nelapse

iTrader: (17)

Anyone have the front sway bar removed and use the car on a daily basis?

How does it handle?

Just wondering if it would be a good idea.

//<86TA>\\

iTrader: (14)

I dont think its a good idea, maybe temporarily due to broken parts and not having another car, but in my opinion, not the best of ideas.

Apeiron

It'll corner like a 6 ton 52 Buick.

nelapse

iTrader: (17)

Well hey, it is why I am asking.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

i took mine off to paint it one day and drove the car all day without it. definately feels funny and dont expect it to handle well at all. but i left the TDS wonderbar on and it seemed to help some with steering feel.

As long as you dont try to corner too much and just drive normal, it will be fine. i know alot of guys that drive without a front sway bar

2tonedmaro89

lmao i dont see a point as to driving w/ it off

1irocz2nv

You might as well buy a fox mustang if you want to take your swaybar off...hell it will handle like one...lol

lonsal

iTrader: (2)

I unbolted mine at the track and drove home. Normally I enjoy cornering in the car. Not that trip home. It was more like wallowing through the corners. It SUCKED. I've never unbolted the front sway bar again.

Lon

Xophertony

when i was getting ready to install my first TDS wonderbar i was replacing end links at the same time... i took the bar off and thought "what the hell" and drove to the 7-11 for a coke. it cornered like a 6 ton buick.

5678TA

moroso 220lbs/in sbc springs, 90/10's, NO front sway bar.. still has less roll than my 03 s-10 extreme(the factory handling package).. just a bit more roll than stock.. oh, poly bushings too.. *shrug*

rat infested

Hey Try It but expect it to drive like a dog
I removed the swy bar off my 82 Z28 and it is like driving an air boat with no steering in a force 9 storm.
Sure I do have a BBC but seriously if you dont HAVE to dont it SUCKS

Blue1989RS

I drove my V6 car around without the front bar just to see what would happen. I still had the 500in/lb fronts, 175in/lb rear, and a 25mm sway bar. I thought it would roll or snap oversteer, but it actually didn't drive that bad. I still put my 32mm back in when I got home though.

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

haha, it feels REALLY strange... Best way I can describe it was driving in an old '79 Ford F100 farm truck. Going around a corner made you feel like you were going to "fall" out the side window, or the truck was going to roll over onto it's side - and that's going maybe 30km/hr around a normal corner. If you've ever ridden in an old work truck, that's how it feels.
----------

haha, that's SOFT eh? Rest your pepsi on the hood and watch the car bottom out eh?

Starfish

iTrader: (1)

My front sway bar has been off for a couple of years with no complaints.Yeah, handling did decrease, but i dont prefer going fast through turns or trying to see how well the car handles. Im more concerned with the weight transfer. And for that I prefer the front sway bar being off. Just my opinion.

BADMAN

iTrader: (13)

The car came with a swaybar from the factory. Any questions?

5678TA

nah, more like a pepsi and a sub sandwich.. lol

MrDude_1

just try it so you know.

if you can deal with it, fine.
if you cant, no harm done.


i daily drive my car with 90/10s, no swaybar, a locker, ect... i just dont corner with it hard.... i dont enjoy corners with it.

ive had my car with with full handling mods, and with full drag mods... both are fun... the drag car just sucks at turning. personal pref IMO... only way to know what you prefer is to try it.

Guest

One of my cars I've had the front sway bar off so long I think I misplaced some bolts. Its not that bad, I just have to remind myself sometimes that I'm going into a corner a little hotter than I used to with the bar. I do have some stiff front springs and shocks though.

87 formy

Check out this 7 page thread on ls1tech:

http://ls1tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=682351

And if you haven't seen him around here, Sam Strano pretty much knows everything about f-body suspension.

Guest

lol if that isnt a bunch of drivel. Sam seems to think you take the bar off and the car is going to mysteriously jump off the road and into a ditch. I'd hate to sit here and make a list of all the vehicles that never came with a bar just to prove a point that you drive the car according to not only your abilities but those of the car. I'm sure he doesnt jump out of his F-bod into a rental Suburban and drive it the same.

I guess this means I should go g-tech my car and see how much worse it is without the bar, I know what it would register with.

cheppibear

As many have said before, leave it on for daily driving. If you never plan on going to the track, don't bother to even consider removing it. In fact upgrade the bushings.

I experimented with taking mine off and driving to and from Englishtown for racing and the only psychological thrill from not having a front sway bar is that the front end lift nice (but that thrill goes away on your first turn and then you are like OMG praying to stay in the turn).

Arctic White 91 RS

My Vette broke an end link one time when I was in college. I had to drive the car for a while with the front anti-sway bar "ineffective". I pretty much hated it. More body roll and dive.

For a daily driver, I wouldn't remove the front anti-sway bar. Pulling the bar at the track is a fine thing to do and will improve your times. Undo an end link at the track will do most of that too.

I think the front bar need to stays on for the street. I want my cars to handle better not worse. I want them to brake better not worse.

