I've searched high and low and am about to scrap the serpentine setup and it's reverse water pump since I can not obtain one, and yet have two cars that need them.

Every local auto store; same story. I get in my truck, take the backplate off, it's a clockwise impeller (spins water to the center of the pump, not outwards and into the block). So I promptly return it. Tried about 6 pumps so far, only two stores left. Boneyards might have a corroded impeller, then I gotta pay a machine shop to press it in. Carcraft even states the pump body cavity should match the reverse impellers, yet I always get the old style (with heater fitting on top). Normal reverse pumps have no fitting.

I've also tried Milodon 16213 ($80). And recently BRA-1774 ($75) from FlowKooler. Both were just $12 rebuilds with $5.95 discs rivoted to the WRONG impeller. The FlowKooler warned not to install on clockwise belts and to remove the cover and check the impeller and verify against their picture, well I did that and a monkey could see it was a CW pump, not the CCW I ordered.

BTW, I'm using the stock serp belt setup from LO3 motors.

Right now, I have a small serp belt around my crank, water pump ($12), and belt tensioner (no A/C, alternator, or P/S). But at least water pumps normally when I rev (out of the upper hose), instead of cavitating with no flow.

I was going to try Edlebrocks $160 8881 model, as it claims reverse flow. Since 55-87 was CW turning, I remain skeptical I'll get the right pump.

Certainly this is the right place on the internet for this question, where can I get the proper pump, pretend money isn't an object... for a stupid pump it shouldn't be anyway.

Thanks in Advance.

 

don't let this be a telling sign, lots of aftermarket pumps have the fitting

I am using a $15 pump from Murrays auto parts store (reverse rotation) and have no trouble


oh, and the water still goes the same way, but the shaft and impeller just spins the opposite direction

 

Right, the goal is to get the water in the motor. I should say reverse rotating impeller instead of flow (like the newer blocks).

And I'm not letting the fitting be a telltale sign (I always visual the impeller), just quoting from Carcraft mag. Even in the wrong casing, I'm sure the right impeller will pump a heck of a lot better than the wrong one (which believe me, does virtually nothing).

I have no Murray's down here. I have Advance auto parts, Pepboys, and a couple of speed shops really no different from my Summit racing catalog, only higher priced.

Unless someone has a brand/model # for me, I can't be sure of getting the CCW I need. Even then it seems a crapshoot, as the BRA-1774 is CCW, but that's not what Summit (or FlowKooler) gave me.

 

I'll see if I can get you a part number






for a test, go to the store and ask for a pump for a 1990 full size blazer, 4x4, 5.7L v8(I have one )

that is the same CCW pump, but they might pull the pump that you need

 

You're right... Advance auto parts website shows identical part numbers for both vehicles. But I already bought the ASC WP715... and it's the wrong impeller...

I saw your 89 IROC on Cardomain... my belt routing is identical to yours, stock...

But it's REALLY obvious about the wrong impellers put on these pumps. Especially when I make the pump spin CW and it works perfectly.

Right part number, wrong impeller...

 

Water pumps? One company, Stewart is the only place I shop. I have their stage 1 pump. It's for a serpentine systems with reverse rotation. I have been using the same one for 5 years now and my temps are not a problem. Seems to me if the impeller was wrong it would run hot real quick.

http://www.stewartcomponents.com/index.htm

 

I don't know that I've seen a CW water pump for a late 3rd gen. Since the '88 and up cars use a CCW water pump from the factory, that's what you will typically find.

What about an '82 to '87 pump designed for the V-belt? You should be able to put the serpentine pulley on it and be on your way.

Something like this:
http://www.stewartcomponents.com/htm...rtNumber=13113

 

Not going to work. The water pump pulley runs on the inside of a V-belt (clockwise rotation) and outside on a serpentine belt (counterclockwise rotation).
The water pumps look the same but the impeller is differant on each.
This is the one he needs.
http://www.stewartcomponents.com/htm...rtNumber=13123

 

And it does get hot REAL quick with the wrong one, since nothing comes out of the top hose, the motor is basically air-cooled. You actually wouldn't believe how long I've driven my precious '69 block like this before I checked the pump. I hit well over 260 many times.

