I just installed the edelbrock carb and performer rpm intake on the car. It works great after its been running for a while.

But,I neglect to say cold, it seems to be due more to time driven. It will backfire like a mad man. A fast stutter(pooping). I thought it was an intake leak so i hoked up a vacuum gauge, it reads a strong 22 on it, and it vibrates maybe .4 very fast. it seems more like a engine vibration than anything. I have a points type ignition from a 69 camaro.(yes points) I have played with timing to no avail. The carb is sitting at 4 psi right now.

I originally tought it was ignition but if you leave it in idle, it seems to take a couple of engine revolutions before the light pop comes in. int timing is at 8 degrees.
I have a regulator with a blocked of return line, and a head bolt regulator. thinking this might be the only last resort im getting a 3 port one.(i set the damn thing on 51/2 psi and i get 4 on my guage.

Im really lost on this thing. Could the floats be to high, to low. Im seriously out of ideas ive checked almost everything. Any help would be apreciated.

PS. no emmisions stuff on it so i dont have to worry about that.

 

Other than that when it is working fine for half of the time i make the trips down the road the bastard runs like is got major ***** compared to before, it feels more like a v8 now and power doesnt fade it keeps coming unlike the 4000 rpm brick wall of before

Thanks again

 

Is there any play or wobble in that points distributor? Is the dwell holding steady?

Is there a leak between the fuel pump and the tank? It may have trouble getting fuel pressure if it's sucking air in along with the fuel.

This may be a far stretch, but you may have misadjusted an intake valve after installing that Performer cam. There might be a bottomed-out lifter that's holding a valve just open enough to cause the vacuum vibrations and backfiring.

 

When you had your TBI, did you have the stock air cleaner on it? If yes, than the stock air cleaner has a tube connected to it from the exhaust to help the car warm up faster. I'm assuming you now have an open air element cleaner which doesn't have that option, therefore you will have to let the car warm up (probably around 10 minutes in this cold weather) before you go anywhere. When it runs bad, what does your temp gauge read??

p.s. what kind of carb did you get? 600cfm?? and what kind of milage are you getting? I'm planning on doing the same thing.

------------------

Mods:Hooker Aerochamber 3" exhaust, gutted kitty,
March 2 piece underdrive pullies, smog pump gone,
14x4 K&N, 3.42 gears,
Eibach springs with KYB's all around.
Appearance: Harwood cowl hood, Z-28 wing, painted black(7/20/00)-original color was light blue
*All these mods were made this year
Stock Options:120,000 miles on motor, 5spd, TBI, 305, T-tops
Run a best of 16.7 @85mph before gears

 

Explain play in the distributor, how do i measure the dwell what do i need for it. I know is a little device i hook up. Please explain im new to points!

I just dont want the car to run lean. im ok if its an ignition misfire. Do you guys think 22 of vacuum seems good with a .4 of wobble or should it be steady as a rock. Im gonna retorque the manifold since i havent yet retorqued it since. Could i have an air leak with 22 of vacuum?

I rebuilt the carb myself, and i could eat of it after i was done. One time it backfired out the carb ?lean?. But i discounted that since it only did it once and it was relatively cold and the choke was set horribly off.

The reason why i dont think is the cold issue is because after i drive it and its fine and turn it off if i wait 10 minutes or so(the engine still warm. it will do it again for a while until its driving for a while.

Will 4psi be alright for the carb. I would imagine that at full throttle it wouldnt be, but why pop at idle???

Any help would be apreciated!!!

Thanks

 

Oh yeah i got a 600cfm, and every where i go i floor the crap out of it, for testing purposes and i only notice a slight decrease in milage and that me almost floring it every damn minute. The diference is almost sikening. I felt the same out of changing my gears to 3.42 from 2.73.

I ran 15.9 stock with just gears. and a slight personal boost of my fuel presure. actually a lot of pressure bost it ran a little richer at idle but ran better at the top.

Thanks again for any help

 

If it just has a small pop that's ok for when it's warming up. Mine does that everyonce and awhile because when cold the choke plate enriches it greatly.

Backfiring is either timing or lean.

The small wobble in vaccum is your small miss.

Check your plugs after you let it idle cold a bit and I bet you'll find one a little carbonized. Replace this plug and if it fouls again then look for the wire to this cylinder and all the way up through the ignition system.

A little exhaust pop isn't anything major because it should be gone by the the time you're ready to drive.

Good luck!



