it gives you the idea. Actually I don't think the idle sounds half bad right now.
Here are the videos:
Video 1 - taken at the rear end to hear the sound from the exhaust standpoint
Video 2 - taken in the engine compartment
BTW, I will try to take the car to a trans shop here in town tomorrow to let them listen to it and see what they think.
Ken
03-17-2002, 11:45 PM
#10
Ken,
I'm guessing you're right about the week of drying out. The engine sounds like it is idling well and at a relatively normal speed. The audio isn't theatre-quality, but it definitely sounds like you have a problem there somewhere. Does the noise still occur in gear?
The transmission shop should have an opinion or two, I'm sure.
I'm guessing you're right about the week of drying out. The engine sounds like it is idling well and at a relatively normal speed. The audio isn't theatre-quality, but it definitely sounds like you have a problem there somewhere. Does the noise still occur in gear?
The transmission shop should have an opinion or two, I'm sure.
03-18-2002, 05:34 PM
#11
Vader,
I have not started it again since saturday. Im a little reluctant as I have not confirmed that the noise is from the transmission. So, I'd rather be careful until I know for sure that it is not any engine internals.
I do however have an appointment at a trans shop thursday to get it checked out. So I'll let you know what their diagnosis is. Either way I need to get the trans fixed or replaced, then I'll take it from there.
Ken
I have not started it again since saturday. Im a little reluctant as I have not confirmed that the noise is from the transmission. So, I'd rather be careful until I know for sure that it is not any engine internals.
I do however have an appointment at a trans shop thursday to get it checked out. So I'll let you know what their diagnosis is. Either way I need to get the trans fixed or replaced, then I'll take it from there.
Ken
03-18-2002, 08:17 PM
#12
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Car: 89 RS
Engine: LS1
Transmission: TH350
Hmm...
My tranny does the same thing on start up. Makes that scratching sound from underneath. Only does it if I rev it to about 2500 to 3000 rpms, then goes away after a min., or until warm. I'm hoping its the tranny anyways, not a big deal, just will be the fourth one to go out. I love changing out trannys. (yeah right)
But thats life, I just got done with rearend, real fun by the way.
First one I rebuilt, so it was interesting. You know, lots of banging on things that you probably shouldnt, cursing (no, not me), yelling, biting, etc... I couldnt believe it turned out right, I guess I learned to have a little thing called patience. It helped out.
I couldnt really tell from the audio in that video, but to me the idle sounded pretty good. I'm not up to par on the TPI stuff, so I'll leave that up to Vader, who is by the way "The Man".
My tranny does the same thing on start up. Makes that scratching sound from underneath. Only does it if I rev it to about 2500 to 3000 rpms, then goes away after a min., or until warm. I'm hoping its the tranny anyways, not a big deal, just will be the fourth one to go out. I love changing out trannys. (yeah right)
But thats life, I just got done with rearend, real fun by the way.
First one I rebuilt, so it was interesting. You know, lots of banging on things that you probably shouldnt, cursing (no, not me), yelling, biting, etc... I couldnt believe it turned out right, I guess I learned to have a little thing called patience. It helped out.
I couldnt really tell from the audio in that video, but to me the idle sounded pretty good. I'm not up to par on the TPI stuff, so I'll leave that up to Vader, who is by the way "The Man".
03-19-2002, 12:30 AM
#13
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lol Ken, reading all your problems had me thinking I was reading a story about my car... hehe, honestly After reading all this, I have tons of new ideas to try.
I have a question though, what is involved in reseating the ECM?
After reading all this, I have tons of new ideas to try.I have a question though, what is involved in reseating the ECM?
03-19-2002, 11:19 PM
#14
One more day... And wouldn't you know it's supposed to rain tomorrow (again). At least the trans doctor will get a little water dripping down along with all that fluid.
Just wanted to keep this one near the top until it's finished.
Just wanted to keep this one near the top until it's finished.
03-20-2002, 11:57 PM
#16
Hey guys,
I'll let you know what the verdict is tomorrow on the trans! Im almost certain that it needs the front seal replaced, but Im prepared that it might also need a rebuild. In that case, I'll probably get a different trans.
StngKlr,
I haven't ran it any since I started hearing that sound. I'd like to know what it is first so I don't do any additional damage. As you may have read in my diary on here - I've already had my share of problems So, if I can help it - I'll just wait and save me any additional grief..
Spearson,
That would be just great if Something good came outta all this LOL. I've gotta admit that I've learned a bunch of things - but now it is to a point where I could live with not learning too much more for a while if the d@mn thing would just start working normally.
Vader,
Well if the shop has a roof that leaks less than my trans - they should be okay ehe? Either way, since Im paying to get it straight - I don't care if it is a blizzard, just get it right..
Get back to you guys tomorrow once I know some more!
