QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

I recently purchased 3 different height-adjustable panhard kits. Some of the stuff in these kits was surprisingly bad which is why I'm sharing my own experience. I'll walk through the pitfalls that I saw and some of the tweaks I made along the way.

I already had an adjustable panhard bar with 3/4" spherical rod ends, so I just needed the brackets and revised track-bar brace. That doesn't make this any more difficult though as you can mix and match a lot of this stuff as you like. The products I purchased are,

* Heidts RC-567, Panhard Bar Relocation Brackets and Mounts
* UMI 2064, Panhard Bar Relocation kit
* Founders Performance 20246, Height Adjustable Panhard Rod Relocation Kit

Now let's see the first contender....


Heidts

Pro's: Only kit that uses 9/16" bolts for a proper fit to a panhard bar with spherical rod ends. Track-bar brace is STOUT! Uses good quality materials.
Con's: None of the parts fit my car, so the Pro's really don't matter.

Bottom line is the fit was horrible on my car. You can skip this part of the writeup and not miss a thing, or you can read on and see why it's so bad.

Picture below shows the kit RC-567. Or does it? Actually nobody really knows. Heidts website doesn't have the right info; Sales people don't know what actually comes with the kit; I got some duplicate parts (not shown); And I think I'm missing some bolts but can't prove it. If you like mystery and surprise then this is for you!

Track-bar brace takes a high path and lays hard against my plastic 4th gen fuel tank. That was a show stopper for me. I'm not sure whether or not it will clear a stock 3rd gen tank but literally nothing else in the kit fit my car so good luck if you try. The thru bolt is 9/16" and requires oversizing holes in the stock bracket. This is irreversible if you ever want to go back to stock. I simply prepped my stock track-bar brace for 9/16" bolt (explanation below) so it's ready to go back on if I ever want to raise my panhard back to stock height.




Body side bracket (passenger) is boxed on three sides and wraps around the outside of the stock bracket. This makes it super easy to fit a panhard bar with standard width (1-7/8" stack height) rod end bushings (you'll need to do some shimming with washers that are supplied with the kit). Comes with a large diameter spacer which I like. Lots of grinding needed to fit bracket to car but it can be done without compromising the bracket. The top mounting holes were misplaced so I had to weld shut those holes and re-drill. The bracket also protrudes some toward the wheel, so maybe pay attention to clearance if you're trying to stuff every crevice of the rear wheel well with tire.

Panhard height is adjustable in approximately 1" increments but only the bottom 2 positions are usable because the top hole is blocked by the stock bracket, and the adjacent bolt hole is too close to fit washers in both locations. Uses 9/16" bolts for panhard bar which is perfect for a standard 3/4" spherical rod end, and Heidts is the only kit to get that detail right.







Axle side bracket (driver) ties into the lower control arm mount for extra support. That's all I can tell you because it would not install on my old Strange 12-bolt with real GM 3rd gen F-body brackets. I will admit to not having a stock 10-bolt but I have the same brackets. All I can say is good luck to you if you decide to try.




I'm keeping my stock track-bar brace in case I want to raise the panhard bar back up to stock location. The original thru hole for bolt is actually quite large and the stock bolt sits on some nubs inside the ID of the hole. Those nubs are some kind of super hard metal and will destroy a drill bit. I ended up grinding it down with a carbide die grinder. Then just zip a 37/64" drill bit through the hole and you've got a nice fit to 9/16" bolt.

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

UMI

Pro's: Uses high quality materials and components. Very strong steel. Adjustable in 1/2" increments. Extra pieces to beef up the axle side mounts.
Con's: Details aren't well executed. Intended for axles with 3" tube.

My top level summary is UMI has great ideas that are poorly executed. This kit needs some rework to get things right. UMI could easily knock it out of the park with a few tweaks.

Picture below is the kit (2064). Kit comes with body side bracket (passenger), axle side bracket (driver), brace to axle tube, and extra weld-in brace that fits into the underside of spring pocket. You can get it complete with track-bar brace and panhard bar too, but I didn't need any of that because of the pile of parts I already had on hand. UMI uses the hardest and strongest steel of all the kits I bought. In fact, it will destroy a high speed steel drill bit, so you better have carbide bits if you're going to open up any holes for larger bolts.




