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Hello All,
Just car my 83 TA back from the body shop after a complete show
quality paint job. I have a question on installing all new TTop
weather stripping. I have a new black bar, the 4 tracks I took off
have been painted also. Should I seal under the new black bar
with 3M sealant or silicone and do I need the channels with the new t-top
seal I bought. They are soft seal. I will search the forums for more
info. Just want to do it right.
I will post pics when i can.
Thanks!!!
Al
Paint does really look terrific.
I used the 3M Weatherstripping Adhesive and I also used this rubber with the adhesive back from this co.http://store20.prestostore.com/catal...tore/pd2145453
If you need this rubber ASAP you'll have to call them because it takes about 2 weeks to get it.
I've used SoftSeal for several other parts of the car and would be very hesitant to use them for the T-Top seal. I have NEVER seen or used their T-Top seals,...... I can only say that I will never use SoftSeal for any of the other areas that I have tried to use them before - unless I had too ( Hardtop door window, Outer door, ect.... )
IIRC the 4 channels used for T-Tops ( A & B pillar ) had a thin pad installed on the back of them. I would replicate that pad if they are missing, but the channels don't need any other sealer on them - until after they are mounted.
This is the sealer I use when re-setting a T-Top Bar:
I run it all the way along the channel built into the roof along the front and back outer channel ( not on the inside channel ),.... I also use the same stuff - but a smaller "bead" ( 1/8" IIRC ) inside the channels of the T-Top bar. ( again - in the outer channel - but not the inside channel ) Once it's laid in place I use a screwdriver to re-create the "lip" of the channel before beginning to install the seal.
Chevy used a small square patch of sealer over a couple of the holes in the roof and under the front and rear T-Top bar mounting holes. - you might remember seeing this when you removed the T-Bar ) I would add some type of seal or pad to those spots - as well as a tiny dab of sealer over the screw mounting holes - before the T-Bar is installed. It's also important to put a good amount of sealer at the very front and rear of the T-Bar before setting the bar in place,.... THIS IS WHERE MANY LEAKS START !!
* You might notice that the green car shows urethane in the outer channel, and the blue car with it above the outer channel. I've done this both ways and now I do both,..... a 1/4" bead IN the channel, and a 1/8" bead along the top of the channel ! ( overkill - maybe... ! )
The front T-Top mounting "corners" are also very important. I like to use the urethane pictured because its soft, pliable, and doesn't harden. Your car should have the "early" T-Top mounting brackets....... The "late" style is different and I have no idea how the SoftSeal T-Top weather-strip is made. ( you might want to get a different pair of mounts depending on how the softseal is made ) Here are a few more pics that might help explain the difference:
Some quick info about the T-Top Mounts:
I do not know what years they were changed... but the fact that the seals and brackets (on the blue car) came from a Lexmar Top Thirdgen is probably significant. I'm also not sure how much of an improvement would be noticed by simply installing them in an early car either. I say that because the seal itself would need to have the mounting "perch" molded into it in order for the bracket to hold it properly,...... so the newer seal and the newer bracket would need to be used in combination in an older car.
Pic of newer style seal and mount from inside the car:
I had the instructions from the box of GM seals when I did mine almost 20 yrs ago but for the life of I can't find them...
It detailed how, where and what the factory recommended as what to use and where as far as sealant goes.. It may also be in the service manual.
Sorry to bring this back from the dead, but I'm in the process of replacing not only the seals, but the T-bar and the A and B pillar channels after paint. I did some quick googling and that Window Weld stuff also comes in a caulking style tube. Given that you're indicating different size beads in different places, do you think that would be easier/simpler, or do you stick with the rolls of the stuff? Also, is this the sealer that that you used to replace the foam under the T bar and behind the pillar channels?
I have "Metro Moulded" brand stripping installed (without adhesive atm to allow adjustments), and it looks like adding sealant around the T-bar is a good idea; my car has mysterious leaks around that area too.
I always avoid using the tube style "window weld" because that stuff gets hard - real hard - and while it's going to get you a good seal,... there is NUTHING that you can do to any of the parts once everything is installed. ( Every have to cut a windshield out ?? ) The "rolled" urethane sealer stays soft so if anything ever needs to be removed in the future for any reason,.... everything can be diss-assembled again without destroying everything.
Ya', a smaller bead 'rolled' urethane can be used behind the seal "tracks" too. A thin foam might be a better idea simply because of the "uniformity" of the foam. ( think: roll of double sided tape from 3m for example ) The seal behind the weather-stripping tracks should be a VERY layer......
The area just in front - and right in back - of the exposed T-Top Bar is where I've found most leaks begin. Once the water gets in thru one of those seams,... it finds anywhere it can to get inside the car.
I've used SoftSeal for several other parts of the car and would be very hesitant to use them for the T-Top seal. I have NEVER seen or used their T-Top seals,...... I can only say that I will never use SoftSeal for any of the other areas that I have tried to use them before - unless I had too ( Hardtop door window, Outer door, ect.... )
IIRC the 4 channels used for T-Tops ( A & B pillar ) had a thin pad installed on the back of them. I would replicate that pad if they are missing, but the channels don't need any other sealer on them - until after they are mounted.