Ken
I'll let you know what the verdict is tomorrow on the trans! Im almost certain that it needs the front seal replaced, but Im prepared that it might also need a rebuild. In that case, I'll probably get a different trans.
StngKlr,
I haven't ran it any since I started hearing that sound. I'd like to know what it is first so I don't do any additional damage. As you may have read in my diary on here - I've already had my share of problems
So, if I can help it - I'll just wait and save me any additional grief..Spearson,
That would be just great if Something good came outta all this LOL. I've gotta admit that I've learned a bunch of things - but now it is to a point where I could live with not learning too much more for a while if the d@mn thing would just start working normally.
Vader,
Well if the shop has a roof that leaks less than my trans - they should be okay ehe? Either way, since Im paying to get it straight - I don't care if it is a blizzard, just get it right..
Get back to you guys tomorrow once I know some more!
Ken
03-21-2002, 10:40 PM
#18
Senior Member
hi fellas. trans? did someone say trans? make it stop. hey, vader thanks for the good words. i too was wondering what it would be like with a new friend one day and seems you hit it on the head with your description. you know what i got? a REAL art carr 700 sitting here on the shop floor was built by the man himself in 1989 reciepts and all. its got maybe 10k on it and she works primo.best converter ive ever felt in a f body. makin way for the richmond so if anyones thinkin trans make an offer and i would even guarantee it for 90 days or somethin thats how sure of it i am. let er have it-no slicks though. anyhow im going home now and will catch up with the latest here from there.
03-21-2002, 11:32 PM
#20
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Car: T/A / Grand Am
Engine: 383 SBC
Transmission: glide
Axle/Gears: 9" ford 5.67
Originally posted by Vader
Grump,
How much do you s'pose that sucker weighs in a crate? Just getting an idea for shipping costs to east-central Illinois for argument's sake...
Grump,
How much do you s'pose that sucker weighs in a crate? Just getting an idea for shipping costs to east-central Illinois for argument's sake...
03-22-2002, 03:06 AM
#21
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Car: 87 IROC
Engine: LB9 for the moment
Transmission: T5
hey all... I have not been at my home base for nearly a week... I have been watching when I get a chance though... fix the leak man!!!!
zroc
zroc
03-22-2002, 08:18 PM
#22
Alright,
So I went by the shop today, and when I come in the guy comes over and said that I don't have a transmission problem, but an engine problem because it ain't running right ... *** newsflash*** really? Like I haven't been chasing that for the past 4 months!!
Well, I told him that I guarantee there is some problem with the trans, considering that it leaks all over the place when it sits for a few days.
Basically they had moved it inside and didn't see anything that had leaked while it sat - so they took it out for a ride to see if it would act funny, and of course the engine ran funny, but the trans seemed fine.
So what we've decided to do is that it's sitting in the shop there over the weekend, and then on monday they will run some tests on the car and scan it to see if they can see whats going on with the engine. They will also go over the trans and try to provoke it to leak. Im guessing all that it needs to do that is some more oil until it is full again.
All together Im glad to know that they can scan it and see if they can get some ideas on what's bothering the engine - but I still want to know what's going on with the transmission.
Is replacing the front seal a big job? Does anyone know what's involved?
Ken
So I went by the shop today, and when I come in the guy comes over and said that I don't have a transmission problem, but an engine problem because it ain't running right ... *** newsflash*** really? Like I haven't been chasing that for the past 4 months!!
Well, I told him that I guarantee there is some problem with the trans, considering that it leaks all over the place when it sits for a few days.
Basically they had moved it inside and didn't see anything that had leaked while it sat - so they took it out for a ride to see if it would act funny, and of course the engine ran funny, but the trans seemed fine.
So what we've decided to do is that it's sitting in the shop there over the weekend, and then on monday they will run some tests on the car and scan it to see if they can see whats going on with the engine. They will also go over the trans and try to provoke it to leak. Im guessing all that it needs to do that is some more oil until it is full again.
All together Im glad to know that they can scan it and see if they can get some ideas on what's bothering the engine - but I still want to know what's going on with the transmission.
Is replacing the front seal a big job? Does anyone know what's involved?
Ken
03-23-2002, 12:35 AM
#23
Senior Member
get your ride out of there 1st thing. find a shop that has some basic leak detection skills. find a shop that knows how to use flourescent dye to PINPOINT the leak without much in the way of guessin. ummmmm? well, ummmm, lets see, ummmm, it could be here-or it could be coming from this area here, ummm, let us look at it some more and call us tommorow. sounds like poop, huh? it could be you, if you dont get YOUR CAR OUT OF THERE. didnt mean to scare ya.
03-23-2002, 11:02 PM
#24
gga,
I will at least let them do the scan to see if it gives any indication on what is the engine problem.