Body side bracket (passenger) is two pieces that slap on the sides of the stock bracket. Some grinding is needed but the holes line up nicely. Panhard height is adjustable in approximately 1/2" increments. Panhard slot is sized for 14mm bolt. You may need to slightly ream the slot if using 9/16" bolt with spherical rod ends.




Installing per UMI directions will result in a bracket width that is too narrow for off-the-shelf spherical rod end bushings with 1-7/8" stack height. UMI makes a shorter aluminum rod end bushing (2021A) for 3/4" spherical rod ends and 9/16" bolt. Aluminum is not a good material selection though, and the supplied 14mm bolt will have a bit of bearing slap. Upsizing to 9/16" helps that issue. Swapping the rear plate to the backside of the stock bracket (similar to Heidts layout) will make it easy to use stainless steel bushings with standard 1-7/8" stack height, but you'll need to buy longer bolts for all three locations (2 mounts and 1 panhard bar) and shim the gaps with washers.

Left: Standard 3/4" rod end bushing with 1-7/8" stack height in stainless steel (Kartek KTK34916SRT)
Right: UMI aluminum bushing with reduced stack height (2021A)




Pictured below is stock bolt (left) with stepped shank, UMI bolt and spacer (center), and Heidts 9/16" bolt and spacer (right). Stock bolt has a stepped shank (12mm and 14mm) with matching holes in the stock brackets. UMI and Founders use 12mm bolts for a true bolt-on solution without having to oversize any holes in the stock bracket. However, that leaves the bolt sloppy on the 14mm side. Might matter, might not, just informing you. My own preference is to use 14mm bolt to more precisely orient the bracket to the holes. I drilled all the holes for larger and slightly longer bolts with more thread engagement.

UMI employs a small diameter spacer. Heidts and Founders spacers are huge by comparison with a lot less contact pressure when the bolts are torqued. This is another reason why I switched out bolts and spacers.




UMI axle side bracket is by far the sturdiest of all the kits and works okay for bolt-on applications. However, for weld-on applications the benefits of its strength is offset by not fitting flush to the stock bracket, with gaps that are so large that it is not easily weldable. UMI incorporates standoffs (washers) welded to the bracket that does not allow it to sit flush to the back side and causes the bracket to rock on the mounts. The width of the bracket is not quite right either, causing more gaps in other locations too. The Founders bracket by comparison fits like a glove with lots of good welding edge.







UMI is the only kit to offer a special feature of a weld-in brace under the spring pocket. I cut down one of the legs to provide better access to bolts. (note: Panhard bracket fits really nice, huh? It's not the UMI, that's why. )




UMI has a brace rod that supports the panhard bracket at the axle. The brace attaches to the bolt for the panhard rod end, and extends to a saddle that is clamped to the axle tube. The rod length has to be adjusted every time the panhard is moved up or down. The brace uses an aluminum bushing with only 1/8" insert into the rod end, including the radius. That means there is less than 1/8" of aluminum supporting the rod end. I double checked with UMI that maybe I received the wrong parts but they said it was correct. That, folks, is absurd! I fixed this by swapping out for 9/16" bolt, using a 5/8" to 9/16" reducer sleeve for the rod end, and machining the UMI aluminum bushings into thick washers.

Left: UMI 5/8" rod end bushing with 1/8" wide insert
Right: Same rod end bushing modified into a thick washer. Drilled for larger 9/16" bolt (37/64" drill bit) and ground flat.




Panhard bolt assembly mounted to panhard rod. 5/8" to 9/16" reducer sleeve from QS Components in Muncie, IN slipped over a 9/16" grade 8 bolt (Caterpillar 8S-4749). Assembly is ready to accept the UMI 5/8" rod end for brace bar to axle tube.







