This thread is for those who don't have 1LE or other big brake swaps.

What are the best ways to improve braking performance on the cars as they are within the realm of the poor mans pocket.

I can see a set of nicly Drilled and Slotted Rotors adding a large benifit, and a set of good pads could definately increase stopping power.


Please add all you can.

 

Dean (don't know current screen name) had good success with Stillen Metal Matrix pads and good rotors. Maybe he'll chime in if he's not banned.

Ed

 

Drilled stock rotors arent going to do you any good whatsoever. Forget that idea. Bad idea.

 

And slotted rotors won't do anything below 100 mph except accelerate your pad wear. Go with good quality Bendix, Raybestos, or Wagner rotors (always replace your bearings and seals with new rotors), change your brake fluid yearly, and keep drum brakes adjusted and you'll do just fine. If you own a 3rd gen (you are on this forum so I assume you do) keep in mind your car is at least 14 years old so start with the basics making sure everything is up to par (minimal rust, good fluid, master cylinder, springs, calipers, hoses) and the worst case scenario means you'll have to replace everthing. If you used top-shelf OEM replacement parts you could replace the entire system for about $650!

 

Make sure everything is in order, like the above said. If your looking for rotors, IIRC Brembo makes nice blanks that would be perfect for a street car. You may want to look into that.

 

So crossed drilled and slotted rotors do nothing at all over stock rotors? Not even less pedal fade? I dont understand how thats possable, i just picked up all four CD and S, should i return them or throw them on?

Also i forgot the name of the pads but its something green, green monster or something are good pads for street, been using them for a few years and have no problem with them.

Thanks,

 

Probably EBC Greenstuff, they are a good pad but dust like crazy. As for D/S rotors, they give better initial bite since the slotting and holes keep the pads cleaned off but they will be more prone to cracking around the holes after numerous heat cycles.

Ed

 

You might get less fade because in my experience the rotor runs much cooler (let argument begin here), but I'm absolutely sure the braking distance is going to increase. I dont know about the cracking issue... I am still waiting for mine to crack and it was severely heat checked and hairline cracked in the center of the rotor before I crossdrilled and it looks the same years later.

 

I'd suggest a set of good pads (Hawks, EBC, Carbotech, etc), a fresh set of plain rotors, and some braided lines as a poor man's "upgrade". Tire Rack has a good selection to look at.

I did the Hawk HPS / Brembo upgrade on my wife's car, and was quite happy with the results.

If you save up your pennies, Ed Miller can set you up with a nice LS1 or C4-HD conversion

 

The best thing for me was changing out the original brake fluid with new fluid. Fade went away and it stops great. Thats the first thing i would do. I'm sure 1LE brakes or LS1 brakes are better but i wouldnt even bother.

 

As far as CD and slotted rotors go, unless you replace the stock rotors with larger ones, you will have less surface area, and thus less stopping power.

The problem with blanks is that under repeated hard braking they tend to lose their efficiency dramatically, but should still be plenty capable for the average street driven performance car.

IMO I wouldn't spend the extra money on non-blanks, as I would be scared of the reliablity you'd get buying budget CD and slotted rotors.

 

If he's into the 12's like his sig suggests, and / or does any autocross or open track days - he can use the extra stopping power.

Unforunately, brakes are often the last thing upgraded on many cars - everybody want to go fast but forgets about stopping.

 

This is the main problem with most guys that I see... they don't understand how the larger brake setups can help the car's performance. Our stock brake systems, while they can work "OK", are very underpowered for stopping our 3400+ pound cars. The money used to refurb a stock brake system could be put onto a 12" or larger upgrade and you'd be very happy with the difference. As said above, most guys want to go fast but forget to make sure the damn car can stop.

Ed

 

I autocross and trackday quite a bit with my car and the stock crap can work great for a little while. The 10.5 will provide enough stopping power to lock up any tire you will put on the 8 inch wheel until they are over heated. Then it is time to flush the fluids and replace parts. but if you are driving on the streets or drag racing with 15 or 20 minutes between runs your fine. I like Hawk HP+ pads but they dust like crazy. As for me I am in the middle of swaping to C4 12" brakes at the moment. I have been working on my brakes once a month for the last two summers to keep the stockers optimal and I am sick of it.