Other than that, I think there may have been a misunderstanding in our communication. They thought that the sound I referred to was that the car was not running right, and since they moved it and there was nothing on the ground, they thought that I had just thought it was the trans while it "really" was the engine. Then when they took it for a ride to confirm it, the trans worked perfectly fine while the engine ran like crap which to then seemed to confirm that the trans was fine.
So, instead of putting time (and money) into taking down the trans, they waited to talk to me before hand to discuss their initial findings - which I think is actually a good habit.
So, I think I'll let them at least do some initial checks and take it from there. Sound okay?
BTW, the few times I've had minor stuff done to the car, this is the shop I've used - and they've been very cool.
Ken
I will at least let them do the scan to see if it gives any indication on what is the engine problem.
Other than that, I think there may have been a misunderstanding in our communication. They thought that the sound I referred to was that the car was not running right, and since they moved it and there was nothing on the ground, they thought that I had just thought it was the trans while it "really" was the engine. Then when they took it for a ride to confirm it, the trans worked perfectly fine while the engine ran like crap which to then seemed to confirm that the trans was fine.
So, instead of putting time (and money) into taking down the trans, they waited to talk to me before hand to discuss their initial findings - which I think is actually a good habit.
So, I think I'll let them at least do some initial checks and take it from there. Sound okay?
BTW, the few times I've had minor stuff done to the car, this is the shop I've used - and they've been very cool.
Ken
03-24-2002, 03:45 PM
#25
Senior Member
ohhhhh.. doh i was in a special class at school when i was growing up. failed. thought the initial complaint was leakage. no i agree with you a good dose of "overcommunication"-i call it-generally saves all involved headaches down the line. take it easy. hope we can get off this menstrual cycle and start hitting a diagnostic home run soon. summers comin
03-25-2002, 08:14 AM
#26
gga,
Yeah - Im hoping to get things straight before long too! I have a bunch of other things sitting here waiting to be installed, so I'd love for it to run right! (Don't worry, it ain't engine related stuff I have I ain't touching that thing once it runs!)
I'll get back with an update at the end of the day
Ken
Yeah - Im hoping to get things straight before long too! I have a bunch of other things sitting here waiting to be installed, so I'd love for it to run right! (Don't worry, it ain't engine related stuff I have
I ain't touching that thing once it runs!)I'll get back with an update at the end of the day
Ken
03-25-2002, 02:44 PM
#27
Bad bad bad news....
Man, Im completely shot....I have no idea what to do now.
I just came from the shop where they had found that I have lost compression on at least one cylinder. They are suspecting it to be a valve... Which means Im looking at tearing it all down once again. Im just still in shock as I have NO idea what to do at this point.
I have work over my head with classes, 5 weeks left until graduation - then Im off to *** knows where, but most likely Europe. I was going to ship the car with the rest of our belongings, but now I don't know. It ain't much to sell as I will lose out big time and it is too nice to part out.
After graduation in the beginning of May, we have 4 weeks to pack all our belongings to get out of our apartment - so I just don't see any time anywhere for me to do the teardown, and as a student and with a very expensive move coming up, I can't see how I can possibly afford to pay anyone to do the job.
So, right now Im just at a complete toss on what to do....this SUCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Ken
I just came from the shop where they had found that I have lost compression on at least one cylinder. They are suspecting it to be a valve... Which means Im looking at tearing it all down once again. Im just still in shock as I have NO idea what to do at this point.
I have work over my head with classes, 5 weeks left until graduation - then Im off to *** knows where, but most likely Europe. I was going to ship the car with the rest of our belongings, but now I don't know. It ain't much to sell as I will lose out big time and it is too nice to part out.
After graduation in the beginning of May, we have 4 weeks to pack all our belongings to get out of our apartment - so I just don't see any time anywhere for me to do the teardown, and as a student and with a very expensive move coming up, I can't see how I can possibly afford to pay anyone to do the job.
So, right now Im just at a complete toss on what to do....this SUCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Ken
03-25-2002, 09:16 PM
#28
Ken,
Do you have a compression tester? Did they give you specific data on the dead cylinder? (PSI, leakage percent, etc.) Or did they just perform a power balance test and find some weak cylinders?
It makes a difference, since a power balance won't differentiate between a loss of compression, or a dead plug, clogged injector, etc.
Not planning to come to northern Illinois in the next few days, were you? I used to do it in 4½ hours when the speed limit was 55...
Do you have a compression tester? Did they give you specific data on the dead cylinder? (PSI, leakage percent, etc.) Or did they just perform a power balance test and find some weak cylinders?
It makes a difference, since a power balance won't differentiate between a loss of compression, or a dead plug, clogged injector, etc.
Not planning to come to northern Illinois in the next few days, were you? I used to do it in 4½ hours when the speed limit was 55...