Other end of the brace rod attaches to a saddle that clamps to the axle. Saddle and u-bolt are made for 3" axle tube and that's the only version offered. They really need to offer an option for 2.75" axle tube. I had a 2.75" u-bolt made at a local truck shop (pictured below) but still didn't like the fit. Bracket has way too little contact to the tube for my liking, and the saddle is very tall and doesn't fit under my sway bar. UMI offers blocks to move the sway bar if you want (not included with kit). I had just installed a freakin' fantastic Detroit Speed sway bar and I'll be damned if I was disturbing it.

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

Founders

Pro's: Best fit to vehicle. Most finely adjustable panhard height. Did I say it fits?
Con's: Lower strength steel than all the others. Will bend if not careful when tightening bolts. Desperately needs hardened washers in the kit.

My top level summary is Founders is the most well executed in terms of fitment, but the materials aren't as good as the others. This is the kit I used on my car with some upgrades and a little cross pollination with the UMI kit.

Founders track-bar brace fits nicely and clears my 4th gen fuel tank. Pictured below is comparison of Founders (bottom) and Heidts (top). The Founders takes a lower path for more clearance to fuel tank.




The body side bracket (passenger) is boxed on 3 sides. Some grinding is needed to make fit but the holes line up nicely. Panhard height is infinitely adjustable in the slot. The slot is sized for a 14mm bolt which will have a bit of bearing slap in a standard 3/4" rod end. You'll need to enlarge the slot if you want to use a 9/16" bolt. Bracket width is a smidge too narrow for standard bushings with 1-7/8" stack height but it will slip in due to the "bendy nature" of the soft steel. Although, it makes the panhard bar VERY DIFFICULT to slide when adjusting panhard height. You're going to need a dead blow hammer for that job. Also, the bracket folds in like a taco if the spacers are too short, so spending time getting the shimming right makes all the difference in the world in terms of final fitment after the bolts are tightened. (You have to source your own shims.)

Founders uses 12mm bolts to mount the bracket to vehicle, similar to UMI. Again, I prefer 14mm bolts at these locations but that does require oversizing holes in the brackets. The provided washers are too soft and will deform when the bolts are tightened, especially at the panhard adjustment slot. I used some 3mm thick steel hardened washers (Caterpillar 7X-0510) to solve that problem.

Pictured below is my installation of the Founders body side bracket with oversized and longer bolts, hardened washers, and the provided 14mm bolt at the panhard rod. One of these days I'm going to round up a longer bolt for the panhard bar, and switch to a "top lock" (all steel) lock nut.




Axle side bracket (driver) is a perfect fit. Holes line up and it's nice and flush at pretty much every surface making it easily weldable. Can't really say anything bad other than the steel is kind of soft. Everything fits, panhard fits. It just fits!




Founders (picture top) uses a brace to the axle tube similar to UMI (pictured bottom), but ties into the bottom of the bracket instead of the panhard bolt. Set the rod length once and never have to adjust it again. The Founders axle saddle is a good fit to 2.75" axle tubes, and has a low profile that fit under my sway bar (yay!). Although the steel is soft and it bent when I tightened the u-bolts. I'm going to add some bracing to prevent that in the future.

Also, the UMI spherical rod ends are higher quality. This isn't an articulating joint so I'm not sure it really matters much, but I swapped out for the UMI rod ends anyway (but kept the better Founders rod end bushings). And I used the UMI weld-in y-brace for my install as well.



Founders brace-bar rod end bushings with full depth of engagement. Proper.

scooter

iTrader: (11)

Nice write up. Hardly anyone goes into, and executes, these fine attention to detail

V6canvas

iTrader: (1)

Lots of great info. Wonder if any of these companies would consider tweaking their products if they saw this?

Having side by side comparisons instead of someone simply saying that brand x stuff is great/ the worst thing ever has to be rare for them.

UMI Sales

Very nice write up. And yes, companies do watch this kind of thing. Especially when real data is posted.

ramey

IROCZman15

iTrader: (25)

one heck of a product review and writeup. excellent work here Qwk !

1985_IROC

Yes, very detailed write up. I’m learning so much thanks to all of you guys. Much appreciated!