------------------
1984 WS6 Trans Am Hartop
Former L69 Car under restoration
1984 WS6 Trans Am T-top car
4-bolt main 350, headers, Holley 650, T-5 and 3.23's.
Daily driver and restoration

 

Again thank you guys for your help. It means alot.

i noticed that when it misses really bad its when i first drive it and it pops at any time i give it any amount of gas. Its almost embarasing. And sometimes even after the car is warm(once or twice) it will back fire.

One time i gave it full gas and instead of the rpms going up and the car launching ahead the rpms droped to 2000 the car bucked backfired faster than a mad man and after leaving it floored for a little while(2 seconds) then it will start climbing rpms normally i have checked the accelerator pump(enriched it leaned it).

Oh yeah and it will not backfire if i give it gas while in neutral. i could rev it to hell and nothing, as if it didnt ever have a problem with missing. only when in drive(gear). Im actually kind of happy i never seen the tach go up so damn fast, its like its eager before it was like please dont rev me that high.

Can i disconnect the vacuum canister to check if thats the problem??

Thanks again!! You guys are always alot of help

 

I had a bad backfiring problem just like you describe with it reving in neutral fine, and i replaced my plugs and it hasn't backfired since.

I had some ****ty Boschs in there and replaced them with some ACDelcos. Made a world of differences.

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by jrr:
[B]Is there any play or wobble in that points distributor? Is the dwell holding steady?

It's been many, many years since points distributors have been made. I was concerned that the one you have may have excessive play in the shaft from mileage and age. You check by grabbing the rotor shaft and seeing if you can make it move back and forth (not twist). If the shaft moves, then the cam that opens and closes the points will cause the point dwell to change. A shaft that's really old and worn will mess up the timing because the dwell's constantly changing. Not enough dwell will cause a weak spark or no spark. Too much will burn the points.

Every now and then, be sure to put some grease on the cam. Otherwise the block will wear down more quickly. As the block wears down, the dwell changes!

A quick and dirty way to set the timing without a timing light is to turn the motor until the timing mark on your damper is where you want it, say 8'BTDC. Then turn the key so you've got juice to all your stuff. Grab the distributor and turn it in the direction of rotation until the points connect. Then very SLOWLY turn it back the other way until you see a spark between the points. You've just set your timing without a light! The old-fashioned way!

 

Ok guys im scared now. I took out my plugs and aside from them being in the very rich side, which i expected from a carb jetted lean for a 350, is probably rich for a 305. But towards the back of the engine the plugs had oil in them. Still wet. I am highly concerned. Could my intake be taking up oil. If so why is my vacuum so high. Or could plugs when fouled not fire and then oil deposits there due to little spark.
I never see oil coming out from the pipes(blue smoke) only white and its when its cold??? After that it looks perfectly clean. Why would my plugs be full of oil. Could rich condition couse this???? Change heat range??? The engine works pretty well when very warm??

I got new plugs ACDelcos, taking out the old accel U groves i dont think they would probably work well with a low powered ignition like mine. (I do have an accel super stock coil . Which probably does nothing. hehe

I need help. Im scared. Ive done the manifold twice. So it would seal properly. HELP!!!!

 

I suggest beg/borrow/steal a distributor that is known to work. If you get a junkyard HEI make sure the advance weights are not frozen and that the vac advance doesnt leak. Also never buy a cheapo ignition module. I suspect a large part of you problem is ignition with possibly some carb tuning issues. You wont be able to accurately tune the carb without a consistant spark.

 

This distributor is new, after the initial problem my friend let me borow his fully working points distributor of his 69 camaro. It has been rebuilt and runs well in his engine.

I had another thing i saw while timing it today with the gun, is the timing mark supposed to stay perfectly still?? I distconect the vacum advance and time it when i do this, and it moves about half an inch or so back and forth. Could this be part of the problem, what would cause this. Like I said this distributor has been rebuilt found no play in it well greased, points are perfectly new.

Thank you guys for your help it mean a great deal to me!!!

 

Look at your points. Use a strong light and a magnifying glass if you need to. Spread the points and look at the surface. Are they pitted? Are they blue from burning? The surface of those point contacts ought to be clean, smooth, and flat. If the points are AFU, then the spark will be weak and you'll think that the carb is too rich when, in fact, it's O.K. A weak spark from worn points will barely ignite the air/fuel mixture and you'll get wet plugs and the motor will just run like s**t.

Is the condenser hooked up across the points? The condenser is there to absorb the voltage surge that would otherwise cause the points to spark and burn if it weren't there. Condensers almost never go bad but there's always that chance.