Last edited by Vader; 03-25-2002 at 09:19 PM.
03-25-2002, 09:36 PM
#29
Vader,
I do not have a compression tester, but at this point I probably should get me one or at least get a hold of one.
I did't get any specific data on the dead one, but he said "there is no compression". He also said that it was one for sure, but that the car did not run on 3 of the cylinders...! I left while they were still working on it, so I did not get the final word as they just dropped it off once they had it put back together. I will go by tomorrow though and ask if they have any specifics and if they checked the compression on the other 2 dead cylinders as well - or if that could be plugs/injectors as you mentioned.
What blows my mind is that the car starts if you barely touch the key, but of course I can hear that it is not running on everything, but it runs unbelivably "smooth" to have 3 cylinders out?
I didn't have any plans of going up to northern IL, but would very much consider it if there was any engine gurus roaming the streets begging for work. However, as I don't know what is going on - I guess I would have to tow it up there or something?
Ken
I do not have a compression tester, but at this point I probably should get me one or at least get a hold of one.
I did't get any specific data on the dead one, but he said "there is no compression". He also said that it was one for sure, but that the car did not run on 3 of the cylinders...! I left while they were still working on it, so I did not get the final word as they just dropped it off once they had it put back together. I will go by tomorrow though and ask if they have any specifics and if they checked the compression on the other 2 dead cylinders as well - or if that could be plugs/injectors as you mentioned.
What blows my mind is that the car starts if you barely touch the key, but of course I can hear that it is not running on everything, but it runs unbelivably "smooth" to have 3 cylinders out?
I didn't have any plans of going up to northern IL, but would very much consider it if there was any engine gurus roaming the streets begging for work
. However, as I don't know what is going on - I guess I would have to tow it up there or something?Ken
03-26-2002, 11:33 AM
#32
Ken,
If you truly lost a cylinder, the "scraping" noise you heard could have been the engine and not the transmission. It's still odd that you lost transmission oil (and I'm sure you can tell the difference, even if only by odor).
Piston rings that are failing from wearing thin can produce a scraping/howling noise, not unlike a hoard of locusts on a July afternoon. That generally happens at well over 150,000 miles of use, however, and not with an engine that is as "fresh" as yours.
The fact that the engine runs relatively smoothly with a couple of cylinders "dead" is not that surprising on an eight cylinder engine, especially if the dead cylinders have no compression. I've inadvertently done the "5-7 swap" on the spark plug wires more than once and was amazed that the engines ran so well after discovering my blunder.
As for the engine starting only with advanced timing, since you changed the camshaft it is possible that the valve timing is a bit off. Many timing sets have crank sprockets that allow 0°, +4°, and -4° cam installations. Coupled with the fact that Comp Cams grinds most of there off-the-shelf cams with a 4° advance already, your cam/valve timing could be off as much as 8° advanced over the stock lobe centerline angle. And I hate to even mention it, but unless you used a degree wheel to check the installation, the variety of timing marks on the crank sprockets could be confusing, and may appear to be timed correctly when in fact the valve timing is WAY off if the wrong timing marker was used to line up the cam sprocket. Excessive valve timing advance could be the cause of your apparently low intake vacuum at idle as well.
If your problems started soon after the cam installation, you may have something related to that. You would be lucky if the valves did not interfere with the piston tops if that were the case, and may have bent push rods or valves as a result of any interference. Bent push rods would "kill" a cylinder but not cause a compression loss. Bent valves could explain the lack of compression on one or more cylinders. The worst-case scenario would be that a valve penetrated a piston top, but that should result in excessive crankcase pressure, severe oil consumption (like a 90,000-mile Honda), oil fouled spark plugs, and a lot of noticable pulsation in the PCV/CCV system.
You also installed World SR/Torquer 305s. What gaskets did you use for the installation? Your loss of compression could be related to head seal loss, from either inferior gaskets of warpage of the aluminum heads, or a combination of both.
Just more possibilities. Let us know what information they can give you from the repair shop.
If you truly lost a cylinder, the "scraping" noise you heard could have been the engine and not the transmission. It's still odd that you lost transmission oil (and I'm sure you can tell the difference, even if only by odor).
Piston rings that are failing from wearing thin can produce a scraping/howling noise, not unlike a hoard of locusts on a July afternoon. That generally happens at well over 150,000 miles of use, however, and not with an engine that is as "fresh" as yours.
The fact that the engine runs relatively smoothly with a couple of cylinders "dead" is not that surprising on an eight cylinder engine, especially if the dead cylinders have no compression. I've inadvertently done the "5-7 swap" on the spark plug wires more than once and was amazed that the engines ran so well after discovering my blunder.