Okay I will try one more time with Stewart. before I go to V-belt design. That link you gave does show the correct pump. But all I'm saying is they better send the right one since lord knows I've ordered the correct part #'s before.

As far as flow, all the ~$80 cast-iron pumps are the same, they are $12 re-builds with a $5 flow-kooler disc rivoted or sometimes welded and smoothed to the backside of otherwise standard impeller. The disc adds the 30% or more flow.

Again, thanks John for the link, I hope they send the correct one. It was easier building my motor than getting this dang water pump.

EDIT: Just noticed, couldn't find this on Summit or Jeg's. Perhaps this is a good thing, ordering right from Stewart is the only way to go here right?

 

Yes, you are correct. The '88 and up serpentine cars use a CCW water pump. I guess I'm having a hard time understanding how he could repeatedly be given a CW pump for an earlier model if a CCW pump for an '88+ is what he is asking for. Is the help in the AP stores really getting that bad?

I think I also mis-read part of his original post:
I took to this mean he had removed the accessories. In which case, he's changed how the pump is being driven – from CCW to CW. After re-reading it, I see he's only doing this as a temp fix until he gets a correct CCW pump.

Go with Stewart and just be sure you order the correct part number. I'm really happy with my Stewart Stage II pump.

 

Yes my tiny serp belt is temp so my tire smokin ride is battery powered at the moment. I'll order the Stage 1 CCW tomorrow from Stewart. I'd get the aluminum Stage 2 if I thought it was worth $160 to me, but really I've never paid more than $20 for any water pump even with hopped up V8's and been doing fine (till now).

When it arrives, I'll remove the backplate and visual the impeller. If it's right, I'll probably faint from what I've been through.

FlowKooler's 1774 CCW was also $75, but had wrong impeller. It was just a ASC 715HD with 4 rivots attaching a disc to the back of impeller.

As far as the auto stores in my area, myself and others and truely mystified. Been racing Camaros for 15 years, never saw any trouble like this. Plus this CCW pump is used on many GM cars/trucks after 87. When my wife's LO3 pump finally dies, I guess I could drive to Michigan to get a $15 pump or order a Stewart for $75 (IF they hook me up right). Crazy....

I bet half the people on this forum (with cooling trouble) may have wrong impellers and don't realize it. A quick Google search reveals this is a common problem for Jeep, Ford, Audi, etc with serp systems & rebuilt units from auto stores. Even when the part # is right, the part is wrong in the box. But those non-Chevy's have no backplate, real easy to see impeller in the store...

 

That's correct, the only way to get a Stewart pump is direct through them. They are THE ONLY name in water pumps. No, I don't work for them.

 

THAT'S IT!!!! I"VE HAD IT!!!!!!

Though I must say the Stewart pump is by far the highest quality piece I've examined....

Alas the impeller is still the wrong way...

My invoice:

13123 S1 CSB 87-up Long 3/4 brg
5/8 shft High Flow Pump CCW

I give up... you guys get lucky, I get the shaft literally...

what makes me an expert on impeller design?? nothing except running this style impeller produces perfectly normal flow (out of UPPER radiator hose, NO stat) when SPUN CW (USELESS for SERP setup)!!!! They produce NO flow from the top hose when spun CCW

besides a monkey could see the blades would be quite useless in CCW rotation... I once read the impeller looks deceiving, I don't claim to be a design expert, but I know from my belt experiments I can not drive my car unless I V-BELT it....

this really SUCKS

I'd produce a JPG of the internals but I'm too mad at the moment. $200 in pumps and I can't drive my tricked ride.

For the love of *** someone help me get at least my alternator working (old brackets, j-yards, etc)...

 

Hmmmmm. Pictures of what you are trying to achieve or what you are looking for might help. Otherwise, I think you've lost me.

You want a CCW pump, but EVERY CCW pump you buy, you say has a bogus impeller on it??? I'm not sure how that is possible?

