19Chevrolet84

I have a 1984 Berlinetta, and the Previous Owner decided to put in a new audio system. Not exactly sure what he has done since the car still isn't home. He said he replaced all the speakers, and put in 2 Xtant A 12" subs. The subs are mounted in a factory well cover? I've never seen any of these before... Just asking if I should make a box, and what i should do with all this clutter...(I'm guessing he just got lazy).

Sorry for the novel, ^ but thanks for reading.

!CamaroDave

iTrader: (3)

Looks like they knew what they were doing on hooking everything up but wasn't too worried about how the wiring looked lol. Yea I would definitely try and clean the wires up a bit by hiding them. You will prolly get a lot of **** for that because of how it looks but hey if it works and sounds good then go for it.

STRIKER911

iTrader: (1)

Id get two more kenwood amps, & take the other two out. I have an alpine and another that I dont know the name of off hand. Had the off brand one sitting around for about 5 years, so I threw it in for now (works the 6x9's). When I ever get money I will get another alpine.

Looks like it would be hard to hide all the wires you have in their. In the least put as much as you can in Some wire loom. The more runs of wire you can get in one loom the better. Or if you want to be funny you could use some small pvc painted to match ur carpet. Might look better.

19Chevrolet84

Do I even need 3 amps? He has left one hooked up to the front speakers, and the right speaker hooked up to the speakers in the towers. And the middle 600W Amp is hooked up to the 2 12" subs. Can I just get one big amp and still have the same audio quality?

DJ Delsym

iTrader: (4)

It would be best to run two amps. A mono for the subs and a 4 channel for the other speakers. I would make a box that is made specifically for those subs and mount the amps elsewhere to make is look nice. Thats me though, I wouldn't run one big amp because power would be split too many times and make it sound like garbage.

19Chevrolet84

Alright well thanks. I'm by no means an audio expert, just know very little from what the P.O. told me... Still waiting for it to come home. And yes, I was thinking about building a fiberglass box.

84ws689bird

What I would do is start all over again.
FIRST. the power wire is too small, seems to be 8 gauge at best, and for mutiple amp systems a 4 gauge is needed. run a 4 gauge to the battery, through the firewall and a proper grommet and fuse within 12 inches of the battery. run to distribution block and then 8 ga. to each amp.
SECOND, PO used RED wire for the ground wires. while not technically wrong, it can get confusing, if you hook up an amp reversed, it may short it out. they are fused internally, but it may get by the fuse and kill it before the fuse has a chance to blow. Use black or silver 4 ga. to the other distribution block and Black or silver 8 ga. to each amp for ground.
THIRD, The pioneer amp is good for the subs and the Alpine is a 4 channel which will run the rest of the system. get rid of the other one, unless it was a band-aid for two bad channels on the alpine (I've seen that done). get rid of the capacitor, shouldn't need it unless the car's charging system is weak, again another band-aid, or the PO thought it was cool. in any case, I've only HAD to install capacitors in systems that ran upwards of 10,000 watts, and the owners didn't want to upgrade the alternator. It looks like they used an electronic crossover setup, which I would keep, gives better (correct) sound frequencies to each amp. Hide/reroute as much wiring as possible, proper display of wiring can actually add visual appeal to a system, be creative.

Lastly, make sure that the amps are NOT screwed down to the metal in that portion of the car, as the gas tank lines and the tank itself are less than 1/2 inch below there, put a piece of 1/2 inch MDF wood under the carpet or carpet a piece to match and screw the amps to that. seems you have some fun ahead of you!!! ps I've been installing professionally for over 10 yrs, and would be happy to help guide you through it if you want.

19Chevrolet84

I'm not sure on the gauges but there is about an inch thick wire running from the battery to the first wire splitter thingy. And thanks for all the help... I have alot to tackle yet. When i Get it home, I'll keep you posted.

RockJay81

iTrader: (1)

get rid of all the amps they suck( sorry bro) get a pair or power acoustik amps with their subs everything looks cleaner with the same brand all around. then with 4 gauge power and ground wires. its not that hard to fab it up with some wood and black carpet

87 WHITE GTA

So now power acoustik its better than alpine,pioneer and kenwood?

Its one thing that their stuff has gone down a bit in the last cpl of years...but from there to power acoustik beein better...hell no....

RockJay81

iTrader: (1)

they are way better than kenwood you can get that kenwood stuff at walmart and pepboys way overrated you must like sony xplode too huh

and you threw alpine in there they make great decks and high speakers thats what i have in my daily driver. keep using the sunday specials buddy

and yeah pioneer sucks too. im not trying to knock you bro but your trying to hard with the system if your gona do it right do it 1 time only. in a couple of years your gona have a garage full of beat up amps and subs

HCR13

iTrader: (5)

I have a full Sony Xplod system from amps, to speakers, to head unit and have not had a problem for over 5 years now.