As for the engine starting only with advanced timing, since you changed the camshaft it is possible that the valve timing is a bit off. Many timing sets have crank sprockets that allow 0°, +4°, and -4° cam installations. Coupled with the fact that Comp Cams grinds most of there off-the-shelf cams with a 4° advance already, your cam/valve timing could be off as much as 8° advanced over the stock lobe centerline angle. And I hate to even mention it, but unless you used a degree wheel to check the installation, the variety of timing marks on the crank sprockets could be confusing, and may appear to be timed correctly when in fact the valve timing is WAY off if the wrong timing marker was used to line up the cam sprocket. Excessive valve timing advance could be the cause of your apparently low intake vacuum at idle as well.
If your problems started soon after the cam installation, you may have something related to that. You would be lucky if the valves did not interfere with the piston tops if that were the case, and may have bent push rods or valves as a result of any interference. Bent push rods would "kill" a cylinder but not cause a compression loss. Bent valves could explain the lack of compression on one or more cylinders. The worst-case scenario would be that a valve penetrated a piston top, but that should result in excessive crankcase pressure, severe oil consumption (like a 90,000-mile Honda), oil fouled spark plugs, and a lot of noticable pulsation in the PCV/CCV system.
You also installed World SR/Torquer 305s. What gaskets did you use for the installation? Your loss of compression could be related to head seal loss, from either inferior gaskets of warpage of the aluminum heads, or a combination of both.
Just more possibilities. Let us know what information they can give you from the repair shop.
03-26-2002, 02:58 PM
#33
Vader,
The leak was transmission oil guaranteed. I could see that it came from the drain hole in the dustpan under the converter, it was red and the engine oil is still right on full and the fluids on the garage floor/car port at least adds up to a quart or more.
I had thought about piston rings too - but like you said, the car has less than 90K miles, has fresh oils and lots of fresh parts. But I guess we'll find out.
I hadn't thought about that the smoothness of the engine even with up to 3 cylinders out could be caused by the lack of compression - but that certainly makes sense.
Regarding the cam/timing issues - as I mentioned to you, the possibilities of different positions for the sprocket is bothering me, but then again I double checked it so many times with CompCams and others to make sure there was no doubt it was installed right. However, with the current problems Im not putting money on it. And, regarding the degree wheel - I had it on order but cancelled it because I was informed that I wouldn't need it for an engine like this - because it was a straight shot. So much for that, huh?
And yes, I've had problems more or less ever since I did the mods last fall.
I've said it SO many times - if I had only taken the d@mn car to Midas when I needed a new exhaust, the car would still be stock, still be running, and my pockets full of $$$$. For those who don't get the connection - my exhaust was shot and I decided to buy a cat-back, and then of course headers to go with it. Well, the last bolt on the last manifold naturally had to break! So, thus I had to pull it all apart and the "might-as-well" rollocoaster started, with "might as well swap heads", "might as well do the cam", "might as well do the runners"...and so on.. and that all "might as well" give me a sh!tload of problems to go with it!!
Well, 'nuff whining!
Yes, the W/P heads were installed at the same time - and the headgaskets I was told to use, were the Fel-Pro pre-flattened ones. I can get the part.no. if that is helpful, as I still have all receipts. BTW, the S/R Torquers are Cast Iron heads, not aluminum - so I guess warping isn't as likely?
Now till todays updates,
I went by the shop to get some more details. He said that there was at least one cylinder on each side that was dead. They had only done a "regular compression test" as he said, so I assume one of those simple ones that you put in the plug hole. They didn't have any comparisons with the other cylinders written down - and I assume they had just stopped at that point and concluded that the next step was to tear down and see what was going on. And, since I told them that I would take care of the tear down - they didn't do any further testing. Their reason for saying it was a valve problem was just an assumption based on their previous experience from similar cases - and not from any particular "evidence" from what they had seen.
And, for the record - they didn't charge me dime for all the tests etc - so they weren't p!$$ed for not getting the job
So basically the only "reliable" info I have at this point - is that there is no compression on one cylinder (possibly three - involving both heads), and it is currently unknown what the cause is.
Ken
The leak was transmission oil guaranteed. I could see that it came from the drain hole in the dustpan under the converter, it was red and the engine oil is still right on full and the fluids on the garage floor/car port at least adds up to a quart or more.
I had thought about piston rings too - but like you said, the car has less than 90K miles, has fresh oils and lots of fresh parts. But I guess we'll find out.
I hadn't thought about that the smoothness of the engine even with up to 3 cylinders out could be caused by the lack of compression - but that certainly makes sense.
Regarding the cam/timing issues - as I mentioned to you, the possibilities of different positions for the sprocket is bothering me, but then again I double checked it so many times with CompCams and others to make sure there was no doubt it was installed right. However, with the current problems Im not putting money on it. And, regarding the degree wheel - I had it on order but cancelled it because I was informed that I wouldn't need it for an engine like this - because it was a straight shot. So much for that, huh?
