Turbo Fiero... sounds like a blast!

 

Yes, much has been done and tested. Very close now. Basically, still need some waste gate logic, although I'm not sure how important that is. It can be added later.

The MAF reading and conversion to an airflow value is done. Need to code up the routine to use that to create an injector PW and a load value. Note that it requires a high freq MAF such as from an LT1, LS1, LQ4 and so on (stock GN MAF won't work, although it may).

This thing has so many features they are going to be dripping out of the bottom of the ECM.

Can be run SD or MAF, SD with a 1, 2 or 3-bar MAP. Can also run a secondary 1-bar MAP when using a 2 or 3-bar as the primary. The ECM will use the 1-bar when not in boost to provide the best in driveability. Then switch to the 2/3 bar when in boost.

Has a reverse lockout solenoid feature for those running a trans such as a T56. Then the N2O control, PWM alky control, blow-off/re-circ control (allows the use of an inexpensive irrigation valve), spark retard via TCC lockup, and/or MPH, and/or boost, and/or via the 3rd & 4th gear switches in the trans.

Injector firing angle and individual injector fuel trims. A/C compressor control, dual fans, EGR, CCP, A.I.R, all supported. Lean cruise, the list just goes on.

And of course it is a sequential fuel injected ECM (EBL SFI-6 Flash system).

Have some other items that will get added down the road. I need to get the test car back together for that. The ECM firmware is user update-able, so no issues with adding features at a later date.

RBob.

 

Very cool How 'bout the E-trans controller?

 

RBob, that once again sounds like great stuff! I have one question though, how & why would you electronically control a blow-off/recirc valve? or was that in regard to a wastegate/boost control mechanism?

 

The ECM firmware monitors various sensors to know when to open the valve (blow-off or re-circ), then activates the output for it. Can then use an inexpensive valve such as this one:

http://www.tvisupply.com/3-4-Electic...e-p/702072.htm

With it can set it up to just vent (blow-off), or re-circulate the air back into the pipe prior to the turbo (after the MAF if used).

Even though the solenoid is 24 VAC, they work just fine on 12 VDC. And is a whole lot less $$'s then a good vacuum operated blow-off valve.

The other thing is, by controlling it via the ECM, it remains closed except when required to relieve pressure. So boost comes in faster when you hit the go-pedal.

RBob.

 

In time.

RBob.

 

Darn you RBob! Where's the LT-5 version of EBL??

 

man i cannot wait!

 

Rbob, I understand what you said about either venting to atmosphere or recirculation. But this really is just the compressor bypass valve, right? This might not be the right thread for it, but how does the boost (wastegate?) control work? Thx

I don't know too much about the "oddball" LT5, but i'd be positive you could use any kind of fuel injection for it? Thus, with port fuel injection you could prolly just use the P4 EBL. But then again, there's no V8 SFI EBL available yet if i'm not mistaken

 

Yes, the blow-off or re-circ is used to relieve pressure in the pipe between the compressor outlet and throttle blades. This is used during a throttle lift to prevent the compressed air from going back out the compressor.

Waste gate control is used to bypass exhaust gases, which is used to control boost pressure. Can use a solenoid valve T'd into the pressure/vacuum line between the boosted side and the waste gate diaphragm.

As boost builds it applies pressure to the waste gate diaphragm. This opens the actual waste gate and lowers/holds boost. The problem with this is that it also causes the boost to build slowly as the waste gate is being opened before the desired boost level is reached.

By bleeding off this pressure the waste gate stays closed. Then as the desired boost level is approached the solenoid that is bleeding off boost pressure starts to bleed less & less pressure off. Thereby controlling the level of boost.

RBob.

 

yeah i'm familliar with that, but sure can't hurt to point things out so there would be an option for a boost control solenoid and tables of commanded boost (wastegate DC) vs. a couple of parameters?

 

I'm not quite sure how I am going to set up the waste gate control at this moment. Here is why:

With a MAF only set up there is no boost reference for the ECM. Can only use set DC% to the solenoid versus airflow and RPM. It is then up to the tuner to dial these set values in for the proper level of boost.

For a MAP set up can have a table/tables with the desired boost level in them. The ECM can then control the solenoid directly targeting those levels.

Another side is boost versus MPH or even which gear the trans is in. So many different ways to set things up.

Well, I guess I do know what needs to be done. But there is also the user side of things. Need to make it easy enough to tune.

RBob.

 

AYE, gotcha! never messed with a MAF system so far, only speed density never thought about that 'issue' in a forced MAF setup either, hmm.. anyways, interesting info here

 

Rbob, my AFR-headed 383 TBI runs very nice, but in open loop, it runs too rich and need a lot of fuel.. Which values should i change to get an "economy open loop" ?

 

This table provides the base AFR in open loop:

Open Loop - AFR vs RPM & VAC

Note that it is by vacuum in KPa, not MAP.

This table then modifies the base AFR dependent upon CTS:

Open Loop - AFR Multiplier vs CTS

Note that it is a multiplier, so a negative value is making the AFR richer (lower AFR).