 

Yep, Dean swares by Stillen Metal matrix pads. Still run them on every car I have except the Camaro since they do not make a pad to fit my aftermarket Wilwood custom setup. If they ever do, I'll go back to them in a heartbeat.

EBC greens are notorious for pad buildup on the rotors leaving a warpped rotor pulsating brake pedal feeling.

Yep, its the exat same reason why I opted for building my custom Wilwood setup. The 10.5's stopped great for a short period of reliability, but then required maintinace and were noisy as *#(^

Hi Ed, and goodbye for awhile again

 

If you have hairline cracks in your rotor REPLACE THEM NOW!!! They can, and will, shatter like a hand-grenade under the right conditions. Also, is you're getting those and heat checking I'd recommend rebuilding calipers. The heat that damaged your rotors has certainly damaged the caliper seals as well.

 

Tell that to my car, they've been on there quite some time and I abuse it pretty good. I'm not too worried about superficial cracking, its the ones that go through the entire face of the rotor you need to really worry about. The rest is a result of previous owners.

 

As long as you aren't driving in my neighborhood, knock yourself out!

 

after rereading this whole thread area...

i have a question...

what if i install DOT5 brake fluid, silicone brake fluid.... it will hold IIRC nearly 200*F higher temps, and is silicone, will not solidify....

i am going to redo the entire brake system, so i think if i'm going to convert when its all new is the best time, since the two types of fluid cannot be mixed....

when i say redo the system i mean, calipers, rotors, pads, master, and lines(hard and soft)...

 

Solidify?! I've rebuilt hundreds of brake systems and only seen petroleum-contaminated systems have "solidified" brake fluid (more like jelly). IMHO, I've never gotten a straight answer on seal compatibility with DOT 5 fluids and OEM replacement master cylinders, hoses, and calipers. DOT 5 has advantages for cars that sit alot as it doesn't absorb moisture but I'd be leary of using it in an OEM based system for daily driven cars. My personal favorite STREET fluid is Castrol LMA DOT 4 fluid, great stuff!

 

Ive been looking at inexpensive ways to put "dual "piston calipers on the front of my "89" RS Camaro. Here's what I found. Raybestos brand dual calipers with-out pads . Part #FRC10169 (right side) &# FRC101170 (left side) at 75.00 ea. (Kragen auto parts ).More info at Raybestos. That's what I'm going to look into with new fluid and hoses . New rotors also.

 

When people say that drilled/slotted rotors have no performance advantage: is this a statement that has been tested??....I understand, and it fully makes sense, that there is less effective area for the pad to grab. But it is all that big of a difference??, or do u guys say it because its a waste of money?

IMO...(and by all means Im not a brake expert).... if you did 60-0 brake test with blank rotors, and then again with drilled/slotted rotors, I highly doubt that there would be difference in stopping distance.

if someone has tried this please inform me as I would love to place a fact behind these comments. This is a constant discussion at autocross events.

 

I did replace the fluid and added steel braided lines with raybestos pads Napa. came out great. Me and dad bought a adjustable portioning valve dialed it in and now works great

 

Just look at true racing cars. Some road racers on "heavy brake" tracks will have slotted rotors for clearing glazed pad faces and others will have drilled rotors for high speed use on light cars that don't do as much braking. But I've never seen a true race car that had both. OEM's such as Mercedes, Ferrari, and Lamborghini use drilled rotors, but not slotted, and point out that the cooling effect doesn't come into play at speeds under 80 mph. On street cars like most of ours it's simply cosmetic.

 

I agree with most of what is being said, with one minor exception: race cars, Ferraris and Lamborghinis don't weigh nearly as much as what we drive around. For the majority of our cars, you probably don't need something extreme like cross drilled and slotted rotors, but if you race the car regularly, or have a tendency to slow down quickly from high speeds (ie greater than 100 mph) you might get to actually use the extra cooling capabilities of rotors like those mentioned earlier. Otherwise, im not going to complain about the beautiful look of CD and slotted rotors showing behind a nice shiny wheel.