And yes, I've had problems more or less ever since I did the mods last fall.
I've said it SO many times - if I had only taken the d@mn car to Midas when I needed a new exhaust, the car would still be stock, still be running, and my pockets full of $$$$. For those who don't get the connection - my exhaust was shot and I decided to buy a cat-back, and then of course headers to go with it. Well, the last bolt on the last manifold naturally had to break! So, thus I had to pull it all apart and the "might-as-well" rollocoaster started, with "might as well swap heads", "might as well do the cam", "might as well do the runners"...and so on.. and that all "might as well" give me a sh!tload of problems to go with it!!
Well, 'nuff whining!
Yes, the W/P heads were installed at the same time - and the headgaskets I was told to use, were the Fel-Pro pre-flattened ones. I can get the part.no. if that is helpful, as I still have all receipts. BTW, the S/R Torquers are Cast Iron heads, not aluminum - so I guess warping isn't as likely?
Now till todays updates,
I went by the shop to get some more details. He said that there was at least one cylinder on each side that was dead. They had only done a "regular compression test" as he said, so I assume one of those simple ones that you put in the plug hole. They didn't have any comparisons with the other cylinders written down - and I assume they had just stopped at that point and concluded that the next step was to tear down and see what was going on. And, since I told them that I would take care of the tear down - they didn't do any further testing. Their reason for saying it was a valve problem was just an assumption based on their previous experience from similar cases - and not from any particular "evidence" from what they had seen.
And, for the record - they didn't charge me dime for all the tests etc - so they weren't p!$$ed for not getting the job
So basically the only "reliable" info I have at this point - is that there is no compression on one cylinder (possibly three - involving both heads), and it is currently unknown what the cause is.
Ken
03-27-2002, 12:57 PM
#36
Supreme Member
Ken,
You may want them to adjust the valves for you, you may have too much load on the lifters, hangining a few open.
By any chance, after you did the initial valve adjustment, did you rotatate the engine through and recheck/retighten them? if so, it's not uncommon for the lifters to compress some more, making it seem like.."gee, this ones still loose", so you crank it down some more...and it ends up being too much.
You may want them to adjust the valves for you, you may have too much load on the lifters, hangining a few open.
By any chance, after you did the initial valve adjustment, did you rotatate the engine through and recheck/retighten them? if so, it's not uncommon for the lifters to compress some more, making it seem like.."gee, this ones still loose", so you crank it down some more...and it ends up being too much.
03-27-2002, 02:49 PM
#37
Mike,
A couple of guys actually suggested the same thing - and I guess nothing would be better than it being only an adjustment.
I did infact go over the valve adjustments 3 times after the cam install to make sure it was correct - but then again, it was my first time doing a cam swap as well as adjusting valves on a non OHC engine. Thus since you can't measure the clearance with a feeler gauge like on an OHC, there is more room for error (especially for someone inexperienced) - so certainly is a chance that the problem can be there.
It is painfully obvious that *something* that was done probably wasn't successful, since it has given me trouble all along.
Now the question is - IF it is the case that there is too much load on one or more of the valves, what is the possible consequences at this point? The car has probably been driven about a 1000 miles since the mods last fall.
Would burnt valves be expected if they have not been closed all the way for that long?
What still bothers me though is the scraping sound that I heard and that I don't know if it was from the engine or the transmission - at this point.
Ken
A couple of guys actually suggested the same thing - and I guess nothing would be better than it being only an adjustment.
I did infact go over the valve adjustments 3 times after the cam install to make sure it was correct - but then again, it was my first time doing a cam swap as well as adjusting valves on a non OHC engine. Thus since you can't measure the clearance with a feeler gauge like on an OHC, there is more room for error (especially for someone inexperienced) - so certainly is a chance that the problem can be there.
It is painfully obvious that *something* that was done probably wasn't successful, since it has given me trouble all along.
Now the question is - IF it is the case that there is too much load on one or more of the valves, what is the possible consequences at this point? The car has probably been driven about a 1000 miles since the mods last fall.
Would burnt valves be expected if they have not been closed all the way for that long?
What still bothers me though is the scraping sound that I heard and that I don't know if it was from the engine or the transmission - at this point.
Ken
03-27-2002, 02:58 PM
#38
Supreme Member
I'm not sure Ken...whenever I set valves, I use the old standy method of starting them off a little loose for the initial setting with the engine off, the adjust them once running.
But a quick adjustment (shouldn't take a decent wrench head more than bout 1/2 hour) would put you in a position to re-check the compression on the low cylinders and give you a better idea of what kinda shape the topend is in.