99+ precent of the time it won't matter bar or no bar but sometimes things happen and you need to swerve really hard to avoid an accident. I've had to dodge, dogs, deer, & cows before, so swerving counts out in the country too. The more stable the car is the better off you'll be when this occurs. Cars tend to dive when braking hard the bar helps reduce this some.

The other problem with pulling the bar is if someone ends up driving the car that doesn't know the bar has been removed or isn't prepared for how the car will act with the bar being removed. You know, like your Mom, Dad, Girlfriend, Wife, close friend, brother or sister. Sometimes, we're not the only ones that drive our cars.

On another note about front anti-sway bars...

About twenty-four years ago, while in college, I struck up a conversation with a Charlotte City police officer at a Taco Bell, late one night. He'd been on the force almost a year, was a car guy and all around a pretty decent fellow.

I asked him what was the wildest thing, he'd had to deal with in Charlotte. He said chasing a guy that had a very fast Camaro. I don't recall exactly what caused the chase, but it seems like the officer ended up behind the Camaro at a stop light and noticed the car was on slicks on the city streets. He hit the blue light and the Camaro took off. The Camaro pulled away from the cop and disappeared. (not really a surprise back in 1983)

Upset the Camaro had gotten away and mad at himself that he didn't get the tag number before the car took off, the cop came up on a sharp curve and found the Camaro rolled over on it's side. In the excitment, the guy took the curve too hard. The cop talked about how the car was modified, engine, slicks, skinnies, & no sway bar etc. The guy was more upset about his car and than the fact he was going to jail.

Of course the Camaro driver could have screwed up even with a front bar. While it is always wrong to run from the cops, and really stupid something makes me think, even a moron should know if you gonna do something like that make sure the car can carve a corner before you do it.

5678TA

to be honest, a g-tech would not be the best thing to use to measure handling with and without a bar.. it works by gravity. so you have 2 cars, one with a bar and one without, at the same speed, the bar-less car will measure more g-forces since it is rotating the g-meter even further.. assuming the car with the bar is flat in the turn and the other is leaning to the point of flip.. you can just tilt the g-tech in your hand, not moving at all, and it measures g-forces.. your best bet would actually be the skidpad or slalom..

just how i see it

1991CamaroRslow

iTrader: (3)

I ran my car with the 225 pound coilovers and no sway bar and it didn't corner that bad at all, I did run into a problem with a mysterious front end shudder when I would brake at the end of the track. I came home and reinstalled the sway bar and the shudder was gone after that. I doubt it would've felt as good as it did had I left the heavier stock springs in.

Guest

Ok, well then if it makes you happy I will calculate the g force based on diameter and time.

5678TA

oh dont mind me, i was just saying you might not get the best results with the g-tech.. do whatever you want.. i'm not gonna stop you..

Arctic White 91 RS

I don't think the G's are really the ultimate measure. It's more of the slalom.

The real question on the street would be can you maintain emergency control of the car just as well without the front anti-sway bar as you can with the front anti-sway bar.

Say some stupid four year old kid darts out in front of you one day chasing after his ball.

Can you still swerve and miss him and not wipe out?

Are your chances of avoiding a calamity better with the front sway bar or without it?

It's really a pretty simple question to me. When I had my 86 Camaro Sport Coupe back in 1988, a stupid kid was picking with his friends walking along the side of the road. He stepped right out in front of me. I swerved but thought I was going to still hit him. Just barely missed him and just barely swerved back in time to avoid another car. That was the one time, that car 10/10ths committed and at it's very limits when it actually mattered.

I think I'd would have hit him or the other car if my car had been harder to control or a little less agile...or wallowed like a 6 ton 52 Buick.

I'd just take it off or undo an end link at the track.

MrDude_1

unless it involves drag racing... then hes worse then clueless... atleast a clueless person wont go on ranting about how stupid your dragracing setup is.



as for the usual swerving to miss a kid argument.. i hope you DO swerve and run into a utility poll... so i can yank your *** out of the car and beat the **** out of you..

if ANY of you are going so fast in a neighborhood that your have to swerve to avoid anything, you deserve to have some sense beat into you.

Guest

I plan on doing some cone testing as well, just for kicks. I'll post up whatever happens, just for good reference although its going to be for MY car and not everyone elses that will surely behave a little different.

I dont understand the safety argument myself. A few years back I worked with my dad on a regular basis, our vehicle was a 94 1 ton Chevy van loaded with about 1000# of stuff... +/-. So basically the argument I'm seeing by those against removing the bar say that van shouldnt even be on the road... because I can assure you that van did much worse in fast manuevers than my TA does right now without the front bar. Will it reduce the cornering and handling capability of the car? Sure. But like I said before, I dont see much point in listening to those who think the car will suddenly jump off the road into a ditch. Maybe if you have a stiff rear bar, no front, drag springs, drag shocks, slicks+skinnies... yea, trailer it or drive accordingly.

Arctic White 91 RS

The kid that stepped out in front of me, was walking a the edge of a four lane highway with his friends. I was going the speed limit. At was around 7:45am in the morning.

As for the truck/van vs no sway bar argument, the issue is the truck or van didn't have something removed to make it less safe on the street but the car did.