RBob.

 

So, what all is required to be done to an EBL Flash for he port mod? Is it possible with an already-converted ECM? I'd like to go to MPFI sometime in the future, probably TPI since that's the only one I know of wih an EGR valve (that or a Vortec intake, though I'm not entirely sure how that system works just yet). I won't necessarily need the EGR to be functional, just there to look like it is.

 

Note that an EBL Flash w/a Port Mod can't be used on TBI. So need to be committed to the TPI/MPFI system when getting a Port Modded EBL Flash.

All you need to do is ship the EBL Flash ECM (+funds) to us to install the Port Mod. In a day or so it will be shipped back to you. For testing we flash in a MPFI calibration, so be sure that you have any calibrations you want to keep saved on your laptop/PC.

RBob.

 

Sounds good, I just wasn't 100% clear after reading the site. The truck would be parked when I send the computer in, so that's no biggie. I think I'm about to the limit of the two injectors without a VAFPR. I lowered the pressure to 18psi and it will idle in closed loop fine now, but I still have a strange surging at light throttle (about 20% map), typically it only happens on a slight downhill slope, when it only needs just enough to keep its speed. I thought lowering pressure would stop it, but it hasn't. Any suggestions?

 

May be the proportional gains. Look at the 1/4 graph in the WUD surging this time. See if the surging coincides with the O2 signal. If so then check the INT, it should be steady. If the INT is moving then there isn't enough proportional gain (unless there is way too much proportional gain).

If the INT is steady then reduce the proportional gain at that airflow. Use this table:

PRP - Gain Muliplier vs Airflow

The other thing to look at is if the ECM is going into and out of async mode. This would be from the PW getting small. I set the async transitions to zero to prevent this:

INJ - ASync Transition PW - TBI Only

RBob.

 

It took me a minute to figure out what you meant by 1/4 graph, but I realize what you mean now. I've attached roughly a 35 second portion from the log where I was able to duplicate the issue (apparently it's an invalid file for the forum... nevermind, I'll just email it). The WBO2 reading goes from very lean to somewhat rich. If you need me to I could email my current bin file. I also thought I'd already zeroed the ASync PW values, but hadn't. They are now, though it looks like it isn't the issue. I'm guessing it's the PRP gains, because it did it before reducing fuel pressure and I thought it would stop the issue.

 

Just zip the file to post it here. Looking at it I'd venture to guess that the injector offset compensation values are too low. As the fuel pressure is increased it takes longer for the injector to open. By the looks of the log the injector PW is getting small enough that the injectors don't open.

The AFR goes up, the INT goes up, and as the RPM falters the dMAP AE comes in.

There by making the AFR drop, RPMs go up, INT falls, the PW gets small again, and the cycle starts all over again.

You will want to increase the values in this table:

INJ - Injector Correction Offset

Side note, when creating a CSV file for Excel, check the single header box.

RBob.

 

That seems strange about the injector still not opening, I would've thought it was fine down to 18lbs. because it idles ok in open loop now. What are your suggestions for injector offset based on what it's currently set at?

 

I took a look at your close loop idle file - have couple of questions....

Your idle SA seems very low - about 6 to 10 deg. Is that correct?? On my 383 I run 16 to 20 deg.

IAC counts a bit on a high side 38 to 40 counts. As you bump SA up IAC counts will come down to maintain idle speed.

Injector PW is around 1.2 to 1.4 mSec - injector should be able to open and close with fuel pressure set at 18 PSI, but anything else watch out!! VRFPR is a way to get around idle issues by reducing FP at idle (I drop down to about 9-10 PSI VAC=35 kPa and 20 PSI at 90 to 100 kPa).

//RF

 

I'm gonna jump in here. Just ordered my EBL.Should be here next week. I'm sure I'll have several questions. Mine is a bit different. ITs TBI on a 1967 buick 340. In a 1975 IHC scout rock crawler/off road rig. With a fair amount of machining, we managed to graft a chevy TBI dizzy into a stock points buick dizzy and make it all work. It runs ok on a stock TBI tune, but far from great, and the CEL on from no EGR and such. I'm hoping to do some things like wire the A/c request into my On board air compressor pressure switch to get like 1200-1400rpm idle when the compressor kicks on, as well as maybe a manual fast idle switch for winching. The motor is a stock 4bbl 340, but with lower compression pistons for pump gas. Stock was i believe somewhere in the 240hp/365tq range. Its a torque monster for a heavy 4x4 and 37" tires.

I hope to go back and read most of this thread and get some good info.

 

Once you get the EBL stuff you'll see there is actually a wire you can hook up for a high idle, you won't have to use the AC

 

I saw that in the wiring diagram on the site. But using both would allow me to set specific RPM for each. Would be very cool.