Plenty of people are running the Stewart pumps and have no trouble. Have you tried contacting Stewart directly? They have a message forum on their site and one of the top guys at the company - Jack Wilson - personally answers many of the questions.

http://www.stewartcomponents.com/html/forum/default.asp

 

I would never believe it myself if I didn't connect a small serp belt around the crank and tensionor ONLY so the water pump spins CW. Then, and only then, does THIS impeller design operate normally, i.e. there is flow at idle, and a LOT of flow when REV'ed (how every proper car runs that I've wrenched on in the last 15 years). When I spin this impeller CCW as our cars call for, I get NOTHING from the top raditor hose except little tiny bursts of water every 30 seconds or so (and a very overheated motor within minutes, obviously).

I still don't believe my eyes... Even though I have THREE water temp gauges on my motor (1 electric in the A-pillar) and I DO believe them as I watch my coolant burst out of the overflow tank from a very hot & unhappy small block using these bogus pumps.

Not exactly a novice here either, I built my motor, my trans, and programmed my wife's LO3 PROM... would love to have her stock water pump (it's the correct impeller, I've checked, but she needs it for work).

Seems I'm screwed. My wife's car will be too when it's pump starts to leak.

About the quality of the Stewart, their casting is pretty poor and VERY rough unlike the smooth Flow Kooler 1774 which BTW does have larger water openings than Stewarts. Internals looked much better on Stewarts however. But even if the pump looked like junk I'd install if the impeller was correct.

Edlebrock 8881 is all that's left at $160 (Horsepower TV used it on a CCW serp setup). Again, it's what comes in the box that matters though. I figure $160 would be a good start a getting the j-yard parts needed to go pre-87 and v-belt, can't lose that way, except a few ponies, my AC compressor and hoses, and the "elegance" of the serp.

What a shame, my 92 even "overdrove" the water pump (it was a smaller pulley) compared to my wife's '89 LO3 motor pulley.

 

Extra info, if it matters....

My 350 block is a well seasoned '69 high performance 010/020 completely rebuilt. Also using 70's style heads.

But I put the stock LO3 serp setup on the motor. I didn't, and still don't see the problem.

My point is this, the '87 and up motors are only roller cammed right? The water only went reverse flow cooling in the '93 V8 blocks right (if this even matters)?

All I know for sure is I have a quite a collection of '87 to '92 pumps that only work right spinning the same direction as the crank, unfortunately...

 

Correct, '87 and up is roller cam. Water flow is the same only with reverse rotation pump. IIRC, LT1 used reverse flow.

I'm not sure what could be going on with your engine, so I went ahead and posted about this on the Stewart Web site. I also included a link to this thread. Let's see what they have to say.

 

I've purchased two replacement pumps for my '91 RS LO3 from Schucks/Krager/Checker and they were both the correct ones.

 

I'm sure there are zillions of people like you that get the right pump. No offense at all, but how does that help me?

If I'm doing something wrong, fine, it wouldn't be the first time. But I must say I'm not the only person working and seeing these pumps in action on the car only work in CW direction. MANY who are trying to help me are completely baffled and they've been drag racing as long as me.

 

I would contact Steward directly if you think you have a problem. How is it that anyone can order a pump and get a good one but when you order a pump it's wrong every time? Something is missing here..................

 

You could buy the correct one from GM!

 

I concur completely, everything points to me, but if you guys want to see what the internals (impeller) of these pumps look like, I'd post them, plus my wife's (working CCW GM unit). VERY dfifferent.... about 15 times over already... I'm in possession of about 3 of the wrong pumps now, the others are returned.

As far as buying from GM, only one problem, you have to special order, pay in advance, it's not high-flow, and if it's the wrong pump in the right box; well you know...

Going to junkyards tomorrow. Pumps are $10 each, I grab 5 and hope one doesn't leak too bad...what a joke.

The whole reason I built this 400hp car/motor from ground up is reliability and easy to maintain. I've always ran Chevy's, tried Ford and CRX stuff, didn't like em much....

 

Buy a press. Put the correct. impeller on yourself. If the junkyard impellers are just surface corroded, beadblast them, paint 'em and use 'em.

 

Sounds reasonable. Haven't heard of "beadblasting" before. I'm leaving shortly and will report what I turn up. I'll post pictures later today of the two different impellers (plus the internals of the expensive pumps (stockers really with just $5 FlowKooler discs added).

 

You don't need to go to a junkyard. You have a Stewart pump. Call them and talk to someone, you may learn something.