This is the sealer I use when re-setting a T-Top Bar:
I run it all the way along the channel built into the roof along the front and back outer channel ( not on the inside channel ),.... I also use the same stuff - but a smaller "bead" ( 1/8" IIRC ) inside the channels of the T-Top bar. ( again - in the outer channel - but not the inside channel ) Once it's laid in place I use a screwdriver to re-create the "lip" of the channel before beginning to install the seal.
Chevy used a small square patch of sealer over a couple of the holes in the roof and under the front and rear T-Top bar mounting holes. - you might remember seeing this when you removed the T-Bar ) I would add some type of seal or pad to those spots - as well as a tiny dab of sealer over the screw mounting holes - before the T-Bar is installed. It's also important to put a good amount of sealer at the very front and rear of the T-Bar before setting the bar in place,.... THIS IS WHERE MANY LEAKS START !!
* You might notice that the green car shows urethane in the outer channel, and the blue car with it above the outer channel. I've done this both ways and now I do both,..... a 1/4" bead IN the channel, and a 1/8" bead along the top of the channel ! ( overkill - maybe... ! )
The front T-Top mounting "corners" are also very important. I like to use the urethane pictured because its soft, pliable, and doesn't harden. Your car should have the "early" T-Top mounting brackets....... The "late" style is different and I have no idea how the SoftSeal T-Top weather-strip is made. ( you might want to get a different pair of mounts depending on how the softseal is made ) Here are a few more pics that might help explain the difference:
Some quick info about the T-Top Mounts:
I do not know what years they were changed... but the fact that the seals and brackets (on the blue car) came from a Lexmar Top Thirdgen is probably significant. I'm also not sure how much of an improvement would be noticed by simply installing them in an early car either. I say that because the seal itself would need to have the mounting "perch" molded into it in order for the bracket to hold it properly,...... so the newer seal and the newer bracket would need to be used in combination in an older car.
Pic of newer style seal and mount from inside the car:
Hope this helps !
John,
Great article and pics. Thank you for your time to document your process and post as an article. Best I have found on this topic. Glad to see someone else who is not a fan of weatherstrip adhesive for this type project. Can you please confirm the diameter sizes for me? Are they 1/4" & 1/8" or 1/4 & 3/8"? The auto body supply vendors in my area say they can not get the 1/8". If it is 1/8" can you please provide me with a part number or a supplier?
My email, jajgmtech@yahoo.com
John,
Great article and pics. Thank you for your time to document your process and post as an article. Best I have found on this topic. Glad to see someone else who is not a fan of weatherstrip adhesive for this type project. Can you please confirm the diameter sizes for me? Are they 1/4" & 1/8" or 1/4 & 3/8"? The auto body supply vendors in my area say they can not get the 1/8". If it is 1/8" can you please provide me with a part number or a supplier?
My email, jajgmtech@yahoo.com
Thanx for the feedback I just took a quick peek online and you will not need to find a specific vendor for the 3m Windo-Weld. You can find it pretty easy and it appears that there is 3 different sized beads that can be bought: 1/4", 5/15" & 3/8. The package itself has changed a little compared to the pic I posted above too,..... you can get a look at Summit Racings 3m Windo-Weld here:
I must have described the sizes a bit wrong back when I originally wrote this post. I did use the smaller bead ribbon on the inner channel and a larger bead on the outer channel. IIRC the first time I re-sealed a roof using this stuff all I had bought was the 3/8" and 'stretched" it out so it would fit better in the channels. Only after that 1st re-seal was finished did I learn that this stuff was available in several sizes. I'm pretty sure that the last time I re-sealed a roof I just used the 1/4" on the inner and 5/6'ths on the outer.
I agree with you about the softer sealing. However, many forget that moisture from the inside of your car ALSO seeps up to your T top area and back of roof, front windshield etc, and can stay there and rust or start rust due to humid factors! So this time, I have added a coating of truck bed protection. I have brushed it on, and will spray from the inside of the car, the protection into the chambers. This will give a much harder layer and prevent moisture coming in from the inside of the car to create rot. Having restored the car roof with another roof, I have no intention of ever having to do this again! But one does have to be very fastidious in covering all areas, and even the outside top portion with a sealer, as this car has layers of metal, especially on the roof top! All those little crevices let in water, or will eventually if they are not closed! I have found that even with the best seals, glues etc, you still have to take more steps in prepping the metal both inside and outside of the car. When doing this, it will really add extra protection against weather. Living in Canada we get extremes. And so, when you drive your car everyday like I do, this extra time to cover all your areas pays off. Even spray down into the window channels in the front and across the front from the inside. This area gathers moisture from condensation. I have found that on high humidity days, you can get what seems like an outside leak, only to find it really is condensation from the inside of the car! Hope this helps too guys Cheers!
01-08-2016, 07:22 AM
Cheers!