mikey8494

i have a 1992 firebird with the 3.1 v6 and i was wondering are you able to spin the front rotors freely by hand? and is it saposed to spin multiple revolutions cuz mine i have to spin with a wrench between the studs and it only spinss like a fraction of a turn

Joe Tag

iTrader: (4)

Should spin with little effort. Could be a few things going on. Are both rotors doing this? My first thing to check would be crack the line going in to the caliper or bleeder and see if it frees it up. If so the rubber line has most likely collapsed and needs replaced. If not, it could be a stuck caliper.

mikey8494

the thing is ive replaced everything but the hard brake lines and yes both front rotors are doing this

Jay_rich

iTrader: (4)

If you replaced everything. How tight did you install the castle nut on the hub?

Jay

Joe Tag

iTrader: (4)

When you say "everything" what do you mean? If you have new rubber lines and calipers, those are the most common problems. The pins the calipers slide on will rust up sometimes are they new or at least cleaned and greased when you did this? Is it the pads holding the rotor from turning? Did someone change the wheel bearings and maybe over tighten them? Crack the line for the front brakes on the proportioning valve and see if that frees them up.

mikey8494

new calipers ( came with new guide pins) new flex lines new master cylinder and new combination valve before i replaced the combo block i bled it and they did this i have yet to bleed it again but have triple bled the master cylinder i dont know if this will change anything i will be bleeding it tomarow. once ipumpe the brakes the calipers slide agiants the rotors and the pistons wont retract enough to let the hub spin

87350IROC

iTrader: (2)

How tight did you tighten the castle nut the preloads the wheel bearings?

If you loosen the nut to finger tight, does the rotor spin any easier?

Edwardgp

Mikey I hope you get this figured out soon. Make sure and let us know what the heck happened here on this project.

Joe Tag

iTrader: (4)

It's rare, but not unheard of for new parts to fail right out of the box. If you're certain everything is in good shape from the hard lines out, I'd start suspecting the master cylinder or prop. valve at this point. Loosen the line for the front brakes at the master. If that doesn't release them loosen the line at the prop. valve. I really don't see anything else that can be going on there.

mikey8494

whats a castle nut will bleeding them fix the problem

Joe Tag

iTrader: (4)

Castle nut is the nut on the spindle. He's asking if the wheel bearings are too tight.
Can't tell you what will fix this problem until you have eliminated some of the variables mentioned above. Since you plan on bleeding anyway, try what I suggested. Start with the master, crack the line to release pressure. Still stuck? Not the master. Crack the line out of the proportioning valve to release pressure. Still stuck? Not the proportioning valve. Crack bleeder. Still stuck? Not the rubber line. Calipers pads or rotors are mechanically fouled or the piston is sticking inside them.

mikey8494

so brand new calipers will foul?

Joe Tag

iTrader: (4)

I'm leaning towards the master cylinder or the proportioning valve since both are sticking. Probably the prop valve since you replaced two masters already, and it's not a highly sold item. It could have been sitting on a shelf forever. "Once you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the truth."
Was the system working fine before you did the replacements?

mikey8494

honestly i dont know i bought the car and it had been sitting for 2 years when i drove it home andi braked it qwould take alot of pressure to stop and it would pull to one side so i started replacing everything and i just replaced the combo block fluid freely comes out when i crack the bleeder valve on the calipers

Joe Tag

iTrader: (4)

Going to refer you back to post #11. Humor me and give it a try.

" Start with the master, crack the line to release pressure. Still stuck? Not the master. Crack the line out of the proportioning valve to release pressure. Still stuck? Not the proportioning valve. Crack bleeder. Still stuck? Not the rubber line. Calipers pads or rotors are mechanically fouled or the piston is sticking inside them. "

mikey8494

i tried all of it and nothing there still stuck i do admit ive replaced everything but the calipers after my nefew decided to hlep uncle mikey by puting aut trans fluid in the master cylinder when i was inside the house

Joe Tag

iTrader: (4)

THAT would have been helpful in the first post. Now we may be getting to the real problem. I have no idea what damage it could have caused, I don't think ATF will ruin the seals. Take the calipers off and pop the pistons out. Clean out the caliper VERY WELL. Put them back together and bleed the heck out of it. Hopefully compressing the caliper with a C clamp didn't push ATF back in the prop valve or master again.

mikey8494

oh the atf is long gone after the second replace of the master cylinder and i just replaced the prop valve... day before yester day and the atf incident happend like 2 weeks ago so yea

mikey8494

well both front calipers are locked down on the rotor and well i cant get the guidpins tro slide i dont know these brake systems fluster the crap out of me

Joe Tag

iTrader: (4)

This is kinda like pulling teeth here trying to get the info out of you. So, after relieving pressure off of each part in the order I told you, were they still binding? At what point do they free up? Do you have to use a C clamp to back them off? If you open the bleeder and they are still binding.

mikey8494

yes they were still binding agiant i havent bleed them i think maybe adding some caliper greese to the pins . and maybe remove the calipers and clean them out

Joe Tag

iTrader: (4)

Fantastic, well not for you, but narrows things down considerably. We are looking at calipers, guide pins, or something binding against the rotor now. Unless the wheel bearings are too tight.

mikey8494

no no if i use a c lcamp and push the piston in and then spin the hub it spins like 4 to 5 revolutions very smoothely its the fact that once the brakes are pumped and they go out and grab agianst the rotors they wont let go but they did this on the old system before anything was replaced

Joe Tag

iTrader: (4)

This is the answer that you should have given when I asked if the system was working fine before the replacements. Do you go to the doctor and say you have chest pains and leave out the part that a mule kicked you in the chest? NEW rubber lines? correct? NEW guide pins and calipers? When you compress the caliper, can you move it on the guide pins? Beginning to suspect something is installed in a bind or incorrect parts for your application. I am at a loss without being able to put my hands on it or get a good look. Get some good pics and post them. Try getting a few angles and close up.
I wish someone else could chime in with some ideas because I am running out. This makes little sense.

mikey8494

new rubber lines yes. new guide pins and calipers yes. when i push the pistons in yes they move on the pins but there is friction but honestly from 1 o 10 10 eing they move like with the slightest touch it be like a 5 but honestly i dont know how easily they are saposed to move on the pins.

Joe Tag

iTrader: (4)

If you can move it with your hands it won't keep the pads locked against the rotor tight enough to bind like that. If it still binds with the bleeder open it sounds like the caliper piston is sticking. But both doing this new out of the box would be lottery type odds of happening. Can you get some good pics? May help, may not. I'm just about out of suggestions.

mikey8494

im considering takeing them back luckily i got a life time warenty on them