Last resort, since anyone else can get the correct pump send me some money and I'll send you the correct one they send me. After all, I never heard on someone getting screwed by Stewart.

 

Why don't you post a pic of you serp setup and a pic of the stewart pump? Nobody here knows what you are talking about, as you can tell by all the .

Contact Stewart, phone call. Saw you bashing them on their forum, that's not going to get you very far.

 

I look forward to the pics. I would have, by now gone ahead and bought a GM water pump. Had you tried to get an AC Delco locally?

 

Couldn't find the correct pumps at the Junkyard Sat (limited hours & cars). I did however score a perfect IROC dual e-fan cooling setup with perfect air-dams for $50

Lots of nice GM 350's and V6 60deg motors (for my S10)... $350 pulled longblocks...

Only GM cars they had were hybrid serp/belt without routing diagrams so I couldn't learn anything from that. I'll be back at the yards tomorrow.

In the mid 70's GM used pumps with basically omni-directional impellers and they contained a backplate on the impeller already. Anyone know if these (I think long style) pumps can work with a serp pulley setup (spacing and fitment of serp pulley)? I bought the v-belt brackets for $10, but I REALLY don't want to use them...

I'll have my pictures posted within hours (had a card reader glitch, uploading them now).

BTW - AC Delco pump is $104 and non-returnable, non-highflow (don't think my motor would like it much) plus by now you know I have the impeller jitters and have spent quite a lot of money on this. The "non-scooping" impellers as Stewart's Jack Wilson calls them (no disrespect, just trying to get my 3rd gen on the road) flow like mad when hub is in CW, absolutely no flow in CCW. You'll see the pics soon. As for my belt routing, look for the article here with the smog delete, it's the same CCW belt water routing as mine...

 

Here's the pics...

Unless obvious, these pumps are UPSIDE down when snapped.

<img src="http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/Groups/224/224686/folders/164294/1198881milodon.jpg" width="470" height="352">
Milodon 16213 CCW

<img src="http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/Groups/224/224686/folders/164294/1198883122.jpg" width="470" height="352">
$12 rebuild 88-92 CCW shot 2

<img src="http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/Groups/224/224686/folders/164294/1198884123.jpg" width="470" height="352">
$12 rebuild 88-92 CCW shot 3 - notice GM/AC Delco CCW style pump housing, no heater fitting. Works fantastic as a CW pump, nothing as CCW.

<img src="http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/Groups/224/224686/folders/164294/1198885kooler.jpg" width="470" height="352">
Flow Kooler 1774 CCW shot 1

<img src="http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/Groups/224/224686/folders/164294/1198886kooler2.jpg" width="470" height="352">
Flow Kooler 1774 CCW shot 2

<img src="http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/Groups/224/224686/folders/164294/1198887kooleropen.jpg" width="470" height="352">
Flow Kooler 1774 - note the large, smooth water opening

<img src="http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/Groups/224/224686/folders/164294/1198888stewart.jpg" width="470" height="352">
Stewart stage I shot 1

<img src="http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/Groups/224/224686/folders/164294/1198889stewart2.jpg" width="470" height="352">
Stewart stage I shot 2

<img src="http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/Groups/224/224686/folders/164294/1198890stewartopen.jpg" width="470" height="352">
Stewart stage I - note the small, rough water opening

<img src="http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/Groups/224/224686/folders/164294/11988941169507tech03z.jpg" width="470" height="626">
The impeller that actually pumps water when hub goes CCW, impeller goes CW, it works... where can I get another one?

You have to look close at the disc'ed impellers but they are the same as the $12 one, the disc increases flow, decreases cavitation, so all the hi-perf pumps have it.

My belt routing is the same as the pics found in the smog pump delete tech article on here.

BTW - These pumps work fantastic when spun with the crank (CW), otherwise jack diddly comes out of the top radiator hose (no stat).

 

I have a CAT alum pump I took the back cover off tried to check the impeller but they use a cast iron impeller with a close fit and can't see what way the vanes are directed.Heres the site if you want http://www.catpep.com/catproducts/wa.../waterpump.asp

 

You mean part # WP-350RR right? for Chevy SBC '88-00 is aluminum pump with cast impeller (with disc) is $50?

That's the cheapeast aluminum pump I've heard of (can be good, I assume you have no trouble with yours). Your '89 383 is setup as CCW serp right?