Will it matter most of the time if the bar is pulled, if you tailor your driving habits? Not really.

Could it matter in an emergency on the street, sure. Can it happend to you? Sure. Will it happen to you? Who knows.

1991CamaroRslow

iTrader: (3)

The argument is ignorant period hands down, the mods should close this childish crap. Taking the front sway bar off reduces your cars ability to maneuver if you take it off take some time to get used to how it drives now just like you would do with ANY OTHER MOD! Moral of the story, if you decide to take the sway bar out learn to drive it somewhere safe before you go taking it out on the highway. To close the story when I first bought my Camaro it had a broken end link that I fixed MONTHS after I purchased it. My friend at the time had an 89 Z28, just out of curiosity we looked under his car and low and behold BROKEN END LINK. We never noticed then and we didn't wreck you know why... WE KNEW OUR CARS.... OH GOD now I'm feeding into the argument, I'm done.

nelapse

iTrader: (17)

Yeah I pretty much got the point. I have never driven without a front sway bar before. That is why I asked. I have removed the rear sway bar without any problems.

irocman88

what if he just left it unhooked on one side? same difference in handling, right?

TonyC

iTrader: (1)

Well, for what it's worth I drove around with no front sway bar for a year and a half or so. It really isn't bad as EVERYONE has said, just don't expect to carve corners. Would I feel safe in an emergency situation? Probably. Is it for everyone? No. It's only worthwhile if you go to the track often and need to eek that extra 1/10,000th of a second off of your time (which I probably didn't in hindsight). The car did get a weird pirate-ship-type swaying at the top end of the track though with it off

Shagwell

KYB front struts and stock WS6 sway bar w/ poly bushings and I get 1.66-1.69 60ft's on 17" wheels. Could I get better transfer with the bar removed and 90/10 struts? Sure. Would the car handle anything like it currently does? No.
Personally I won't run 90/10's even on a race built car. They tend to stay up as you go down the track, thus allowing extra air-flow under the car, thus making it less stable. As for the sway bar, I am building spherical end links to allow zero bind when both tires stop but full anti-roll when one tire moves differently than the other.

Guest

Ok, I plan to do some more testing with much more accuracy, but this is my initial report since I got the car out of mothballs today:

Based on previous results, same location, the car pulls about .96g. Today I ran the car there and I'm sure there's a little more in it but it didnt feel so good so I left it at that, for now. It was .80g, so yes of course its less. No surprise there. I suspect .82-84 isnt out of reach, just wouldnt be a whole lot of fun.

The turn in and transitional capability of the car seems ok, but the feel is a little weird. The front lifts more than I'm used to in a turn, and the first time I corrected but it was unnecessary. Second pass I stayed in it and it was fine, just a bit much lift across the front thats usually not there. Its not as quick as my Ranger, but then again the Ranger isnt stock. Its faster than my Windstar minivan by far (now that thing doesnt handle or corner for nothin), so I'm not sure where the fear comes from other than the nut behind the wheel. In normal circumstances, it'll easily outdo what the minivan does so the only way I'd wreck the car is if I made a move I normally take at 70 instead of 60 without the bar there. I suspect the rear would come around based on feel (did not do that before without help), and I fully plan to see what the car does once it gets out of shape.

More to follow...

Pablo

iTrader: (1)

Mad max is right,

Some of you guys are real chicken littles. Almost every car I have owned has had the front sway bar removed. My old thirdgen had a completely stock suspension with worn out shocks all around and NO swaybars.. neither the front NOR the back. I decided to just control rear end movement with airbags rather than go through the trouble of putting it on my 9" rear.

The car STILL handled better than my roommates base model dodge neon. Did it handle well? Hell no, it was set up for drag. If you drove the car like a normal person you would never even notice anything amiss with the suspension.

My current ride is an 11 second Turbo Buick with no front sway bar, bias ply sportsman skinnies in the front (7.5" on a 3.5" weld draglite) 90/10 drag shocks in the front, 50/50s in the rear, MT drag radials, one air bag, I drive this car EVERYWHERE. I live in an area where there is not one straight or flat road. Never had any problem whatsoever in the 3 years ive been driving this combo, never had any problem in the 5 years prior while I had my Thirdgen in that state.

I'll reiterate, if you drive the car like a normal person (like any other non gearhead on the road) you would never ever notice there was something different about the car. My buick handles about on par with my roommates Neon that is completely stock.

If you are having problems with a car with no front bar then you are driving it well outside of the realm of your (and the car's) capabilities. I would suggest then to stop driving it like an idiot and get some driving practice at a local kart track or something.

Norm Peterson

May I suggest a lane change to the left, then maybe a rather short straight (a couple of car lengths or so?), followed by a lane change to the right. One can reasonably expect to have to perform that sort of maneuver in normal street driving for any number of reasons, but since it isn't nearly as demanding as a tight 5-cone slalom, you aren't asking the dragstrip car to compete at auto-X. Set up a few cones and chalk-mark their locations so that the test is as controlled as reasonably practical. Fair enough?


Norm

Guest

Sure, I can do that.