 

Hi All,
Sorry, I tried to post here yesterday but I couldn't... I finally figured out that it was because I had changed my email address.... Anyway

I installed EBL a while back. I got it mostly OK and never really went too far with it. It never has felt perfect but it was OK. I just had my first tailpipe test with the computer in and failed for hydrocarbons

Please take a look at this for me an point me in the right direction

FYI, the engine is basically stock TBI with headers and a heated O2 sensor.



Looks like I can't attach a compressed .DAT file, (too big) I will email it to anyone interested..

Thanks guys

 

Generally, running rich, late timing, or a bad cat.
Look closely at your logs for the range in which they test.

 

hey guys
this is my first efi car so this is a little new. first off i was wanting to know what you are using to hook up to a computer. so i can start doing this i have a spare ecu so i wont fry mine. also i want to learn to do this and you guy are the best so i figgured i would ask.

thanks

 

With the EBL systems the data interface cable is included. If you are connecting via the ALDL connector will need an ALDL cable (www.moates.net among others).

If your RS is still TBI can use WinALDL or Tuner Pro RT to log & view with on the laptop.

RBob.

 

Reading the comparison test done by rBob with the 369 ICM, having the incorrect ICM,{if thats the right way to word it}, would this cause an up and down swing in the SA on the WUD? I don't have a log file to tell how much and how high and low it swings, truck, currently not running. Thanks

 

Looking for thoughts or ideas on intake manifolds.
“75” 4 bolt block 9.5:1 compression (non TBI RV Cam can't remeber the specs currently)
194 cast iron heads ported and polished gasket matched.
89 TBI 7477 ECM running EBL with 14 psi fuel pressure
Currently running the 89 TBI intake modified to bolt to my cast iron heads.
I have recently acquired an RPM Air Gap manifold and was wondering if anyone has used this with the EBL and were there any performance gains/loss or other issues using this manifold? Since the Air Gap does not have a provision for an EGR will this affect anything with the GREAT mileage I am now enjoying?
Since converting my truck to fuel injection from a carb…… I have doubled my MPG from 10 to 21 MPG. All I can say is wow…. This is with running the TH400 in it now….. looking for a good 700R4 for the next project just to see what the mileage will end up…………..
Thanks for your input
Cruz

 

squirrel, not sure how I missed this one. Yes & no to the SA swings. The latency in the ICM will not be reflected in the ECM's calculated SA. It will be seen at the crank with a timing light.

If the SA up/down is at idle, it is most likely the idle stabilization SA corrections. Can zero out the two tables to prevent the ECM from trying to prevent a rolling idle speed.

RBob.

 

Air gap intakes are not a good choice with TBI. They run too cold. I would imagine that the mileage is going to drop, and not from lack of EGR. They require lots of AE.

To be honest, I don't think that a Performer RPM Air Gap is the proper choice for your engine (TBI or not).

Mostly due to the RV cam which is used to build torque at low RPM.

RBob.

 

i just got an ebl flash for my 91 camaro. it has a 350 from a 90 burb. i installed the ebl and selected a california truck bin. engine is all stock. i started the car up and it ran like straight ****. any ideas why?

 

key on engine off the CE light should blink and then stay solid on. Once engine started it should go off. Is this what you are seeing?

 

What was running it before ?
Can you copy that tune as a place to start ?
As Ronny asks, any error codes ?
What is the What'sUp display telling you ?

 

weres the ce light at and what would it mean if it did blink?

 

The CE lighr is he service engine light.

 

yea i stayed on till i started it then it went away

 

should be OK then. means you are runnin off a good .bin.

 

This may sound basic, but are the plug wires in the coreect order?

 

55#.hr injectors on a 350.

RBob.

 

Adding a supercharger and instead of using the FMU just got proper injectors. Going from 30lb to 60lb injectors with a HSR. After adjusting the BPC should anything be done to the VE tables before startup????

 

ok so now i have the correct bin and i changed the bpc-bpc vs.vac because i have the 305 injectors in right now but will swap out soon. but when i try to flash the changed bin it ALWAYS says failed. im stumped

 

Is the ignition on but car not running. Is the cable hooked up between your computer and the EBL. Those are the 2 common reasons for a "failed flash".

 

keys are in and ignition on and the cable is hooked up and transmitting data to wud. still wont flash

 

Nothing with the VE tables. Good with the BPC changes. Be sure to add a 2 or 3 bar MAP sensor and let the calibration know. 2-bar being good to 15 psi.

Also best to get the injector compensation values and fill in the tables. Then set the single fire PW transitions.

Note that the EBL Classic is only OK with the 2 bar MAP, and only EBL Flash firmware v 2.2 has the single fire mode.

RBob.

 

If you are using a USB/Serial adapter cable follow the instructions at this link:

www.dynamicefi.com/USB2SerialSetup.php

If at the last screen there are sliders in place of a latency setting, that cable isn't going to work. It uses the Prolific chipset which either works all of the time, works part of the time, or works none of the time.

Recommend using the USB/serial adapter cables the use the FTDI chipset.

RBob.

 

there is a phone cable that can connect into the back of the laptop. could i use that?