When I took apart the GM '77 stocker in the boneyard, the iron impeller was so big, and the vanes to small, it was very hard to note the small curve they had. They had one, it was just really small, so it would flow some even in the wrong direction.

Thanks for the info! I'd LOVE $50 to take me out of my misery. I wish I had chanced my $50 for aluminum pump before all these $75 cast iron ones...

 

Before you go droping $50 on the cat pump I did NOT install it yet!So I dont know how it works.Anyway yes the PN#WP-350RR is what I have and the impeller looks like one piece no welded or riveted disk Im guessing the impeller looks like the edelbrock

 

I undestand.

My local speed shop also gave a thumbs up to the cat pump. Be he's unsure of it's impeller. He can't even get it for over a week. CAT's site doesn't even say how much shipping is or how long it'd take.

In any event, a big thanks for trying to help me out, and my speed shop guy would not allow a company to shaft me on the pump, i.e. he'll make it right and remove the backplates instore before purchasing and send them back. So no more internet ordering for me...

I did pick up a nice Edelbrock RPM air-gap manifold today

 

Different local speed shop, different opinion, here it is:

The Performer intake 2101 blocks off rear head water passages. The model for '87-'95 connects them and also has the proper flat (not angled center 4 intake bolts).

I was told this is why a serp water pump won't flow on my motor. ??? Any opinions?

I do know many people use '87 heads with the 2101 Performer and just take a drill and chew away at the aluminum on the center 4 bolts with no problems; but I don't know if they run a CCW pump.

More info: Milodon on the phone says the 16213 pump I have (pic is above) is CCW and should have STRAIGHT impeller fins (omni-directional). They also say difference between right and wrong impeller is 7%. Another case of right box, wrong pump, or just phone rep who doesn't know diddly.

I recently bought a 77 Camaro stock pump for $12 and about $20 in hardware to mount my alternator on the passenger side (only side you can with a long style pump), and a 1/16" shim for the pump's serp pulley (that I must enlarge the 4 holes ovally to fit this pump). After getting a proper serp belt, I can drive the car this way. What a bunch of junk.

Anyone running a Performer 2101 intake (non-connected rear water on heads) with 70's style heads with serp setup without problems???

Thanks...

 

on my blazer I run a dart street dominator w/o rear water passage, stock serp set-up and stock replacement pump





it's on centerbolt heads right now though

it ran the same on the dart iron eagles though

 

Thanks Dave, I didn't think the rear passage mattered, it makes no sense to me how that could completely stop water from exiting the front of the heads...

Okay plan B... I install the the parts on the passenger side and rip out my A/C unit just so I can run alternator only. Thinking about going full race on this car anyway; but it sure did make an excellent street car though.

The speed shop took the backplate off a Milodon 16212 (CW rotation) and sure enough the blades were oppposite all my CCW pumps... almost made me want to grab it from him instantly, then I got logical, and didn't.

So I've exhausted everything, nobody knows whats going on, so it looks like I gotta set my belt to run CW :hail:

BTW - The blades on my 1977 Camaro pump (definately CW v-belt unit) match the angle of the blades on my "CCW" pumps. If no one can verify the correct blades for me, shouldn't I just buy any pump that has opposite blades of what I now have?

Also Milodon on the phone admitted they sometimes will use a different impeller on the same model depending on parts availability. Nice... speed shop owner says Edlebrock is probably the only one who can do it right...

 

I have a stock CCW pump sitting in my garage. I'll snap some digital pics of the impeller tonight. This pump worked just fine on my car.

My Stewart Stage II CCW pumps works just fine as well.

I really think there is something with your engine configuration that is the problem. What exactly that is though, I couldn't tell you.

 

PROBLEM SOLVED.

I was right, they were wrong... Good luck to future CCW water pump buyers, it's a gamble. Look at the impeller or risk frying your motor; a friendly warning. The above pictures show the incorrect type.

Local speed shop took backplate off Mildon 16212 (a CW old style pump) and the blades were correct for CCW (straight up, a variant of the correct CCW impeller that doesn't flow as good, but is bi-directional, with slightly better flow in CCW dir).