TEDSgrad

iTrader: (4)

Good Comparison!
Not a fan of the curvy bars or the slots on the brackets.
Axle side has a lot of stress - I mean a lot. So a good weld or even bracing is a good idea - though not sure about the spring pocket bracing.
Spherical ends are great, but more maintenance. Certainly, more rotation on the axle side vs the body side is a good idea.
Too low with the PHB means upping the spring rate, so keep in mind; and shock valving off.
For added comparison, I used the Jegster axle side only (bolted and welded), Lakewood adj bar with Del-Sphere ends on the axle side - on a 12 bolt, too. More budget minded with some adjustability.

redneckjoe

Very detailed review with good explanation of the pro's and con's.

When i did a mild tub and narrow, ended up making my own mount. I'm cheap, lol

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

It's a great idea. I'd guess it's a lesson learned from tracking on @Beater79TA car and they could tell us the story behind it.

Beater79TA

To be honest, we've never used a panhard relocation kit. We've been running the UMI Watts link for the last 5 years to adjust roll center and keep the axle centered. That plus the rear coilovers and we haven't had a use for the rear spring perches in a long time.

SteelDirigible

iTrader: (2)

Adding my photos of the Non-adjustable PHB relocation kit from Speed Engineering. It is listed for 93-02 Camaro. Minor modification of one of the bracket plates was required.
Kit clears the 4th gen tank for me as well, it's very close to it. I didn't get good pics of the kit before installation but the kit includes the new brace, two flat bracket plates, a sleeve, and a nut and bolt. The kit was $104.99
Speed Engineering Panhard Rod Relocation Kit

Below shows the modification I had to make for the bracket plate to the rear side of the factory bracket, this was necessary to make it sit flush. Given the thickness of the factory material here, I'm not too worried about the integrity of this piece after cutting.
It would have been nice if it were a one piece bracket to ensure they are square. My factory bracket was a bit mangled, which was the real reason I got the kit.



I used new factory style stepped bolts from Spohn for the upper holes, since the one included with the kit doesn't fit the factory hole. They aren't really long enough to use for this with the added plate thickness. I was able to get better thread engagement by using a clamp to pull it together and an impact gun to tighten it down. The Panhard bar still fit in the brackets easily so it's not too tight there. Possibly just a result of my messed up factory bracket.

IROCZman15

iTrader: (25)

looks good. good photos.
Is it just the pictures, or do you barely have just enough thread engagement on those bolts/nuts? If it were me, I would certainly like to see some threads protruding through the back-side of those nuts.

SteelDirigible

iTrader: (2)

Yes, I would say that I have barely enough. Here’s a better pic after getting a little more out of it. You can also see how messed up my factory bracket is.

ESCIROC

definitely would like to see 1-3 threads coming out of the nut.

McLovin1181

I've used the Founders full panhard relocation kit for 3 Autocross seasons now.
nothing has broken or bent.
That's good because I tend to break suspension parts.
Also keep in mind lowering the panhard bar lowers the roll center. So you will need FAR more rear spring to counter the fact that the chassis has more leverage on the axle. I wouldn't use any relocation kit with springs under 175lbs rate for cars that AutoX/Road race ex ex.

​​​​​​I Have a video on installing and welding it.
note: the aluminum panhard bar was flexing 1/2in on race tires so I replaced it with a unit from UBE. Probably fine for street use though.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=hV_ovYfZ384

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

Who is UBE ? What does that stand for?

ShiftyCapone

iTrader: (7)

Unobtanium Engineering

QwkTrip

iTrader: (22)

Ah, that would mean homemade. Got it!

iansane

iTrader: (1)

Unbalanced Engineering? If so, haven't heard that name in quite awhile.

t/aws61985

iTrader: (2)

Great info here. I run UMI's kit on my 86 Trans am. I was in the market for one of these again for my Daytona.

McLovin1181

Ya, it's a panhard bar from Jason at Unbalanced Engineering.
I used his bar because it has Aurora rod ends. Those rod ends are a HUGE step up in quality over other rod ends.
Plus Jason is super knowledgeable when it comes to 3rd and 4th gens. So buying his stuff means I can bug him with technical questions.
Start talking Motion ratios and roll centers and 99% of 3rd gen owner's eyes gloss over. Ha ha.