Well I got my car running pretty well finally I'm running MSnS-extra fuel only for right now MSI V3.0 software is 29q. I have had alot of problems with the stock small cap dizzy and 8 pin module so I switched it over to a converted points mechanical dizzy and now it's running pretty well. I have alot of tuning to do still but it least I can drive it again. I plan to use the stock ignition again but I wanted to get the rest of the fuel stuff sorted out first. oh this is on a 383 w/AFR 195's and a stealth ram and 30lb injectors.

 

Congratulations!

Took me two weeks to get those settings right. I could do it in five minutes now.

I'm willing to bet your problems lie in your ignition settings. I'm going to ASSUME a couple things.

If using the optoisolater circuit, you want "Rising Edge" for the ignition capture.(VR circuit is opposite)

If using the "high-current ignition driver"(J10 to IGBT IN), you want "Going Low" on your spark output.(using processor port directly is opposite)

Set your timing with a light and the 5volt override off. I'd set it to 10-20 degrees initial. You then enter that advance number into the trigger wizard.

That's it! Verify your timing acts appropriately with a light and you should be set.

If your using the optoisolater, there are some circuit upgrades on the "Ignition" board over at www.msefi.com. They can really help with the 8-pin HEI module. I just use the VR circuit, and it works great.
If you look for "Jim" over on those boards, he can really hook you up with a good MSQ.

 

I did exactly as you said above except you can't choose rising edge with MS1 and also I was not using the high current driver. The main problem I had was that the timing was jumping all over the place with the 5v connected or disconnected. I would get as much as 32 degrees advance while revving the engine with the 5V override disconnected. I'm planning on trying the VR circuit in the next couple of weeks to see how it works. Thanks for the info.

 

If your timing is traveling while the EST is disconnected...

It sounds like the MS is not the problem. At least not the entire problem. Even with my MS settings completly wrong, the module still worked properly when the EST is disconnected.

I'm versed on the MSII/V3.0, but don't know anything about using the MSI.

I would try to rule out mechanical slop, and then go address the msefi board about any other issues. They know their stuff better than anyone.(No offense ThirdGen.org members)

 

+1

When the timing jumps with the 5v disconnected that indicates a mechanical problem. Pizza guy, did you ever get your timing issue resolved?

 

EDIT: Nuts, my timing still wanders, just not as bad. It's still bad enough I can't run proper ignition timing.

Just two days ago!!!!!!!!!!!

I had the "Input capture" backwards. Me--> <--Me

I noticed this with the timing light. As I revved the motor, the timing went the WRONG WAY!! At that point, a couple of neurons in my grey matter when "boink", and everything works like a charm.

Got up to 90mph yesterday! None of the timing maps I have work extremely well, so that's my next adventure. If I could pull an advance map out of a '84 L69 ECM, I would be happier than a pig in mud, but this ECM isn't really supported as it's pretty basic. And the fact I killed the one I have doesn't help much. And anyone reading this whom can help, a VE table while your at it would make me kiss your virtual feet.

Don't lose faith in the MS, 91RamAir. It can do wonders if you give it what it wants.
And yes, scientific progress goes "boink", trust me.

 

You are using tbi correct?

I could pull the ve table out of a newish 91 firebird TBI 305 lol

 

I'm not giving up, even though I am confused I agree that my results with the 8pin dizzy would suggest slop either in the cam, dist gear or timing chain but all are new and the mechanical dizzy i'm running right now works great, except I don't have enough timing and I want electronic control. Could it be possible that what ever the ms is triggering off of is going up with rpm and causing the spark to advance when the revs go up regardless of the settings. I have a scope but I have not traced these signals yet I will probably get to it in the next week or so. By the way Friday night I ran a new best of 13.366@102.01 which is pretty good up here in denver.

 

The bottom line is, it shouldn't advance at all without the 5 volt bypass signal. Did you try swapping ignition modules?

 

I have not tried swapping the module yet but I did have it tested at the local parts store and they said it was fine. I'll also try to swap it out when I get this setup back in.

 

What kinda problems were you having? You never mentioned that, it'll be helpful.

 

With the stock ignition and the MS my timing was jumping all over even with the 5V signal disconnected.

 

That's weird. If it advances when the EST is disconnected, then it almost has to be either the rpm input to the MS(trying the VR circuit will help with this), and/or something wrong in the dizzy itself.

I've seen this exact thing happen when the rpm input was triggering on the wrong side of the signal. Same could happen if the spark output is backwards. I wouldn't rule these out.

Have you checked the end-play of the HEI dizzy shaft? Maybe compare to the end-play of the mechanical dizzy. I'm really grabbing for stuff here, though.

IMO, you should switch over to the VR circuit. Just remember to verify which side of the signal you need before construction. My 7-pin sends a falling edge, however, I remeber GM switched this somewhere along the road. The HEI page over at www.megasquirt.info will tell you what you need to know.

EDIT: After checking over there, I'm 90% sure your module sends a "Falling Edge" signal to the MS.

 

Thanks for the help man that sounds like a plan I'm going to work on it this weekend and hopefully get it up and running properly. As for the end play I shimmed it as per the MS specs. And I have tried both spark output settings, I'm not sure how to change the triggering in MS1 I'll check on that this afternoon. I plan to convert back to spark control today and build the VR circuit for the input. I'll let you guys know how it goes.

 

Ok guys I need some help, I did the mods to convert to use the VR circuit but I don't have any tach signal now. I don't know what is up i did set it up like the manual says for an hei 8pin with the input circuit done to the VR setup in step 51 and 52. I found that I had one trans in backwords Q22 so I replaced it just in case but still no go I don't have an rpm signal in the car or on the stim. Any ideas guys?

 

V3 Troubleshooting

If you can't think of anything that might have happend/looks funny, then this is the procedure to follow. It's pretty straight forward, just follow ALL the steps in order, until it gives you an answer.

Also, make sure you try adjusting R52/R56 pots. I'm about 8 turns from full CCW position on both.

And another note...my $20 ignition module gave me all sorts of fits. Get a borg-warner or GM module, you'll be happy you did.

 

Well I got it figured out finally I ended up using the hall opto circuit because I could not get the VR circuit to work I could never get an RPM signal so I switched back to the hall circuit and figured out after much headache that I had a setting wrong on the dwell page of megatune. But now it's all good and running like a raped ape. thanks for the help guys. I guess I need to post my success story now.