16213's are supposed to have the straight impeller, not the 16212. But milodon will put on the straight one when it's what they have lying around (from phone call with them).

When my wife's pump dies, I'll order the Flow-Kooler straight impeller pump (bi-dir) and check the backplate at a local speed shop, nothing else.... Their cast quality is superb (look at above pics) and their instructions make you remove the backplate before installing pump.

BTW, for Milodon 16212 a hub shim kit is needed ($6) and you must re-drill (or enlarge) the 4 water pulley bolts to make it work.

What a joke. Now I KNOW some GM motors are frying as you read this because of wrong impellers. What a shame.

See you at the track.

 

My motor is ripping up the streets now... it's very happy with the correct pump, and so am I. I rarely hit 190 (at the intake).

Here's how I know the impellers were wrong (aside from my obvious testing).

I took the STOCK GM pump from a v-belted '77 Camaro (OBVIOUS CW pump) apart in the junkyard. Guess what, impeller vanes were directed JUST as all my "CCW" pumps. I then bought a new '77 pump at Autozone, again SAME exact impeller. Clearly WRONG for CCW application.

Both my local speed shops told me the same thing, it's the luck of the draw. Both repeatedly have trouble with serp water pumps, never with the v-belts. They both say Edlebrock is probably the only one who gets it right (#8881). BTW, above Edlebrock picture shows CW impeller (very good one too).

Thanks for all the help guys

 

I just checked the flowkooler site and it looks like the correct pump is PN# 1774A not 1774 http://www.flowkooler.com/pump.php?pid=WP1774A

 

You'll never believe this.

Flow Kooler just changed their website. As of days ago. Want proof? Search for Chevy, Camaro, 92 water pump using their website's menus, 1774 comes up with IRL code. R meaning reverse. Now 1774 says CW and my invoice clearly says 1774 is CCW. Maybe they saw this thread... maybe they should get their act together so people WOULDN'T HAVE to send their STUFF back to them which is EXACTLY what is going to happen in this case.

Thanks for pointing that out by the way.

Also, the paperwork in my 1774 box insists it is a reverse flow pump and they insist that you remove the backplate and compare to their diagram. I did, and mine was opposite their picture. Botta bing.

BTW, I bought it from Summit. Summit's website is still incorrect, listing the 1774 as CCW. Just days ago they listed the 1774A for $105 and said it was CCW aluminum pump. Now it's been removed. I'll get my money back.

It's just more proof (my above pics show the whole story from several companies) that people are getting the WRONG impellers and their motors are getting FRIED with brand new cooling components...

Thanks for giving everyone else too the heads up...

EDIT: Actually FlowKooler's site is still wrong. It says 1774 direction is CW, but at the bottom where the notes are; this is what it still says: "Impeller blades at angle to shaft for reverse flow, this pump for REVERSE ROTATION ONLY"
Here's the link. So they haven't completely fixed their website just yet.

 

Hmmmmm. Well, I just looked at my old stock water pump and it has the EXACT same impeller as the one in your $12 rebuild pic. Here's a pic of mine:



This pump ran perfectly fine on my '88 5.7L/350 serpentine belt drive engine. If you look close at the impeller, you'll notice it has slits at the base of each blade. This allows the impeller to suck in the water and fling it thru the pump just a Stewart Components described.

If the slits were not there and the blades were solid all the way down, THEN it probably wouldn't work in CCW rotation.

 

Thanks for snapping the pic. I assume you ran this pump a while. Temps were good?

Well your pic shows the same curved impeller as junkyard 77 Camaro (v-belt CW) and new '77 camaro v-belt CW pump. How can we explain this? I'll post the pic if everyone wants proof.

Milodon maintains a 7% difference between right and wrong impellers (over the phone). But when I got ZERO flow from my $12 pump, I call that a major snafu.

And now FlowKooler doesn't know what part # to call their CCW part?? Why not? They do offer straight impellers that work on both belt systems, which is what some companies install in CCW anyway.

If your old pump and what Stewart said about the workings of the pumps (they should know above all) is 100% correct, that's perfectly fine and great. BUT I still maintain what I said earlier, even if I'm DEAD wrong about these impellers (and my pictures; EVERYONE take them with a grain of salt), I KNOW for a fact people are given the wrong water pumps on a daily basis, so it's buyer beware is all I'm saying for 100%.

