I don't know if this is the right post area, but I was just wondering...

With gas prices being what they are , how difficult would it be to run a daily driver on ethanol?
I know Indy runs on methanol, and dragsters run on nitromethane and all internal-combustion-engines are basically the same.
I found out that there are many common road cars in the mid-west that are set up to run on T85 (85% ethanol, and 15% gas).
Would it just be a question of A/F ratio, timing, and advance, or is there more to it?
If it's as easy as I hope it is.... I'm getting into the boot-leg business

DOWN WITH OPEC!!!

Thanks for any replies.

 

Brazil has been running cars on ethanol for years (decades). The issues involve hard cold starting (they have a small gasoline tank, typically, for starting, then switch over to ethanol), water absorption (a tough one, as there isn't any easy solution for that), and economy. It takes more ethanol to make the same power as gasoline, so your range is reduced. You also typically have to increase the fuel delivery capability, including jetting. To get the most benefit, you also need to increase compression ratio.

But, that doesn't mean it isn't possible. 85/15 is about the max you can run on a gasoline-tuned system. 90/10 is more common, from what I've seen.

 

What about propane? It's price has stayed low in comparison to incredibly rising gasoline... Some of the same issues though, less power per volume (or mass...), so you need more of it, and propane mixers are generally rated less flow then carbs, perhaps dual mixers... (like dual carbs..) but you can bump up the compression....maybe even get more power...
I know a guy who did a 454 on propane for his blazer, ran dual mixers... 500+HP, somewhat mild IIRC....
plus if you're real slick, you can rig up a setup to make use of the fact that propane cools as it expands.... (normally you run a line from your heater core to keep it from freezing up...) just think, a source of "cold" in your engine bay... hmm, what to do, what to do...?

 

I'm curious about the propane thing, what's the octane rating of propane?

 

Propane and octane are completely different parrafins. Propane is C3H8, octane is C8H18.

The reason gasoline is given an octane rating is because it's a sh*t mix of different fluids, including octane. It's not a single, homogenous substance like propane. So you wouldn't have any octane in propane.


Written by my brother, the geologist....


Anyway, the "apparent" octane rating of propane is somewhere in the range of 108 or so... Like I mentioned, I knew a guy with a 454 with dual mixers, ran 1000CFM I think, and had 12:1 compression or so... Just think, getting crappy mileage, just like with a beefed up gas motor, but your "gas" is about half price, and you can have the same power, if the engine is built for it.. ( if you just convert over to propane like most people, you drop 20% in power... just like if you dropped your compression ratio, same idea...)


my idea, no idea how "new" it is, but you'd take your propane as it enters your engine bay, and somehow plumb it through your intake manifold, or something of the like, to cool your intake charge, giving more power... but like I say, propane cools as it expands, so your intake charge is cooler anyway... maybe that's why the "apparent" octane rating is higher...?

 

Sonix,

I ran propane on my Chevy 350 cab for years. It is an excellent fuel, provides almost the same power as gas and only loses about 10% in mileage terms. With propane maybe half the price of gas, you don't need to be rocket scientist to see you are gonna love it.

 

alright so what's involved in converting a car to run on propane?

 

It is a new fuel system from tank to carb. But first you need ready supplies of propane for auto useage, otherwise you are out to lunch.

In Western Canada we have oodles of the stuff and its available everywhere. In the states I don't know what your situation is like.

 

the only real bad thing I know of, (again, from the guy who had it on his offroad truck), is you can't bring a jerry can of propane, so if you run out, out in the bush, you can't siphon from another guys tank to get you home, you hope a tow truck can get up there... make sure your fuel gauge works.

well, everywhere that does bbq'ing generally has propane for cars, i'd think it'd be quite common..?
it's a pressurized system, so yea, all new stuff. Just don't put the tank hanging under the car to show off a bunch of silly ***** and gauges, *** I hate that, hide that!!! ahem, anyway...

-J

 

Actually, those same propane tanks for bbqs work great as a spare couple of gallons for those bad spots where you forgot to fill up.

 

Just think. A propane powered pickup. The ultimate tailgate machine at the ball park. You could have a big'ol gas-grill built-in the bed...cook 50 lbs of franks and never run out of gas.