But a quick adjustment (shouldn't take a decent wrench head more than bout 1/2 hour) would put you in a position to re-check the compression on the low cylinders and give you a better idea of what kinda shape the topend is in.
03-27-2002, 03:08 PM
#39
Mike,
I might just have to do that!
The only thing that sux is that adjusting the valves as you say is about a 1/2 hour job, while it is a LOT of work to get to the valves as I have to disassemble half the engine to get the valve covers off, for then to have to either reassemble the stuff so I can start her without the covers while adjusting - OR adjust it, put the covers on and reassemble everything again.
I can't get off the driversside valve cover without taking off the A/C compressor and some of the brackets etc + some of the A.I.R. equipment and so on.
Either way - it sounds like a pretty good place to start.
We'll see where Vader was headed with the compressor theory.
Ken
I might just have to do that!
The only thing that sux is that adjusting the valves as you say is about a 1/2 hour job, while it is a LOT of work to get to the valves as I have to disassemble half the engine to get the valve covers off, for then to have to either reassemble the stuff so I can start her without the covers while adjusting - OR adjust it, put the covers on and reassemble everything again.
I can't get off the driversside valve cover without taking off the A/C compressor and some of the brackets etc + some of the A.I.R. equipment and so on.
Either way - it sounds like a pretty good place to start.
We'll see where Vader was headed with the compressor theory.
Ken
03-28-2002, 08:46 AM
#40
Ken,
Line up the trailer if you're ready....
I was thinking that you may want to perform a cylinder leakage test to determine the cause of compression loss. Apparently, your repair shop didn't see that as necessary, but it surely is a better diagnostic tool than just a straight compression test. A quick compression test is good to verify adequate and even compression on all cylinders, and may even be used to diagnose some problems. However, it just isn't as easy to diagnose low compression and is not as quantitative as a leakage test. The leakage test also allows detection of the source of leakage by sound or air pressure, since leakage should be heard in either the intake or exhaust manifolds (valves), or through the crankcase vent (rings/piston).
Incidentally, the left rocker cover can be tricky, but the A/C compressor doesn't have to be completely removed to get the covers off. The right one is definitely easier.
There should be a legitimate repair shop in the area that can perform a leakage test, or at least at a dealer service department that should be better equipped.
Line up the trailer if you're ready....
I was thinking that you may want to perform a cylinder leakage test to determine the cause of compression loss. Apparently, your repair shop didn't see that as necessary, but it surely is a better diagnostic tool than just a straight compression test. A quick compression test is good to verify adequate and even compression on all cylinders, and may even be used to diagnose some problems. However, it just isn't as easy to diagnose low compression and is not as quantitative as a leakage test. The leakage test also allows detection of the source of leakage by sound or air pressure, since leakage should be heard in either the intake or exhaust manifolds (valves), or through the crankcase vent (rings/piston).
Incidentally, the left rocker cover can be tricky, but the A/C compressor doesn't have to be completely removed to get the covers off. The right one is definitely easier.
There should be a legitimate repair shop in the area that can perform a leakage test, or at least at a dealer service department that should be better equipped.
Last edited by Vader; 03-28-2002 at 08:49 AM.
03-28-2002, 06:22 PM
#41
Vader,
Yeah, I don't think the repair shop did any additional tests since they had just found the lack of compression when I came by. So, when I said that I would take care of it, they just put it together - which is understandable.
I will see what I can get together in order to do a leakage test.
Actually with the Edelbrock valve covers I believe I need to take the A/C compressor off - but I will check to see. It's been a few months since I had that off, so I could be wrong
I'll email you on the trailering deal.
Ken
Yeah, I don't think the repair shop did any additional tests since they had just found the lack of compression when I came by. So, when I said that I would take care of it, they just put it together - which is understandable.
I will see what I can get together in order to do a leakage test.
Actually with the Edelbrock valve covers I believe I need to take the A/C compressor off - but I will check to see. It's been a few months since I had that off, so I could be wrong
I'll email you on the trailering deal.
Ken
03-30-2002, 10:47 PM
#42
Just a quick update,
Didn't have much time to do anything this weekend, but drained the oil today just to make sure there was no metal particles in it.
It looked fine, and the magnetic drain plug was clean - so at least there is one good sign.
As a side not - the car runs very crappy right now. At this point I can actually believe it runs on only 5 cylinders. It has a very "hollow" sound to it in the exhaust. Nothing like it was on that video.
The autoparts places around here had no compression testers / cylinder leak testers for rent, so Im waiting for a compression tester in the mail early next week. Then I'll be able to get some numbers to throw out.
Thx,
Ken
Didn't have much time to do anything this weekend, but drained the oil today just to make sure there was no metal particles in it.
It looked fine, and the magnetic drain plug was clean - so at least there is one good sign.