I think it depends on how hard you push your music. If you're a sound engineer and actually care about sound decibels and signal strength and pitch tone, and wave balance and blah blah blah, then yes, spend a fortune on "high end/name brand" stuff. But if you want to get in your car and just drive and listen to good tunes, then don't worry about replacing what ever amps you have. They should be fine, even Roadmaster crap from WalMart holds up well if you don't have it unneceessarily blasted 100+ while chilling with your homies. Audio brands are like mufflers, they all have their fan boys and all have pro's and con's than normally don't matter on the reason of purchase...

y84pauloflondon

Rockjay81, are you basing this on your own personal experience, or are you a professional audio installer? Cause I have a Kenwood 600 Watt 4-ch KAC-846 running 2 12" phoenix gold subs for about 9 yrs now in my GTA pumping out what was tested to be 136.5 dB (measured by air pressure meter). I'm not saying that the test was perfect, but it was done at a car show...Not a problem with the amp to this day.

p.s. it was tested using the stock AC-Delco cass deck from 87.

y84pauloflondon

HCR13 totally

y84pauloflondon

Oh yeah, I also had my SONY Discmen playing one of my bass cd's through the cass player deck...LOL

GHETTO....

87 WHITE GTA

I am no audio expert,but Ive had my share of head units in my car ,My first unit was indeed a sony xplod, but i never installed it.From there I moved to a pioneer,thento a jensen (lol) then to a cassete alpine,Then to a cd alpine with time aligment,and I currently have an eclipse cd8445 2 alpine amps,pioneer components and an orion sub.

my dad has a nakamichi on his camry with kappas all around... talk about sound quality.....So I think I have an idea of what sound quality is.. and Ive listened to my share of expensive and cheap radios..that being said...power acoustik is down there with audiopipe,lanzar,pyle,pyramid, boss etc etc... can they get loud? maybe.... for how long?? who knows....

STRIKER911

iTrader: (1)

I see a lot of brand loyalty in this post but its whatever. Brand loyalty is all good for some but people need to understand that it only works for so long. The guy at the store wants to sell you what you will buy. Its his job to pump the crap up, so u like it.

On the other hand Orion was sold, phoenix gold, was sold. Who knows how many others where. My point is that what might be good yesterday is not always good today.

First two pioneer head units had broken buttons in no time. One even smoked my truck out. Id still rock a pioneer. The one exception to the rule is "SONY". We all know that sony does not make all of the junk they sell. They buy a lot of it and slap a sony plate on, Making bank while selling to band loyal groupes.

The guy that likes sony likes low volume, yet quality sounding tones, But lets face it; most of the young people want that kill your hearing, block pounding bass. Start with sony and you throw money away. U will turn the amp up till the subs blow. Point being; you need to think ahead. How hard do you want to push it? I can make most anything sound like a sony.

MaDeNMiAMi305

i agree with white 87 and striker - do some research. no disrespect to anybody but alot of the stuff i read is garbage. xtant makes a decent sub however alot of these companies that are well known really arent that great. i say go check some stuff out for yourself and see what kind of options you looking for. stay away from the best buy / circuit city type stores. they all have the same type of products there... its not that they are bad they just arent that great. look up a couple companies that sell some higher end brands such as focal and diamond audio and have them direct you to a product that fits your budget. good luck.

87 WHITE GTA

Now thats good advice...look into higher end brands like morel,focal,diamond audio,cadence,dynaudio etc....pure quality.

19Chevrolet84

both of you thanks for the advice... as for the other guy... im glad im getting flamed for a system i didnt even put in...

ellocojorge

iTrader: (1)

yo can... thats how i have mine... im using a kicker 5-channel( other companies make five channel but i got a heck of a deal on this) most of the amps the other companies sell are all very similar... they will all give u between 50 to 80 rms x4 for u speakers and and they vary from 200 to 500 rms trough the subwoofer channel... the model im using is the kicker kx700.5

ellocojorge

iTrader: (1)

really now? power accoustik amps are all overrated

Civerus

I am a fan of Pioneer, Rockford Fosgate, and Crossfire. I have one of the 760w Pioneer amps from Wal*Mart (remember, I used to work professionally installing car audio components at a shop), and this Pioneer amp puts out every bit of 760w, even though it is rated at 4ohm, I run it on a 2-ohm bridged load with two Crossfire CF310D's (dual 8ohm coils running at 4 parallel into 2 bridged). This amp, will not only drive them (250w @ 4ohm, 500 @ 2ohm ea.) but it makes them hit harder than most 12's and 15's I hear around here. I have had them for over a year and a half, and they haven't had a single problem or hiccup.

Now, if you want to get into it, I like Crossfire products the most for price, quality, and loudness. They make a good product, while hard to find a distributor, they label the products accordingly to what they ACTUALLY put out, not numbers that look appealing on a box. I have installed and tested MANY combination's of Crossfire systems and by FAR like the amps they produce the BEST. The amps have the most clear sound, put out more wattage than rated at, and last forever from what I've seen so far.

As for Rockford Fosgate, hands down, sound quality, and nothing but. Loudness, sound quality, cheap price, once again, products that put out whats listed on the box. Had two Punch 12's at one point, wish I had never gotton rid of them.

