slow_90firebird

Alright, here is my issue. Today after I washed the car, I turned the headlights on to clean the lenses. I pushed the button, and the passenger one flipped right up as usual. The driver one, however, went up halfway and stopped. I reached over and helped it out a little, and it went the rest of the way up. Now, every time, they both come up but the driver one takes a while, and struggles up. Also, it takes longer to shut all the way. I opened the hood, and the little **** on the right one spins for a split second while it opens up, but when the left light is all the way open, it still spins for a few seconds on that side.

Also, heres another question I had. Is there a way to keep them up all the time? I go to college in NH and it snows alot, so when winter comes around I want to permantly leave them flipped up so they dont get frozen shut. My buddies dodge stealth has a seperate flip up-down button from the actual headlight switch, but for whatever reason GM didnt do that.

Pocket

iTrader: (24)

Sounds like the bushings have disintegrated in your motor gear

This is a 30 cent fix or a $5 fix depending on what you buy

Cheap way is to buy a fat hot-glue-gun gluestick and cut it into short pieces
$5 way is to order a rebuild kit and get the small bushings

Either way the fix is the same

The rebuild process is pretty strait forward
When you get to the white gear, open it up and youll find a whole mess of yellowed crumbs. This is what your bushings have been ground up to
Put the new bushings in and your set

Yes you can keep them up at all times

Look around the motor itself and youll find a 2 wire plug near them
Unplug this and they will stay where ever you leave them

Take everything your read about 4th gen motor gears and forget it because its not at all applicable here

A new gear will NOT fix this

CharcoalBird

iTrader: (4)

I don't know if there is a How-To in the tech article section or anywhere else, but if there isn't I wouldn't mind making one. I've helped A LOT of people change out the bushings for this same reason.

Pocket

iTrader: (24)

Please post a pictorial guide and how-to replace sheared screws

I tried to take pics of my last rebuild but the pics are mostly blurred

slow_90firebird

Alright, thanks guys. I have been searching more, and found also that TDS makes a rebuild kit. But if hot glue sticks works, I might do that too, because I hate ordering online.

The thing is, I read their installation instructions for the new bushings, and didnt understand a bit of it, all went over my head. Oh, and the left one doesnt go up at all anymore unless I help it.

Is this really an easy fix? Because I change oil and mount tires for a living, and I popped the hood and had not the first idea how the flip-up lights even work, nevermind how to take the motors out.

Also, how expensive are all new motors?

Pocket

iTrader: (24)

New motors are around $100 each

They are held in by 4x 10mm screws and a two wire plug

You need some finesse taking them out because you have to bend your arms in so many positions or you can remove the ground effects and remove them from the underside

Once you take them out then go to a clean and air conditioned place to rebuild them

Take your time, there are plenty of small parts that can be stubborn

slow_90firebird

Well, see thats my problem. This is my only car and my DD so i cant really drive it without headlights.

Unless, is there a way to take the motors out and leave the lights popped up so I can drive the car for a few days?

Pocket

iTrader: (24)

Once you remove the motor the little arm thing will just flop around so you can lift and drop the headlight by hand

Just rig the lil arm securely and the headlight wont move until you let it down

CharcoalBird

iTrader: (4)

Changing out the bushings takes approx. 20-30min per motor if you know what your doing already. Maybe i'll do it tonight. I don't need to change them out right now, but i'll do it anyway. I'm going to start from removal of the motor, to opening the gear part of the motor and what to look for, where the bushings(glue stick pieces if you decide to go with those go), clean up, grease, putting it back together, and putting it back into the car.
I'm also going to remove the whole headlight unit, it'll make it easier to take pictures of what the whole thing looks like outside the car. Plus it's much easier than trying to remove just the motor only.
Also, i've run into 2 different types of motors. I think 87 and older models had different ones than 88-92. Not a big difference but I happen to have both types on my car.

Pocket

iTrader: (24)

82-86 Has 3 wire systems that are not rebuildable

85-92 had 2 wire like the one posted here

The 85-86 overlap years had both styles, with the 3 wire motors mostly on the lower end firebirds

85-88 Fieros also had the 2 wire motors, but the drivers and pass were flipped

C4 corvettes are also supposed to use this motor but I havent parted any out or had to repair any and cannot confirm this

deadbird

lonsal (TDS, advertiser) has a rebuild kit for the 2 wire motors. He also has an instruction manual pdf on his site.

lonsal

iTrader: (2)

I actually have kits for the older 3-wire motors and the newer 2-wire motors. Pocket has the dates a bit off. The three wire motors were used through 1986 model year Firebird and Fiero. The switch to the improved two-wire motor was with the 1987 model year for both Firebird and Fiero.

Lon Salgren
Top-Down Solutions

CharcoalBird

iTrader: (4)

The instructions are good, I think more pictures are needed though. I'll take step by step photos on sunday, forgot my camera at my girl's place.

popballz

iTrader: (-1)

i used this tutorial

http://www.bfranker.badz28.com/headl...dex.htm#3rdgen

and it worked great... i would rather use rubber tubbing then glue sticks

(and it works great)

stormy69

i need help as well please. i just bought my first 3rd gen 2 weeks ago, didnt test the lights first.... anyhoo they dont flip up but come on. i can also see the motors spin but cant even help the lights up. so i pull one off today, drill out the rivits, clean it up and reassemble. tried the lights before i reinstalled and the pass side came up???? plug wires in for the one i disassembled and it raises as it should when i plug it in but it wont go down. this is keeping me from driving the car. anyone had a similar issue?

lonsal

iTrader: (2)

Please post what year of Firebird you own. The 82-86 have a three-wire motor. 87-92 have the two wire motor. Repair methods for the two are completely different. If you "drilled out rivets" then you have a three wire unit. Please confirm this.

Regardless if two-wire or three wire motor, if it went up, but failed to go down, check your tail light fuse. If the tail light fuse os blown it will cause the symptom you describe. On two wire motors, it could also be a bad headlight control module.

Lon

stormy69

good point, 86 3 wire motors
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and.... only the one i tore apart didnt go back down

and alone, the passenger side, almost regularly, will go up and donw without the drivers side hooked up... these things are a pain!