 

The timing mark is supposed to be still. A little motion is common since the timing mark is on the outside of the harmonic balancer.
I like to hook the timing light up to each spark plug wire to see if it is firing properly. Its not as good as a scope, but it works. See if the miss correlates to a loss of spark in a particular cylinder, you may have a bad plug wire, plug or a loose connection. If a cyl in going south and the plug is fouling, this will mimic an ignition problem
Also, stay away from accel plugs...the u grooves have too little surface area causing them to wear too quickly.
To measure dwell, you need a dwell tach. This will give the number of rotational degrees that the points are opened (might be closed...its been a looong time). This is a very accurate method of setting point gap and if the needle fluctuates it is indicative of wear in the distributor.

 

Muaahhahaahahah, Yes she alive. I put in the old computer controlled HEI(i know, i know..no advance. working on vacuum hei). She runs hahahahahahah. No backfire.

Have you guys seen gone in 60 seconds when the cop sat in the drug dealers cadillac el dorado. That was me after she fired and she didnt backfire. Reved it to 7000 rpms which is strickly against me. Hahaha...

I love you guys. HHAHAHAHHAH I love chevy I love camaros I love this ****!!!

Thanks to all that helped!!!!

Damn how she winds up now!!!! Umm.. TBICamaro***NOW CarbCamaroheheheheheheheheh muahahahahahahhah... choking!!!

 

How come your Camaro can Rev to 7 grand?
Mine screams at 4500 which is the yellow area. My tach only goes to 6 grand.
Also, my setup does pretty much exactly what yours does, sputtering and running crappy when cold. I have a Vaccum Advance dist., MSD HEI coil, and same carb and intake as you.
I guess I'll have to fix my timing. I didn't adjust it after I did the intake swap, I just put it in in the same position it was in when I took it out.

------------------
Zepher
'86 Pontiac Trans Am WS6, LG4 305, 5 Speed, CF DF Clutch,
Edelbrock 1406 Carb, Edelbrock Performer RPM 7101 Intake Manifold.
Edelbrock Open Element Air Cleaner: Flowmaster Exhaust, 160* Thermostat,
Grant GT Steering Wheel, MSD HEI Coil, Taylor 8mm Wires, Recaro Seats,
Alpine CD+Changer,Rockford & Soundstream Amps, Premier TS-1040C Subs, Polk Audio highs/mids.
Best ET: 14.94@91.67
WS6 Trans Am

 

I think he was exaggerating about the 7 grand. I'm guessing at the very worse he has an LO3 still in there but may have swapped in a larger and better built engine.

An LG4 isn't made to rev to the sky, 7000 rpms is high for stock but most people who build their own engines shoot for atleast that redline or higher. The better balanced and more light weight the rotating assembly is the higher it can rev safely....the problem is making power up there.

------------------
1984 WS6 Trans Am Hartop
Former L69 Car under restoration
1984 WS6 Trans Am T-top car
4-bolt main 350, headers, Holley 650, T-5 and 3.23's.
Daily driver and restoration
13.98 @ 101 mph

[This message has been edited by 84FTA (edited December 20, 2000).]

 

I called it to quickly. Yes my car still sputters when cold. Check timing but dont expect it to go away, in mine it just made it better when i give it light throttle or full hell. Zepher(damn almost same combo) tts the manifold/carb engine combo. Its a high rise with a crappy cam and a good carb. I dont know but this thing spins alot differently now! It makes me feel better that you have the same problem, i also think is due to the 1406 being a little rich for the 305 with a incredibly mild cam(it starts fouling plugs until its warmer and can burn it off). I can live with it as long as someone else outthere is the same as me. sputtering when cold!


And no i did not exagerate about rpms, i did take it to 7000, IN NEUTRAL! Before i would punch the gas and it would rev ok, now it just shots up really fast compared to before. and for testing purposes i took my car on with my friends 3800v6 200hps hes got exhaust/intake and 3.73/posi. I have stock 170hp. In a race to 70 he would always have a nose on me. HAHAHAHAHA not anymore. Now he is thinking of nitrous, i swear.

I have built a couple of 350s they ran great(not for me anyways), and i love the challenge of making a smaller engine with little money take on alot of stronger cars. I love this thing now. This will keep me happy until i build my own 350. I only have block heads and crank right now.

Next is a good cam hydrolic cam and thats it for this engine. Should run very nicely!!

Thanks to all again i apreciate it greatly!!!

 

Zepher, one question, what throttle braket are u using, im having trouble with mine, i heard about lokar having the only one that works right. I eighter get to soft all the time or full hell hard. I dont mind the hard shift its feels good as hell, but damn i have to rev it to high and then drop the throttle. The cable is not moving troughout its full range only about half i think, any help/tips would be apreciated.( I already tried using the old linkage to no avail.