As a side not - the car runs very crappy right now. At this point I can actually believe it runs on only 5 cylinders. It has a very "hollow" sound to it in the exhaust. Nothing like it was on that video.
The autoparts places around here had no compression testers / cylinder leak testers for rent, so Im waiting for a compression tester in the mail early next week. Then I'll be able to get some numbers to throw out.
Thx,
Ken
03-31-2002, 05:31 AM
#43
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Hey Ken,
can you do some more videos??? I am playing catchup here... those two didn't have much to go on... definately do your own compression test and post the results... would be nice to get a leakdown test but not totally nescesary... I have to wonder if all they did at that shop was a power balance test... keep posting...
zroc
can you do some more videos??? I am playing catchup here... those two didn't have much to go on... definately do your own compression test and post the results... would be nice to get a leakdown test but not totally nescesary... I have to wonder if all they did at that shop was a power balance test... keep posting...
zroc
03-31-2002, 10:01 AM
#44
Ken,
I didn't realize you were working with non-stock rocker covers. Taller/wider/cast covers will be a different game, as you obviously already know.
I'm waiting for a green light from Mrs. Vader...
Leakage testing may be a little better for diagnosis, but a straight compression test on ALL cylinders should be a very good start.
I didn't realize you were working with non-stock rocker covers. Taller/wider/cast covers will be a different game, as you obviously already know.
I'm waiting for a green light from Mrs. Vader...
Leakage testing may be a little better for diagnosis, but a straight compression test on ALL cylinders should be a very good start.
03-31-2002, 11:24 PM
#45
zroc,
sure - anything in particular you'd want me to try catch on the video?
I hopefully will get the compression tester tomorrow, and will post the results once I get them.
The shop only did a comp. test, as I came by at that point and they told me what they thought was going on (valve problems) and asked if I wanted them to fix it or not, indicating it would be big $$$, so I told them to just get it back together and take it back to my house - which they did. Thats why only a little bit of testing was done.
Vader,
Just let me know what the boss decides
Hope to get the compression test done maybe by tuesday.
Ken
sure - anything in particular you'd want me to try catch on the video?
I hopefully will get the compression tester tomorrow, and will post the results once I get them.
The shop only did a comp. test, as I came by at that point and they told me what they thought was going on (valve problems) and asked if I wanted them to fix it or not, indicating it would be big $$$, so I told them to just get it back together and take it back to my house - which they did. Thats why only a little bit of testing was done.
Vader,
Just let me know what the boss decides
Hope to get the compression test done maybe by tuesday.
Ken
04-01-2002, 11:47 PM
#46
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Car: 87 IROC
Engine: LB9 for the moment
Transmission: T5
well can we ask for the problem to cooperate and catch it in the act??? I hope so... we need to view when its happenning... also any odd starting caracteristics when the problem occurs... mostly the sound of the exhuast...
zroc
zroc
04-01-2002, 11:59 PM
#47
zroc,
The way it is now - it sounds bad all the time, so catching it in the act shouldn't be a problem
The strange part about the starting is that even with (supposedly) three cylinders out - it starts right up as soon as you touch the key.
The most obvious sign that something is wrong now, is the uneven idle and exhaust tone.
Personally Im really leaning towards the theory of too much preload on some valves, with the potential of burnt valves as a result.
But, anyways, I will shoot a couple more videos tomorrow and post them.
Hopefully the compression tester shows up tomorrow as well.
Ken
The way it is now - it sounds bad all the time, so catching it in the act shouldn't be a problem
The strange part about the starting is that even with (supposedly) three cylinders out - it starts right up as soon as you touch the key.
The most obvious sign that something is wrong now, is the uneven idle and exhaust tone.
Personally Im really leaning towards the theory of too much preload on some valves, with the potential of burnt valves as a result.
But, anyways, I will shoot a couple more videos tomorrow and post them.
Hopefully the compression tester shows up tomorrow as well.
Ken
04-02-2002, 12:36 AM
#48
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Join Date: Oct 2000
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Car: 87 IROC
Engine: LB9 for the moment
Transmission: T5
cool... I'm glad you have stuck with it... hopefully there has been no damage to the valves or valve seats... odd thing... if it is a prob with the valve adjustment you would think it would happen all the time... the compression test will tell...
zroc
zroc
04-04-2002, 09:14 AM
#50
Vader,
FedEx has screwed me up with the delivery - seems like they delivered the tester to a different place. I'll try to hunt it down today though - and do the test asap.
Let me know whenever you know anything about the garage, it takes uhaul at least 1 day to get the trailer to town.
Thanks man!!
Ken
FedEx has screwed me up with the delivery - seems like they delivered the tester to a different place. I'll try to hunt it down today though - and do the test asap.
Let me know whenever you know anything about the garage, it takes uhaul at least 1 day to get the trailer to town.
Thanks man!!
Ken