Now I also tried a 1200w Sony Xplode amp that was lying around in the shop on my two Crossfire's one day. This amp did power them, but frequently overheated and kicked into safety, and did NOT power them with no 1200 watts like it said. It also made the sound basically garbage, and the amp was brand-new nothing wrong with it. This isn't the first Sony amp/speaker combo I've seen be that terrible either.

Basically what I'm getting at, is if you want to go a bit cheaper, Pioneer is a GREAT way to invest your money, and they last forever, my 6x9's and 4x6's are AMAZING just off of my Pioneer head-units power.
Looking to go a little bit more pricey? I would choose Crossfire or Rockford Fosgate, both exceptional brands with names and support to back them up.

And lastly, if it don't sound right, check how its wired. A bad ground can make your amp lose power, or sound terrible, and a faulty, knicked, or damaged/oxidized 12v lead-in can do the same.

To that distribution block, you should run AT LEAST #0 wire, and then 4ga lead-offs, and its always better to have a larger ground than positive on the amp. You can put out as much power as you can move through the amp, power always flows from positive to negative

And justly, I would replace it with a 2ch for subs, and a 4ch for components, delete the extra, and keep the crossovers. Keep the capacitor, it was probably installed for a reason and theres no point in removing it if its already in-place. If you run more than 1,500 watts, look into another battery.

19Chevrolet84

alright thank you very much, ill look more into the higher end of amps and subs... kind of off topic but is dynamatt worth doing?

also, i looked up the Rockford Fosgate 12" punch subs... they seem extremely reasonable.

Now, as for an amp to power those...? like a single 1000W with 2 channels? and a 4 channel to run the rest correct?

mtwlkn122

dynamat as the name brand no...sound deading yes...dynamat is overlypriced and overhyped. I personally would go with Second Skin. Its cheaper and better and i can get you some promo codes to get it cheaper...PM me for details

ellocojorge

iTrader: (1)

indeed . its almost 1/3 of the price of dynamat

y84pauloflondon

Hey guys, I'm NO audio pro installer or expert, but a buddy just gave me a cap for my car. If you guys can read my thread (#13-15), the 2 12" and amp are still in my car. Should I install the cap or just leave it as is???? I figure since I have the free cap why not use it! From what he told me, it'll save the amp and alt from power surges......!?

ellocojorge

iTrader: (1)

if u have dimming lights itll help with that.. if u got it for free , i say go for it... just remember to charge it...

Civerus

YES, if you don't let a cap charge, you'll get going on the road, and your battery will fail miserably until its charged. Just a friendly hint, let it charge for a little while before driving.

y84pauloflondon

To Civerus an Ellocojorge thankx for the advice guys!!!
Keep in mind, most of time(80%) the radio is off and I'm just enjoying the rumble of my car....
I'm kinda a name brand guy just because I'm no expert on audio equipment, I trust there service and support more. Plus I think all makers have there cheap crap line and there more pricy line of stuff, I guess I'm more lucky then smart with the audio I've bought 9 yrs ago.....lol

MaDeNMiAMi305

just shop around you can get dynamat cheap you just have to hunt for it. its also better if you buy in bulk. ive seen people use other brands but having used the real deal i wouldnt be satisfied with anything less.

19Chevrolet84

Other then the floor and doors is there really anything else to put sound deadening material down on? and how much of a PITA is it?

ellocojorge

iTrader: (1)

just about every panel of the car can be done... specially the b pillar( were the sail panel speaker are) also were the spare tire is, and u can also do the roof. u specially want to do the hatch, and the section were the pulldon motor/taillights are

19Chevrolet84

I was planning on doing the floor(obviously) doors, i will do the b pillars. I have t-tops so i can't really do the roof...And the hatch? you mean like in the well? and over the hump?

84ws689bird

try this thread, it shows all the area that should be done, https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/car-...-build-up.html

ellocojorge

iTrader: (1)

all of the plus the non glass park of the hatch door

19Chevrolet84

Alright thanks everyone! Any suggestions on where to hide the amps?

ellocojorge

iTrader: (1)

if u want them really hidden, u can try the spare tire area or the storage space on the opposite side

19Chevrolet84

okay... how much room do amps need to breathe?

and can a ported box fit in the well while sitting flush for 2 12" subs?

ellocojorge

iTrader: (1)

they sell premade ported boxes on ebay that fit in the well.. so u can either go with that or make one urself... as for the amps getting enough air... several member have installed them in there... but if u are really worried u could always make a small cutout in the plastic for a computer fan to reach the storage area

19Chevrolet84

I'd be making my own box... And a sealed box sounds better right? ported just makes the bass deeper?

ellocojorge

iTrader: (1)

ported are louder, and yes can reach lower level( if tuned correctly) i prefer sealed just, because the bass response is so tight at diff level

19Chevrolet84

yeah, I'll probably go with a sealed box... I listen to mostly Rock... But i have my moods where I listen to rap... And i have to show all the little wind up toys around my school how to bump... while still keeping my audio quality... unlike them.