You used an '88 setup. With '87+ heads (roller motor style with cantered center bolts)? Earlier I stated I used 70's style. Does your intake crossflow water in the rear? The Performer 2101 does not. Maybe this matters, maybe not. I doubt it, but I don't know enough to say. Just glad to be flowing water.

EDIT: I doubt heads or intake matters. Even GMPP sells billet serp conversion kits (with pump) for old motors. $500+ for no A/C, $700+ /w compressor.

 

Yep, temps were good. I ran this pump for several years and just recently removed it to install my Stewart pump. Stock pump was (and still is) fine, nothing wrong with it. The engine in my car is pretty much bone stock right now, so the water flow is just how GM designed it.

That's really wierd on your engine that the CCW pump deosn't work properly. Strange. Very strange. But hey, after tinkering with cars for 20+ years, nothing totally surprises me. Sometimes fluke stuff happens.

 

I read this thread and I gotta say it made me nervous.

but I went home and checked two water pumps for my 88 and they all look like the ones pictured in this thread.

What I dont understand is with the water flowing in through the middle of the impeller and the impeller spinning CCW all those pictured pumps should work well.

If you tried to spin any of those designs CW they would try to take water from the block and put it through the radiator hose. This would make the cooling system reverse flow like LT1's.

Is this pump that solved your problems L03BIRD of a different impeller design? does the impeller have non- curved blades in the same direction as the ones pictured or blades that allow the impeller to spin the other direction?

I can see if the designs pictured were spinning CW there would be a problem. Rear coolant crossover passages make no difference to cooling flow, all the coolant in the block exits through the thermostat housing which connects the two sides of the block anyway.

EDIT

I just looked harder at the pictures you posted L03BIRD, The 12 dollar rebuild pictures at top look familiar to me and look like if the hub was spun CCW looking at the pump from the front they would pump correctly. This is how both my pumps look. HOWEVER the last black and white picture you took is of a different impeller. I think that last one would work if you spun the pump CW looking at it from the front. Yet that is the one you say worked?

Just observing here and trying to figure out what the heck is going on. Not intending to nit pick.

 

I agree. Rear cross-over does nothing.

The last B&W pic works for me. Have no idea why. The water pump companies will say it is a CW pump (hub direction, impeller goes opposite when viewed from rear).

Didn't mean to make anyone nervous. If you have high temps, and you have a stat installed, or suspect the pump in any way. Loosen the upper radiator hose clamp. With engine idling and hot enough to open stat (if in place) place upper hose atop radiator top (careful, use gloves, do not get burned). If working normally, a steady flow will emerge, and lots if you rev the motor. If this doesn't happen, you got the wrong impeller.

It helps if a friend is filling the radiator with a hose at the same time because it will empty quickly if pumping properly.

 

I think I see where the confusion is its how the water pump really works and how we think it works.The water is coming from the center of the impeller and getting thrown out to the sides.So all the impellers in the pics are right the last pic the blades are flat(CW or CCW).LO3BIRD your engine just likes the flat blade better for some reason or the flat blades flow more.

 

Not sure about the flat's flowing more, since the other blades didn't flow anything (for me), and this is a brand new motor. I would think a correct curve would beat a flat paddle wheel anyday (but I did, and will continue to get the flat paddles from now on because I know they'll work).

As far as how a water pump works, Stewart says most auto pumps suck and do not scoop. But that doesn't explain why a '77 vbelt CW (2 of em) has same curve impeller as a CCW 88-92 Camaro. I'll let GM figure that one out...

 

LO3BIRD, I'm up in Port ST Lucie, can you tell me what yards you go to, ours up here have few camaros to pick through.

 

In Pompano, there's a few South of Copans on Powerline, one that I frequent is Sam's, one of the few that allow you to enter and pick your own parts. 2 rules tho, get price 1st, cuz if u pick it, u buy it. He'll pull motors out for $100. Tranny's are usually $150. He always has a few 3rd gens (typically 5 or so on a decent day) on his lot in the GM section... his prices mostly depend on how he feels/how business is.

I hear there are some on 441 too same city, and some in Delray North of Linton, haven't tried those...